His Man and Merry Queer, Korea's first LGBT dating/reality programs

[Shaandenigma]

4 minutes ago, WujuLike said:

my problem with merry queer is that both of the lesbian couples they showed had one woman who was very femme and one who was very butch/masculine presenting. this is only furthering stereotypes that gay and lesbian couples have one person who is the "man" or "wears the pants" in the relationship.

however, this is still obviously a big step forward for korea and i am glad this show exists.

I haven't seen Merry Queer yet, but I thought one half of one of the couples was trans?

[Shaandenigma]

As annoying as the Changmin obsession is, it's incredibly realistic that when left to their own devices, people would gravitate towards him since he's the most conventionally masculine and any gay man trying to date knows how prized masculine-presenting and straight-passing men are.

I think the producers could have done a better job in structuring the show in such a way to force them to have to intermingle more with each other at least the first few days then let them gravitate towards who they have a connection with. Like I feel people keep trying it with Changmin even though he's clearly only interested in Jeonghyeon at this point because they haven't had the opportunity to have a date with him. It would also help the guys the others look over have an opportunity to challenge first impressions. I also think it would just help them have more interactions overall rather than just sitting in a room together scrolling their phones and getting in their own heads.

 

[Shaandenigma]

1 hour ago, Dont mind me said:

I agree with @Shaandenigma this is really typical of gay dating life, especially if there is only one top masculine guy around. 

As others have said, it's getting annoying that they are so focused on either changmin or Hyeokjun. 

I genuinely thought I saw a connection between changyu and seonyul, but maybe the age difference is causing some issues. But the boy is soo adorable, I am just baffled that he is not getting noticed at all. 

Now having seen the full episode, I have a lot more thoughts about the show and its players. The Hyeokjun fixation makes sense because he's been on the most dates with different guys. All the calls he's gotten have been from guys who went on dates with him. He and Changmin had that date before they got to the house which is why they called each other the first night. Eunchan had eyes on him from the beginning and then asked him on a date that went well from his vantage point so he's continuing to pursue the guy he likes who hasn't shot him down. Hyeon also went on the most spectacular date in terms of activity with Hyeokjun that went well and hasn't been given any indication that Hyeokjun doesn't like him. So those two consistently calling him is reasonable. And Hyeokjun deciding to call Changmin after evaluating his other connections is also reasonable. Considering how clean-cut and vanilla Hyeokjun is in his presentation and how he carries himself, I think aesthetic and personality-wise, Changmin would be the most compatible total package for what he's probably looking for.

Now when I look at who called Changmin, only one sticks out as being frustrating and that's Seonyul. Jeongho gets a pass because he just got there, spent the entire day with Eunchan which was awkward and has nothing else to go off of for the others except appearances. Hyeokjun did have meaningful interaction with him and did get a call from him. Jeonghyeon and him have the deepest connection so far built from being the pair that spends the most time together talking to each other. But what has happened between Seonyul and Changmin for the former to even think he has a shot at this stage? Changmin has never called him. They haven't been on a date. The one interaction he thinks they had was him trying to flirt with Changmin while they were in the kitchen, and Changmin brushing it off to focus on Jeonghyeon. He's thinking that if he has the chance to properly shoot his shot something can happen there. And what makes it more aggravating is that he's trying to ward off Changyu so that he looks available to Changmin, but is also still stringing him along to have as a fallback. He just really irks me now to the point that I want Changyu to just drop it and move on. I hope he and Jeongho bond over not getting calls and become a thing.

I also don't like the BL-fan segment of the audience trying to turn Changmin into a fuqboi now just because like 4 different guys are interested in and he doesn't know what to do about it. For one, it's literally only been 3 days in the show, no one is in love yet. Infatuated, yes, but not in love. Second, he can't help that other people find him attractive for being handsome, nice, and polite. He's not responsible for other people's choices. I also don't think he's conflicted as much as he feels super awkward having people really into him when he's into someone else. The way people think he could be questioning his connection to Jeonghyeon when he threw himself onto Jeonghyeon's spot on Jeonghyeon's bed for each call he answered while making the most confident call to Jeonghyeon is just mind-boggling.

I can't settle on what the producers' intentions were beyond just documenting how gay men date in reality because sometimes they are very hands-off where it feels like the guys are aimless and wasting time doing nothing. But then they do things to like the room swap next episode to stir things up like they really want couples to come out of the show. On the one hand as someone who watches a lot of other reality dating shows, it's refreshing to watch something that doesn't feel orchestrated to create the most drama and "storylines." But I also feel like at times no one is actually dating or trying to build a romantic connection with how they are able to retreat away and not interact with the people they like despite that they are all living under the same roof with a bunch of free time.

 

[Shaandenigma]

On 8/7/2022 at 3:59 PM, Dont mind me said:

[...] because of his shy/introvert personality he also doesn't know how to handle that level of direct attention. This is where I believe the producers should have stepped in and help him and move the story along. I look forward to the room swap, perhaps there will be more interaction between the others. 

But the story is moving along in the direction of more conflict which ups the stakes and makes for better TV. Changmin, the most desirable man, chose to call Jeonghyeon who has not gotten a single other call up to this point. This gives Jeonghyeon a boost of confidence. Then after this, Changmin gets a call from Hyeokjun, the first guy he called who has called him twice. So now he conflicted because he has two guys he feels a connection to, and another guy he probably has no interest in (Seonyul) that his friend likes that he has to figure out how to turn down. And now they are gonna compete for the chance to rearrange the rooms and no one has any reason to keep them as they are. Also, people weren't confined to their rooms for this round of calls and are finding out who called who. But when it comes out that Hyeokjun called Changmin again, that's going to cause a lot of friction with like half the house. I also have a strong hunch Changyu and Jeongho will get closer based on the one promo photo of them together and what happened last ep. So I'm excited to see what goes down this week!

11 hours ago, AstroBaby said:

Yeah, I feel like they wanted to go with a Terrace House type vibe of slow building relationships and natural everyday interactions ( likely in part to push back against the overly-sexual perception of gay men) but the thing with Terrace House and other 'true love' type reality shows is that they take place over months at a time which allows for those bonds to develop. Over just a week without much producer intervention they're just going to awkwardly gravitate towards the first person they find attractive/talk to, a reality show over that time frame needs more gamification in order to create big moments.

I do find this only being a week odd especially when they aren't like totally secluded away. They probably didn't have the budget to film longer than that though especially for what would be a controversial show. But I don't necessarily want the guys to be manipulated into relationships that make for good TV. I just wish they were given more things to do that prompted more conversation or doing things together. Or if they casted more outgoing and proactive personalities, lol.

[Shaandenigma]

8 minutes ago, Dont mind me said:

I saw this in the last episode, he is finally more confident and speaks up. But i still want more directing from the producers to move things along. We only have few more episodes due to those conservative assholes. 

Have you seen the extra clips they release? Because there were a lot of other developments that happened during the last ep that they didn't include that suggest a major shift in the next couple of eps. Like in the one released today showed that the Changmin changed the sleeping arrangements in the quad room so that he and Jeonghyeon are sharing a bed and he said he did that because he has the highest affinity for Jeonghyeon out of the three. And since he kept throwing himself on Jeonghyeon's bed during the phone calls, that switch probably happened beforehand. But it’s in this trailer for the next ep so who knows. But it’s definitely spicing things up ahead of the room swap:

there is a translated transcript in the comments.

Editing to add I think something could develop with Jeongho and Changyu since they were in a promo photo together and have been hanging around each other, now sharing a bed for at least a night.

 

Edited August 10, 2022 by Shaandenigma

[Shaandenigma]

Well they sure delivered on the drama with these last two eps going into the finale. Glad they finally showed Changmin being straightforward and speaking plainly about where his attention is and that it's all on Jeonghyeon so people can stop riding his ass about everything. He was the only one not playing games.

Unlike Hyeokjun who I do not understand the appeal that has half the cast obsessed with him. He was basically either the number one or two choice. He's also a waffler and actively flirts with all the people courting him even though you know he doesn't actually like them, he likes the attention. Seonyul annoys me too but I can't blame him for being upset about Hyeokjun and Jeongho rooming together after that date they had and Hyeokjun made it seem like he really did reciprocate Seonyul's feelings. Seonyul shouldn't have dragged Changyu into that mess though and should be confronting Hyeokjun instead of snapping at Jeongho.

I think Jeongho is playing himself going all in on Hyeokjun. They have nothing in common, I could not imagine Hyeokjun being at a Kiki ball or vibing with the Hokeep persona at all. And based on what he said he finds attractive about him, I feel like he thinks he's a blank slate he can project his ideal husband onto. I also would have been put off by Hyeokjun saying his ideal type is someone who likes him more than he likes them. I think Jeongho is more compatible with Changyu but if he's not feeling it, then he's not feeling it. But to pass over someone who checks off all your boxes for a guy who is just going to be after the next hot guy who looks his way is... a choice.

I like Hyeon, but he's a messy bitch. I think it's just for the show though.

[Shaandenigma]

11 hours ago, K-Poppie said:

Happy for them, but I wonder how exactly this works? Like, what is the legality/validity/legitimacy of their marriage and how does it apply to them as South Korean citizens? Did either of them have some kind of American citizenship to get a marriage license? A Chinese gay couple I followed also obtained a marriage license from Taiwan, despite having Chinese citizenship and living in China, so I wonder how these kinds of marriage laws work(For example, a legally married same-sex couple visiting/travelling to countries that prohibit same-sex relations)…

You don't need to be a citizen to get a marriage license in the U.S. You can present a passport and whatever other documents required by the specific state (since they have different requirements) from your home country. However if the marriage violates the public policy of your home country it won't automatically be considered valid there. However, South Korea is part of the Hague Convention like the U.S. and those member nations recognize the legality of public documents from other member nations. I don't think they'd get the rights that came with marriage in Korea though. If they were to get divorced though, they would have to file in the U.S. 

[Shaandenigma]

I think people need to stop projecting their own feelings and disappointment as "fans" onto Changmin and Jeonghyeon and how they are making their own decisions about how to proceed or not with their own relationship. It also bothers me how their shippers act as though Jeonghyeon has zero agency and no responsibility for his own feelings and default to make him the victim to "Bug Bad Changmin." Maybe Jeonghyeon doesn't feel "used" because he isn't being used? Anyone who goes on dating show is doing it in part for the exposure and not because it's the most successful way to find true love (they fail way more often than they succeed on that front). The show only stopped airing 4 days ago. With how quick their shippers are to flip on them, I don’t blame them on delaying the fury and not immediately being like "hey y'all we aren't in a committed relationship." 

It was clear to me in this last SIX hour live they did where they were drinking and talking about sex, that they still have feelings for each other and are in a situationship. And even if they were over each other, we as viewers aren't owed the resolution we want and don't have a right to feel "deceived" about how they decide to lead their personal lives. We saw edited footage from a week they spent in a bubble four months ago. These aren't characters in a real life BL. As a 31 year old gay man I found the show very relatable and an accurate portrayal of the reality of gay dating which is what the producers set out to do.  

[Shaandenigma]

1 hour ago, rainbow halo said:

Anyway I feel like many people are trying to make Changmin seem like a snake or something but I just don't see it. Junghyun isn't some poor damsel, he has also "deceived" fans into thinking they were dating just like Changmin.

Yeah, Changmin got a lot of unwarranted hate. Like it wasn’t his fault a bunch of guys were obsessed with him when he literally only ever expressed interest in Hyeokjun and Jeonghyeon, and he took the initiative to tell Hyeokjun that he like Jeonghyeon more and was no longer interested. Meanwhile, reciprosexual Hyeokjun had just as many guys after him the entire time and strung them all along up until the very end while also having another guy waiting in the wings off the show. But even I can't blame him too much because they only knew each other for a week (less for Hyeon and Jeongho who came in late). I also think based on this recent live that Changmin didn't want to room with Jeonghyeon because he was afraid they'd rush into getting physical which would have made everything messier if they didn't work out. Changmin is shy, but at least he is direct and considerate of his partner's needs and is willing to put them ahead of his wants if he feels he can't meet them. He felt bad that he had to focus in his business and was always late to their dates and decided not to keep Jeonghyeon tied down with that. I can't see how he's a bad guy in this situation.

1 hour ago, sureyeahiguess said:

Truth. The fans on twitter are talking foolishness today. These people only lived together for a WEEK. They barely had time to because friendly, let alone develop a serious romantic relationship. It's insane to become so invested in any "couple" we saw form on the show.

I'm guessing Changmin and Jeonghyeon are FWB, I got those vibes from them during the live. Like I said previously, I think Changmin finds Jeonghyeon young and probably immature (not in a negative way), which makes sense because he is 19!!! There is definitely sexual chemistry there, and Jeonghyeon definitely seems like he has a crush on him, but I don't think Changmin is interested at all in a romantic, long-term relationship with him. 

Also, all the people yelling about using the show for clout....uhhhhh ya think??? And they will continue to create content with one another, and good for them. They should try and build off the show and get paid while they still can.

Honestly, people had too high expectations for the show. Like I said, dating shows produce way more failed relationships than they do successful ones. And gays already have an uphill battle in the dating arena especially in a conservative place like Korea where you can legally lose your house and your job for being gay. All these guys took a major risk coming on this show so if they want to leverage the positive attention to boost their careers, more power to them. Because love alone doesn't pay the bills lol.

From what I've seen of Changmin outside of the show, I think he's LTR oriented but also very attuned to wanting to be able to meet his partner's needs and the type to not pursue anything if he doesn't feel he has his shit together enough. The food service industry is very competitive and takes a lot of work. So I fully believe he really doesn't have the time to invest in a serious relationship the way he wants to. I also don't think they've done anything yet, but will eventually if they keep hanging around each other because Jeonghyeon is determined in that naive sort of way gay guys his age who only pursue older men are (speaking as a former one myself lol). Like I had to shake my head when he said he'd let a guy cheat on him once when he was in tears after Changmin didn't pick him to share a room and then had to spy on him and Hyeon like there was even a chance they'd do something. He fronts at being like a cool boy who is so understanding (but is really willing to just be a doormat) and I think Changmin sees through that and is trying to spare him. But it's failing. I'm just glad Jeonghyeon is fixated on a guy like Changmin rather than one of the plethora of other sleazebags who'd take advantage of his naivete without a second thought.

[Shaandenigma]

Man the post show drama is jucier than anything that happened on the show to the point they should collab with MTV and do spin off "His Ex" and put these guys all back in the house again to hash their stuff out, lol.

But in all seriousness, the shippers with this show are on a whole other level with the way they insert themselves and stir the pot. They are working overtime to turn this Changmin and Jeonghyeon thing into a much bigger deal than it is to the point those two should just tell them where to shove it and just hash out their stuff in private.