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About the N word in songs

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I was listening to a song on twitter where almost every sentence had the N word, so it came to my mind some people saying that non-black people can't say it even if it's part of a song... Doesn't it feel kinda... dumb? It's like you're doing music for just one people. If it was a social critic or to specify it's about black men I wouldn't find it weird, but it wanst it.

Btw, I'm a mixed person, I just am not an american black person so I have a lot of doubts about this whole N word thing. This may sound like a stupid argument but debates can improve the thinking. I hope we can have a civilized talk here

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the most consistent (and to me, logical) reasoning is simply that when a non-black person says the n word, they aren’t subverting it for their own reclamation of power.  it just doesn’t have that connotation like it does in black communities.  so rather than subverting or reclaiming, the use of that word amongst non-black folks instead feels like a remnant of its racist roots.

as for black artists making music for black people specifically, of course it doesn’t mean more demographics won’t or aren’t allowed to listen to it, but if the artist wants to share their own experience and social commentary as it relates to being black or even specifically target their music to a black audience, why not?  

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42 minutes ago, love said:

the most consistent (and to me, logical) reasoning is simply that when a non-black person says the n word, they aren’t subverting it for their own reclamation of power.  it just doesn’t have that connotation like it does in black communities.  so rather than subverting or reclaiming, the use of that word amongst non-black folks instead feels like a remnant of its racist roots.

as for black artists making music for black people specifically, of course it doesn’t mean more demographics won’t or aren’t allowed to listen to it, but if the artist wants to share their own experience and social commentary as it relates to being black or even specifically target their music to a black audience, why not?  

it's the first time I read a reasonable reason to non-black not say it, thanks

your point is valid and I agree, but if you're gonna stone a non-black for singing it, why? you know what I mean? it happened before with idols, they got so much shit just for singing a sentence with the n word... my point isn't "don't use it in songs" or "don't target a community", it just seems unfair somehow in this specific situation?

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Posted (edited)

Nonblack people have never had a claim to that word, and in the instance of singing it in a song, it's really not that hard to just not sing that word. It's a small inconvenience that is much better than using a slur or directly hurting black people's attempt to repurpose a historically offensive word. 

Edit: I'm nonblack tho so I'm not like the most reputable source this is just what I know

Edited by bubblegumgirl801
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From my knowledge a lot of fans esp white hip hop fans from what i can tell fill it in with another word like maybe..

 

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Posted (edited)

It's literally just a word.

This whole idea of black people having to reclaim it or white people enforcing some sort of racist voodoo by using the word in verbatim is stupid and literally a made up fairytale. 

If that were really the case then they shouldn't have an issue with non-whites saying it because they've never had that 'power' over black people.

Again, just a word. 

Edited by Iljin Oppa
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It's like what almost everyone has said. 

As a black American, we don't like when non-black people use that word because it's like why. I don't even like that word. I hate it. When black artists say it in their songs, they're mainly speaking to their black family and friends. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Iljin Oppa said:

It's literally just a word.

This whole idea of black people having to reclaim it or white people enforcing some sort of racist voodoo by using the word in verbatim is stupid and literally a made up fairytale. 

If that were really the case then they shouldn't have an issue with non-whites saying it because they've never had that 'power' over black people.

Again, just a word. 

Racial slurs are "just words" too. Like, do you go around referring to certain people as racial slurs because they're  "just words"? Or are you a decent human being who knows that sometimes, words have a negative (and sometimes heavy) history and meaning behind it?

 

Edited by frozentear
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1 hour ago, Iljin Oppa said:

It's literally just a word.

This whole idea of black people having to reclaim it or white people enforcing some sort of racist voodoo by using the word in verbatim is stupid and literally a made up fairytale. 

If that were really the case then they shouldn't have an issue with non-whites saying it because they've never had that 'power' over black people.

Again, just a word. 

you're an odd invidiual. like you're seriously weird and most likely not black so you have no right to speak this way about us. it's not that hard to not speak on topics you don't know shit about.

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7 minutes ago, frozentear said:

Racial slurs are "just words" too. Do you go around calling people racial slurs because they're  "just words"? Sometimes, words have a heavy history and meaning behind it.

 

So are swear words. Do you go around saying swear words and calling people them? Most people do. They're also historically used to demean people but most of the time you don't get put through a holy inquisition for saying them. 

That's a completely different matter anyways. You completely glossed over the 'in verbatim' in my sentence. Singing along to a song isn't calling anyone a racial slur, you're literally just singing a word and most of the time don't event think about. Most of the people who probably listen to songs with those type of lyrics actually appreciate Black culture and are hence, allies. Do you want to crucify Koreans every time they say 'naega' just because it sounds like the n-word? No. People are so obtuse about the concept of intentions. 

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2 minutes ago, lialea said:

you're an odd invidiual. like you're seriously weird and most likely not black so you have no right to speak this way about us. it's not that hard to not speak on topics you don't know shit about.

It's so funny when people want to exclude people from discussions just because it 'doesnt involve them'. You're expecting me to abide by these stupid rules and double-standards you guys are inventing so it does in fact involve me and everyone else you're trying to exclude. I'm not going to censor myself just because someone wants to get offended by me when I don't have the intention of doing so.

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Just now, Iljin Oppa said:

It's so funny when people want to exclude people from discussions just because it 'doesnt involve them'. You're expecting me to abide by these stupid rules and double-standards you guys are inventing so it does in fact involve me and everyone else you're trying to exclude. I'm not going to censor myself just because someone wants to get offended by me when I don't have the intention of doing so.

It literally does not involve you. I suggest you quit trying to be edgy before you say the word around the wrong person and Lord knows what'll happen to you.

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11 minutes ago, Iljin Oppa said:

Most of the people who probably listen to songs with those type of lyrics actually appreciate Black culture and are hence, allies.

ALLIES? biggest lie ever told. if you're implying you're an ally, what you're saying right now literally proves that you aren't.

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Black people make music that is usually targeted towards those within their own community so why would they not use a reclaimed slur???
Tho they can’t control who some of their audience is, this non-black audience can simple not say the slur like a normal person. It is not that hard.

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, Iljin Oppa said:

So are swear words. Do you go around saying swear words and calling people them? Most people do. They're also historically used to demean people but most of the time you don't get put through a holy inquisition for saying them. 

That's a completely different matter anyways. You completely glossed over the 'in verbatim' in my sentence. Singing along to a song isn't calling anyone a racial slur, you're literally just singing a word and most of the time don't event think about. Most of the people who probably listen to songs with those type of lyrics actually appreciate Black culture and are hence, allies. Do you want to crucify Koreans every time they say 'naega' just because it sounds like the n-word? No. People are so obtuse about the concept of intentions. 

Nope, but a swear word can be used to refer to anything and it doesn't have a heavy negative historical context to certain people who are still being affected by racism today. 

While singing the n word with a song doesn't exactly make someone a racist, it does make them ignorant (though some people are truly ignorant). And no, I don't crucify the Koreans for saying a word from their language (just like I don't crucify Spanish people for saying 'black' in theirs). Also, there are a lot of people who "appreciate black culture" but don't like black people at all...and I mean A LOT. "Appreciating black culture" or liking hip hop and R&B doesn't mean they're allies to black people at all.

Edited by frozentear

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7 minutes ago, lialea said:

It literally does not involve you. I suggest you quit trying to be edgy before you say the word around the wrong person and Lord knows what'll happen to you.

You're telling me not to do something so it does involve me?

How am I being edgy? It's not like I'm going around calling every Black person I meet the word nor am I condoning that type of behaviour.  This topic is literally about singing along to songs with the word in it. 

There's no middle ground with you is there?

1 minute ago, lialea said:

ALLIES? biggest lie ever told. if you're implying you're an ally, what you're saying right now literally proves that you aren't.

Yes, I believe in the equality of all races. I don't believe Black people are inferior to any other races and support all of their fights against racism and oppression. 

With that said, do I think someone saying the n-word in verbatim  is racist? No. Frankly, I don't think people using the word as an insult is necessarily racist either. Intentions are what matters.

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5 minutes ago, Iljin Oppa said:

With that said, do I think someone saying the n-word in verbatim  is racist? No. Frankly, I don't think people using the word as an insult is necessarily racist either. Intentions are what matters.

I don't agree. It's not as black and white as you're making it seem. What I have a bigger problem with is how you're trying to speak over actual black people.

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2 minutes ago, frozentear said:

Nope, but a swear word can be used to refer to anything and it doesn't have a heavy negative historical context to certain people who are still being affected by racism today. 

While singing the n word with a song doesn't make someone a racist, it does make them ignorant (though some people are truly ignorant). And no, I don't crucify the Koreans for saying a word from their language (just like I don't crucify Spanish people for saying 'black' in theirs). Also, there are a lot of people who "appreciate black culture" but don't like black people at all...and I mean A LOT. "Appreciating black culture" or liking hip hop and R&B doesn't mean they're allies to black people at all.

And so what if it has history? A Black person doesn't lose a dollar or get a limb cut off every time it's said. It's literally just a word and any sociological effects it is implied to have are literally just pseudoscience. 

Someone can be completely be aware of the historical context and sing along to a rap/hiphop song without intending any ill-will towards Black people. I would say that's the case most of the time. How does that make them ignorant?  

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Posted (edited)

Let's be real...The whole reclaiming concept is relatively new.

Because the Black Americans who actually lived during the periods of segregation and the generation right afterwards don't tend to like using or hearing the N word in their songs. They tend to drag younger generations for using it so much.

Personally, I feel black artists should stop using the word so much. There's no purpose for it. Plus is it really helping any cause truly? It just makes their non-black fans even more confuse. Especially foreigners. And inevitably will lead to some of them slipping up by accident while singing or talking. 

Edited by satoori
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12 minutes ago, lialea said:

I don't agree. It's not as black and white as you're making it seem. What I have a bigger problem with is how you're trying to speak over actual black people.

I'm literally just stating my opinion, how is it speaking over Black people? You and other Black people have spoken plenty about it on this thread. The only person who has been spoken over is me, by you, who was trying to make it out as if my opinion didn't matter.

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1 minute ago, Iljin Oppa said:

And so what if it has history? A Black person doesn't lose a dollar or get a limb cut off every time it's said. It's literally just a word and any sociological effects it is implied to have are literally just pseudoscience. 

Someone can be completely be aware of the historical context and sing along to a rap/hiphop song without intending any ill-will towards Black people. I would say that's the case most of the time. How does that make them ignorant?  

A history that still has after effects to this day. And so what if they "don't lose a dollar or get a limb cut off" every time it's said. Doesn't happen with the other stuff either.

Saying a word that most black people don't like for another race to use is ignorant. Informal use of ignorant is (for copy/paste definition) "discourteous or rude".

What I mean by the "truly ignorant" is people who don't know anything about the meaning of the n word.

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Posted (edited)

I'm just legitimately confused as to why do yall wanna say it so bad? Is ya great great ancestor slave master fester's gene finally coming out of hibernation?

Like I seriously am so confused as to why yall are so hard up on saying that word so bad lol... why is it soooo hard for ya'll to just not say it or fill it in with another word? Explain that to me..

yall write essays upon essays on why you should be allowed to say it.. FOR WHY?! lol why do ya'll want to say it SO BAD lol.. yall baffle me.. everyone who are against yall saying it are the ones in the wrong correct? yall some fucking weirdos but I been knew..

One thing I notice is if it's any other culture saying yo.. we don't want ya'll doing this or that this is ours.. yall are fine with it but woo chillay let it be black culture and yall go in the paint hard as to why black people dont own shit and don't run shit and ain't never gonna tell yall shit.. yall really be telling on yourselves and you don't even realize it lol..

Edited by MelanatedBeauty
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Posted (edited)
59 minutes ago, Iljin Oppa said:

I'm literally just stating my opinion, how is it speaking over Black people? You and other Black people have spoken plenty about it on this thread. The only person who has been spoken over is me, by you, who was trying to make it out as if my opinion didn't matter.

Keep being delusional.

Someday you'll learn. Bless your little heart.

Edited by lialea
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21 minutes ago, MelanatedBeauty said:

One thing I notice is if it's any other culture saying yo.. we don't want ya'll doing this or that this is ours.. yall are fine with it but woo chillay let it be black culture and yall go in the paint hard as to why black people dont own shit and don't run shit and ain't never gonna tell yall shit.. yall really be telling on yourselves and you don't even realize it lol..

literally LOL

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40 minutes ago, lialea said:

literally LOL

bruh they literally feel entitled to everything black (afflictions inclusive but we ain't gonna get into that repulsive tea).. it's not even funny how obsessed these people are. You ain't never gonna see none of these same people in here telling no ashkenazi jew, no indian, etc.. the back washed shit they're in here saying.

 

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