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Dr. Stein, the author of Jung’s Map of the Soul: An Introduction, talks about BTS, their UN speech and their upcoming album Map Of The Soul: PERSONA

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In her latest podcast "Interviews with Jungian Analysts" Laura London talks to Murray Stein, Ph.D. whose book Jung’s Map of the Soul: An Introduction, published by Open Court in 1998, is currently a #1 Best Seller due to its recognition by the band BTS.

 

 

 

Q: If we are identifying with only one of the masks we wear then would you say that we are not in touch with the Self, that we abandoned it?

 

A: It's possible, yeah, it's possible. Optimal is that you can play the role consciously, more or less consciously, without losing yourself in it and without identifying with it.

 

And I was quite impressed by Kim Namjoon, RM as he is called, I guess he is the leader of the BTS group, when he spoke at the United Nations, Generation Unlimited speech. The speech he made I watched couple of times on YouTube. And what impressed me about that was that he kept the distinction carefully between who he was as a boy growing up in a small village outside of Seoul, Korea and who he is publicly and famously now - a star and the firmament of the entertainment world. And if he were to identify with that role totally he would lose contact with himself, with the boy he was, with the human being that he is. He would be ungrounded. 

 

And when that happens then you are out of contact with the Self and you are terribly vulnerable to what other people think and say about you. Because once you enter into the public domain everything depends on their admiration, their approval, their lifting you up to the pedestal. And when they stop you would have nothing, you would be empty. And then you would have to go on a quest for the Self and find your link again to the core of yourself. But that core of yourself usually is best discovered through going back and tracing your history and looking into your childhood and your heritage and your family. And then even beyond that to a kind of archetypal or transcendent sense of Self that underlies everything.

 

Q: Just to give briefly a little bit of background on BTS: there are seven members of the band, they are all men. Not going to call them boys because they range in age from 21 to 26. And the gentleman you were just referring to, RM, he is the translator of the group, I believe he is the only one who speaks English, he is 24 years old, he is so articulate, gave such an eloquent speech..

 

A: Very moving speech, very, very touching.

 

Q: Yes, it was. And it was in September of last year. And just a couple more things. They were the most retweeted celebrities in the world in 2017-2018. And in October they were featured on the cover of Time magazine, their international edition, as the next generation leaders. So it has been just a whirlwind for both you, Dr. Stein and myself on twitter this past week of all the attention that our tweets have been getting by the BTS ARMY which is what their fanbase is known as.

 

A: Well, there were some questions that came in from the fanbase that I would like to address if you could read them off to me, Laura.

 

Q: Yes, so the first question I have here from twitter, this is from Kookie Crumbles, she asks: I would love an open ended question to Dr. Stein about how he first became aware of BTS's interest in and focus on his and Jung's work and what he would most want to convey to people meeting Jung and the concept of Persona for the first time.

 

A: Well, let me start with how I met BTS. At my age I'm quite out of touch with that Post-Millennial or Millennial generation although I have grandchildren in that age group. So I haven't heard anything about BTS. I live in Switzerland, sort of out of the way when it comes to popular culture here. And I'm very involved in Jungian world and I don't know how many Jungian analysts worldwide know about BTS although I have asked some of my colleagues and a few of them have acknowledged that they have patients who are fans of BTS (lol). But it came to my attention from a Japanese student at the school in Zürich who asked me: did you know that your book is being recommended on the web-site of the BTS group? And I asked him who that was and he told me: they are very well-known in Japan, they have a huge following there. So I googled it, looked at it and sure enough, my book, Jung’s Map of the Soul, was listed along with Demian by Hermann Hesse and The Art of Loving by Erich Fromm. And I felt in very good company! My goodness how did I get there? And then I have discovered later that they have taken quite an interest in Jung's work, that Jung's name is mentioned occasionally in some of their songs. And then suddenly I was told, I guess a week or so ago, that their new album is titled Map of the Soul: Persona. And of course that floored me! And I then was contacted by ARMY, the fan-group, who discuss the meaning of their lyrics and so on, I have become more familiar with them. And I must say I'm thrilled that they have taken an interest in Jung and in my book. That Jung's message and Jung's vision is being transmitted to people who otherwise would never hear about him or pay any attention to what he has to offer. Because I think what Jung has to offer in this century is a vision of wholeness and a vision of integrity and human rights that would be so valuable for people all over the world to come into contact with and to study and to integrate into their daily life. Jung's message is a very hopeful one. That our unconscious is a spark of light, it is creative, it has much to offer to us if we pay attention to it, it gives us inner guidance. And really his emphasis on the sacredness of the individual and the importance of the individual to take responsibility for his or her own life and to take responsibility for the planet and for the world. I think that's the message that we really need today and that's what I hope would come across - that we need to be strong individuals, we need to be able to name ourselves and find ourselves and to take responsibility for the world around us.

https://speakingofjung.com/podcast/2019/3/25/episode-42-jungs-map-of-the-soul

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PossiblyMaybe Global Superstar

PossiblyMaybe

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Love what they said about RM and loved this part 

 

 

Q: Just to give briefly a little bit of background on BTS: there are seven members of the band, they are all men. Not going to call them boys because they range in age from 21 to 26. 

 

lovestruck.png  I feel like a lot of times media and fans (and bighit) portray the boys as childlike and I hope with this album they're finally going to break out of that bc this subject/concept is very apt to their age group (early to mid 20s) and it will be interesting to see where they go with it

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Augusto Nation's First Love

Augusto

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lovestruck.png I feel like a lot of times media and fans (and bighit) portray the boys as childlike and I hope with this album they're finally going to break out of that bc this subject/concept is very apt to their age group (early to mid 20s) and it will be interesting to see where they go with it

Agree.

It feels already like the farewell with 'drama of youth' concept they used for HYYH and later and their next step on the life road in seeking to find themselves.

I'm so excited about that Jungian 'Persona' theme, Bangtan's conceptuality is one of my favorite things about them.

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