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The Big Truth of the World Cup Finals


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Americans need to stop projecting their own social views and issues onto other cultures. The approach of the concepts of nationality and origins in france is different.

That "africa won the world cup " argument is actually really upsetting because it just goes against all the principles of integration and assimilation that enabled France to be a functional diversified country. Like it's literally counter productive and actually reinforces and validates a lot of arguments used by racists.

The french players identify themselves as french (because well this is what they are)and you all need to accept it and stop meddling in matters you do not understand.france won. Period.

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the response of the french ambassador is a bit embarrassing, but there's some context people seem to forget: the whole 'France team is actually African and not french' meme has been first used by the extreme-right in France and it's been for the main part about black players not being truly french. Similarly, we've heard so much shit this year from other countries, about how our team wasn't really french. And that's not being critical of french imperialism or our shitty way of dealing with immigration (or refugees), that's just pure racism. Obviously that is not Trevor Noah's angle, but I think this controversy is borne out of a misunderstanding (celebrating heritage, which is good and with which France does have an hypocrisy issue, vs a racist meme).

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the response of the french ambassador is a bit embarrassing, but there's some context people seem to forget: the whole 'France team is actually African and not french' meme has been first used by the extreme-right in France and it's been for the main part about black players not being truly french. Similarly, we've heard so much shit this year from other countries, about how our team wasn't really french. And that's not being critical of french imperialism or our shitty way of dealing with immigration (or refugees), that's just pure racism. Obviously that is not Trevor Noah's angle, but I think this controversy is borne out of a misunderstanding (celebrating heritage, which is good and with which France does have an hypocrisy issue, vs a racist meme).

Americans need to stop projecting their own social views and issues onto other cultures. The approach of the concepts of nationality and origins in france is different.

That "africa won the world cup " argument is actually really upsetting because it just goes against all the principles of integration and assimilation that enabled France to be a functional diversified country. Like it's literally counter productive and actually reinforces and validates a lot of arguments used by racists.

The french players identify themselves as french (because well this is what they are)and you all need to accept it and stop meddling in matters you do not understand.france won. Period.

Since when France is Africa

 

The whole world can see they're not french, except the brainwashed "progressists"

 

When even Africans themselves say they're not french, who are you trying to fool...

 

Just admit france lost its own identity thanks to people like you lol

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Since when France is Africa

The whole world can see they're not french, except the brainwashed "progressists"

When even Africans themselves say they're not french, who are you trying to fool...

Just admit france lost its own identity thanks to people like you lol

The criteria to be french is to possess a french citizenship(which you obtain by being born there or by naturalisation) and promote and respect french values.

Those players were born and grew up in france and under its values, their nationality is french. There is no distinction between french people in this regard. When or how they acquired their nationality does not have any relevance. The color of their skin does not have any relevance. This is the law.

If you have a problem and feel dissatistied with that, that is your problem. Go write a letter to the french government and ask them to change their criteria so that black people or people of african descent cannot aim for french nationality and identity anymore (since it seems to be your problem here).

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So it’s wrong for African to celebrate the African ethnicities of this team that they know would be focused on and looked down upon for negative news, but erased completely when it’s positive and for the advantage of the non-African?

 

Nah, race is not a convenient tool.

Can’t erase the roots.

Just like you can’t erase history of colonialism

 

If you don’t recognise nor accept their African roots then you ought to fuck off.

You can’t eradicate their origins when it suits you.

 

Be both the race and nationality, but a nation that doesn’t embrace race diversity is sick

 

 

Since when France is Africa

The whole world can see they're not french, except the brainwashed "progressists"

When even Africans themselves say they're not french, who are you trying to fool...

Just admit france lost its own identity thanks to people like you lol

DiNbEHtX4AArQ1-.jpg

 

Search ‘colonial tax’ while you’re at it....

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So it’s wrong for African to celebrate the African ethnicities of this team that they know would be focused on and looked down upon for negative news, but erased completely when it’s positive and for the advantage of the non-African?

Nah, race is not a convenient tool.

Can’t erase the roots.

Just like you can’t erase history of colonialism

If you don’t recognise nor accept their African roots then you ought to fuck off.

You can’t eradicate their origins when it suits you.

Be both the race and nationality, but a nation that doesn’t embrace race diversity is sickDiNbEHtX4AArQ1-.jpg

Search ‘colonial tax’ while you’re at it....

The problem is that saying that africa won is not celebrating their origins but denying their status as rightful french Citizens. I Said in a previous post that establishing distinctions between french people according to their origins is a perseptive used by racists to deny their status as french citizens and therefore reject equality.

Also it is contradictory to a lot of values based on the acceptance of others and equity between all french citizens, regardless of their color.

No one is denying the african roots of the players but, in this context, these roots dont really matter.

 

And the players themselves agree with it and identify as french so i dont understand why the world is trying very hard to create issues when there is none.

 

 

 

I think people just need to realize and understand the perspectives on some issues differ according to culture and history and they need To respect that.

 

Ps: i am myself french of african descent so i actually know what i am talking about.

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The problem is that saying that africa won is not celebrating their origins

Africa disagrees

 

but denying their status as rightful french Citizens.

Laws are one thing, life is another - and let’s be frank no one is as persistent at making this an issue than the French themselves. Even you know that they can dismiss nationality to suit their own prejudices and narratives. But they can’t remove the irreplaceable- the Black roots.

 

 

To put it simple - if Blacks cannot be fully accepted as French, what is wrong with Blacks accepting them, especially during a wonderful time like this? Why can’t it be our victory also?

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Africa disagreesLaws are one thing, life is another - and let’s be frank no one is as persistent at making this an issue than the French themselves. Even you know that they can dismiss nationality to suit their own prejudices and narratives. But they can’t remove the irreplaceable- the Black roots.

To put it simple - if Blacks cannot be fully accepted as French, what is wrong with Blacks accepting them, especially during a wonderful time like this? Why can’t it be our victory also?

Black people are fully accepted as french though? I live in france and i enjoy the exact same rights as any other non black french so i dont understand what you mean here ?

If you're talking about racism of course that is a rampant issue but it is pretty much the case everywhere in the world. And Promotinh and validating far rights racists propaganda isnt exactly a way of solving this issue.

 

Also the issue wasnt started by france at all by the way.France has had a very ethnically diversified tream for years because the french population is itself diversified. Most of the "africa won " propaganda comes from oversea.

 

Lastly.the WC is not a blacks VS non blacks competition. The entities competing against each other are nations.Nothing else,nothing more. We really need to stop making everything a racial issue. This is exactly what triggers and entertains racism.

So yeah the winning team is composed of black players but it is still the french team at the end of the day. France won. Not black people. Putting races against each other is not the point of the WC.

 

Never have i ever seen people saying stuff like "africa won" when an American sport team wins something or "Europe won" when the south africa rugby team wins. ..

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Black people are fully accepted as french though? I live in france and i enjoy the exact same rights as any other non black french so i dont understand what you mean here ?

If you're talking about racism of course that is a rampant issue but it is pretty much the case everywhere in the world. And Promotinh and validating far rights racists propaganda isnt exactly a way of solving this issue.

Also the issue wasnt started by france at all by the way.France has had a very ethnically diversified tream for years because the french population is itself diversified. Most of the "africa won " propaganda comes from oversea.

Lastly.the WC is not a blacks VS non blacks competition. The entities competing against each other are nations.Nothing else,nothing more. We really need to stop making everything a racial issue. This is exactly what triggers and entertains racism.

So yeah the winning team is composed of black players but it is still the french team at the end of the day. France won. Not black people. Putting races against each other is not the point of the WC.

Never have i ever seen people saying stuff like "africa won" when an American sport team wins something or "Europe won" when the south africa rugby team wins. ..

Who exactly started and enforced the concept of distinguishing themselves based on race is unknown, but it clearly didn’t have to start by a French person for it to be adopted by the White French and fellow White Europeans. Racism is what defined French colonialism on Africa - Whites were superior, Blacks were inferior. Colonialism isn’t dead yet and nor is the racial thinking.

 

Us Blacks did not start that. We’re on the receiving end of it and have been for centuries. Don’t suddenly turn the table against for your own convenience - just as how the White French pick and choose what they refer to Africans when it best suits them, or when and when not to accept them when it suits them. Again, written law and daily practice differ - a statement made when the French Governent removed ‘race’ from the country’s penal code in 2013 acknowledges this.

 

Let us not act as if France has always been receptive towards Blacks, because it hasn’t. It may be a little better now than then e.g. Blacks aren’t paraded around the streets for the fascination of Whites. But racism exists even in subtle forms via media and new networks.

 

 

At the end of the day, celebrating ethnicity doesn’t mean the eradication of nationality.

And when you really look at it only one of those is permanent - so celebrate it we will.

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Who exactly started and enforced the concept of distinguishing themselves based on race is unknown, but it clearly didn’t have to start by a French person for it to be adopted by the White French and fellow White Europeans. Racism is what defined French colonialism on Africa - Whites were superior, Blacks were inferior. Colonialism isn’t dead yet and nor is the racial thinking.

 

Us Blacks did not start that. We’re on the receiving end of it and have been for centuries. Don’t suddenly turn the table against for your own convenience - just as how the White French pick and choose what they refer to Africans when it best suits them, or when and when not to accept them when it suits them. Again, written law and daily practice differ - a statement made when the French Governent removed ‘race’ from the country’s penal code in 2013 acknowledges this.

 

Let us not act as if France has always been receptive towards Blacks, because it hasn’t. It may be a little better now than then e.g. Blacks aren’t paraded around the streets for the fascination of Whites. But racism exists even in subtle forms via media and new networks.

 

 

At the end of the day, celebrating ethnicity doesn’t mean the eradication of nationality.

And when you really look at it only one of those is permanent - so celebrate it we will.

I never pretended that racism doesn't exist though? But as I said when an american team composed of mostly african american wins, you never see people say that it's Africa who won. When the south african rugby team (composed of mostly white south africans) wins, you never see people claiming that the win belongs to Europe.

There is no difference here. It makes no sense to claim that the french team winning means that Africa won

 

It doesn't have anything to do with celebrating ethnicity it's just that, in this contest, ethnicity is not relevant. The WC isn't a competition between ethnicities/races (thanksfully). It's a competition between nations.

 

Colonianism and other racial issues just don't have their place in this context.

 

I already said it and i am going to repeat myself. Racism does exist but it does not mean that its foundations have to be reinforced. You can fight against it instead of entertaining it by making everything a racial issue.

I believe that celebrating the french team winning without caring about whatever color the skin of its players is, is one of the things that enable  to fight racism.

 

There is a reason why "race" has been removed from the french penal code. There is a reason why using the term "races" when talking about human beings is actually considered racist in the french language. It's because, in a scientifical point of view ,there isn't supposed to be several races within the human species. We're actually all the same race. And perpetually trying to divide people based on a notion that doesnt even exist in the first place is actually the root of racism and the reason why it is still rampant.

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Some similar things were said about Germany when they debuted a younger more diverse team in 2010. Ozil and khedira were Muslims, Podolski and Klose were polish born, Boateng black and so on. There were criticisms the team wasn't German enough, despite German teams of that previous decade being some of the most boring and weak teams of their time (how that 02 team reached the final is a mystery). Got to the semi finals while playing awesome counter attacking football.

 

4 years later they're world champions.

 

...then 4 years later they're flops lol

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Since when France is Africa

 

The whole world can see they're not french, except the brainwashed "progressists"

 

When even Africans themselves say they're not french, who are you trying to fool...

 

Just admit france lost its own identity thanks to people like you lol

but they are french

 

france is pride of their soccer team

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I never pretended that racism doesn't exist though? But as I said when an american team composed of mostly african american wins, you never see people say that it's Africa who won. When the south african rugby team (composed of mostly white south africans) wins, you never see people claiming that the win belongs to Europe.

There is no difference here. It makes no sense to claim that the french team winning means that Africa won

 

It doesn't have anything to do with celebrating ethnicity it's just that, in this contest, ethnicity is not relevant. The WC isn't a competition between ethnicities/races (thanksfully). It's a competition between nations.

 

Colonianism and other racial issues just don't have their place in this context.

 

I already said it and i am going to repeat myself. Racism does exist but it does not mean that its foundations have to be reinforced. You can fight against it instead of entertaining it by making everything a racial issue.

I believe that celebrating the french team winning without caring about whatever color the skin of its players is, is one of the things that enable  to fight racism.

 

There is a reason why "race" has been removed from the french penal code. There is a reason why using the term "races" when talking about human beings is actually considered racist in the french language. It's because, in a scientifical point of view ,there isn't supposed to be several races within the human species. We're actually all the same race. And perpetually trying to divide people based on a notion that doesnt even exist in the first place is actually the root of racism and the reason why it is still rampant.

To bring it back to the main point.....

 

 

Mesut Ozil

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Trevor Noah was pointing out why these players' identity have to be an either-or situation. They may be French by nationality but their roots are still African. Just look at the way they celebrate when they score a goal or win a match, those dance moves don't seem French to me, yet they speak French. What's wrong with recognising both aspects of their identity?

 

And another point that has gone over a lot of people's heads (or maybe they're just wilfully ignoring them) is the double standards that people apply to non-white citizens of any Western/European country based on whenever it suits them. Of course, now that this majority non-white team won the World Cup for France, the whole nation, media and government are quick to embrace the players as French but when anyone belonging to these ethnic groups is involved in a crime or any negative situation, they're suddenly less French and their ethnic roots are highlighted. It happens way too often.

 

 

As they say, success has many fathers, failure is an orphan.

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