Which male idols do you think are gay?

[cjbenny]

Is every single heterosexual relationship (from idols that many assumed were LGBTQ) fake or a lavender marriage? No. Could some of these idols be bisexual? Absolutely. It’s a tricky topic to discuss because I feel as if sometimes, so much hope is placed on male idols who seemed to have shunned the heteronormative ideals of Korean society for so long, that seeing them in relationships with women almost feels like a lie or joke.

I always tell myself that I shouldn’t expect a prominent gay entertainer or relationship to exist in Korean entertainment until the society at large moves towards a more progressive path. South Korea is still a country with strong Confucianist ideals. Respect your elders, obey your parents, family is paramount. Even for some gay idols, getting into a relationship with a woman is the only logical path, to maintain a career where their fan base is predominantly female, and to fulfill the wishes of parents who expect marriage and grandchildren.

As others have mentioned though, younger idols are more exposed to the world outside Korea thanks to the internet and social media. They can see that being gay and out and successful, isn’t separate from one another. If there is anyone who can outright challenge the heteronormative expectations of South Korea, it’ll be one of the idols from the 4th generation.

[cjbenny]

8 minutes ago, jinsoulmate said:

not technically kpop, but still interesting! 

 

 

Any visibility for the LGBTQ community is progress, hooray for Kwon Do-woon! I believe an enormous factor in the progress of gay rights in America was undoubtedly due to the numerous public figures that were out in Hollywood, from the glass closet era of Paul Linde and Liberace to the 90's with large public coming out stories with celebs like Ellen and Melissa Etheridge, to the large number of LGBTQ public figures we have now. They were visible entities that allowed everyone to realize that gay people existed, and many of them were open about their struggles with coming out and coming to terms with their sexuality. As soon as more people come out and become visible in South Korean society, the more weakened the archaic patriarchal and heteronormative system will become. And along the way, we can only hope that it inspires other entertainers along the way.

[cjbenny]

13 minutes ago, Dont mind me said:

Haha, I love this. Will try and find the video on my own. Maybe it's time I invest some time into NCT only if it's to get more info on Ten. 

Not a video but a gif! And as a Taeyong fan, some other fun flustered Taeyong moments that I posted awhile back but always fun to bring back. 

[cjbenny]

Whilst I don't disagree with the premise that we often have a tendency to look at things through a western lens, not everyone here is living in a "western" nation and I'm fairly sure there are at least a few posters who live or have lived in Korea. 

Every country has its own unique set of issues regarding LGBTQ rights, but I believe the arc of progress is relatively universal and involves a confluence of factors. It involves having numerous LGBTQ people in the public sphere, whether it be entertainment, news media, or politics and giving visibility to the community. It involves activists targeting all levels of government to fight for protections and rights. It involves LGBTQ people slowly but surely living openly and allowing everyone to see that they are just the same as everyone else. And as an extension of that, it involves public sentiment to eventually change the minds of legislators and government officials and with time, translate to laws. 

This is still a country where gay soldiers in active duty are considered to have "behavioural disabilities". This is a country that sentenced a gay soldier to jail for having consensual sex with another soldier. This is a country whose first openly transgender soldier was discharged despite her requests for reinstatement and eventually took her own life. This is a country that still lacks any comprehensive bill that prohibits discrimination against LGBTQ citizens. This is a country whose most prominent gay celebrity Hong Seok-cheon was effectively shunned and blacklister from entertainment when he came out. This is a country where numerous gay Youtube couples have to blur out their faces because of the potential consequences and are hesitant to even hold hands in public. This is still a society (with a large Christian influence) where anything outside heteronormative ideals is often seen as an aberration. 

So much of early gay entertainment in America involved unhappy lavender marriages, suicide, bullying, etc. because so many of the people who made those stories underwent those very same struggles. It is only because of time and the hard work of others that we have the plethora of LGBTQ content we enjoy today. As others have stated above, any visibility is crucial for progress as long as it gives non-LGBTQ audiences a glimpse into the struggles we face and for all we know, Jaehyun's show could be a good outlet for that.

[cjbenny]

1 hour ago, mEeEeE said:

We’ll see how long that lasts

Your comeback story was a pleasure to watch mEeEeE 

[cjbenny]

Hi mEeEeE, I truly do appreciate you and your presence in this thread (as I've mentioned, your comeback story was quite something lol) but as many posters have already stated, many DO think that Taeyong is potentially LGBTQ. However, none of us know because all of this is speculation and even I find some of the things you post as nonstarters or really stretching things. I do want to reiterate that you have occasionally posted some actual receipts that we found interesting or valid, so perhaps you can gauge our reaction/responses to see what we think? 

At the end of the day, these idols are products made by a burgeoning but cutthroat industry. We prove that every time we click on a video, stream a song, or buy an album. Does Taeyong's behavior in the past somehow invalidate or prove his sexuality? Of course not, because unless he posts a coming out story on Instagram, all we have are guesses and hunches. He's a grown man who can handle dealing with mistakes in his past, as we all have to contend with in our lives. 

But his job (and the job of all idols) is to entertain an audience and maintain an image. Some idols skirt the line and show in subtle ways their support or identification with the community. Others may reject any possibility of it in order to throw off their scent from the wolves so to speak. Either way, their livelihood depends on them selling their appeal to a largely heterosexual female fan base and any clear indication of being LGBTQ can be detrimental to their careers. So we have this thread to discuss and speculate because that's all we really can do. If there's push back to some of your posts, it's probably because many of us don't think it really contributes to the discussion at large. 

Edited January 10, 2022 by cjbenny

[cjbenny]

1 hour ago, bb8__ said:

 

Heartbreaking, especially when he feels like he didn't do enough...he blames himself when the burden should not solely be on one person but all of society. He's the only person/celeb that has had the courage to be open and talk about LGBT issues and it's just not enough. I hope more with a platform and star power will join him to speak out against the vitriol netizens continue to spew towards people that don't fit their mold of "normal or perfect." 

"Hong's condolences were written into articles by media, and in turn Hong was attacked by online haters, hence his strongly worded response today."

...maybe they'll just never learn and then they wonder why they have such a high suicide rates.

No one knows how the arc of how LGBTQ rights in Korea will shape out. It's easy to get discouraged, especially trying to juxtapose the staggering rise of cultural soft power Korea has built up these past few years with how frustratingly out of step they are with LGBTQ issues, something that more and more nations are starting to adopt as time passes. We can applaud idols stating that they love all of their fans (gay or straight), we can be happy when male idols act cute with male fans, we can observe all the idols who are living in glass closets but those are all reminders of how difficult it is to be anything other than a heterosexual individual in Korea. This is honestly one of the most saddening pieces I've read in a while and puts a clear lens on the struggles of Korean LGBTQ citizens.

When Hong Seok-cheon, the country's most prominent gay man is openly stating that he feels responsible for not being able to protect someone from the cruelty of those who gleefully masquerade in the anonymity of the internet, it's hard to feel optimistic. It's even more sobering to realize that he came out 22 years ago. So many idols hadn't yet been born. How many Korean LGBTQ entertainers witnessed the shameless discrimination and blacklisting he endured as a warning for what might happen to their careers? It's probably most telling that there hasn't been a high profile coming out since. Men like Hong Seok-cheon, whether they ever realize it or not, have shattered the barriers for everyone to follow them. It might not happen now or even in the immediate future, but when Korea finally starts advancing on LGBTQ rights and protections, figures like Hong Seok-cheon will be left standing when the dust settles, as someone who laid the foundation for all that progress to happen. For being a figure that young LGBTQ Koreans could identify with and look up to. For speaking out on taboo subjects in order to shine a light on injustice. What a great and brave man who deserves all the love in the world.

Edited February 7, 2022 by cjbenny

[cjbenny]

22 minutes ago, Josaline said:

So, if you think they're just friends and their friendship is so cute and if you know that most of what they say is fanservice, why are you posting things about them in the gay thread? Just because you think the guy's chemistry is so good, is sharing it in here different from what the shippers do? And is it different from fetishizing?

 

I won't claim to know a lot of Seoham and Jaechan but just speaking from my perspective, I welcome hearing about the behind the scenes stuff on this show. This thread can often devolve into pointless arguments involving some of the most inane topics that go on for pages. Hearing from a young Korean male idol speaking about his role in a BL show in such an open-minded (and in my personal opinion, fairly candid) way is valid enough to have a place in this thread. I'd personally rather hear from the cast of a BL show talking about their experiences in making the show than someone going on and on about how "Idol X is gay because of some arbitrarily obscure thing". But others might feel the opposite, and that's okay because I think both have a place in this thread. I don't know how others might feel, but none of these posts felt like shipping to me. They felt like stories about two (whether straight or not) friends who are comfortable enough to star in a BL show, discussing their friendship in a way that I find sweet and wholesome. 

Anyways, I also agree with the others that Semantic Error has some of the best chemistry I've seen in a Korean BL show and highly recommend others watch it if they have the chance. 

[cjbenny]

Yep, young Korean men voting conservative is equally fascinating and disconcerting and I'm sure contributed to Yoon's win. Just a reminder for folks, Yoon promised to abolish the Ministry of Gender Equality and Family, a portion of which promotes equality for women in Korea. Also, last year, a newspaper polled young men, 79% of whom stated that they felt "severely discriminated against" due to their gender. It's a genuine question, how many of these male idols likely voted for this man?

Edited March 10, 2022 by cjbenny

[cjbenny]

Regardless of a season 2 (which I truly hope happens once Seoham returns from the military), I just hope more Korean BLs follow what Semantic Error did so well. Both leads had fantastic chemistry, were well-written and well-acted, and the added length of the episodes (a little over 20 minutes vs the 10 minutes of shows like Where Your Eyes Linger) gave the characters more time to breathe and settle in with an audience. And while this show exists in a vacuum of Korea where homophobia is almost a non-factor, can I just personally say how refreshing it is to watch a gay romance where the conflict/drama is driven by the behaviors and actions of the two leads and not some external entity (like a jealous ex or bullies or unaccepting parents).

Either way, I'm just so happy that Korea is creating so many BL shows. While not all of these shows will be as successful as Semantic Error is turning out to be, they still represent stories of non-heteronormative relationships that are key for ensuring visibility for LGBTQ folks in Korea and for that, I hope it will keep growing.

Spoiler

Also, it doesn't sound like much and I'm sure there are some that might disagree but gosh was it also great to have a show that didn't shy away from kisses. There were multiple kisses spread throughout the season and they weren't just a peck on the lips that ended on a freeze-frame right before the end credits.

 

Edited March 12, 2022 by cjbenny

[cjbenny]

(I'm just teasing mEeEeE, I really am fond of you and your posts, as I said before, your comeback story is one that I applauded )

[cjbenny]

Why do i feel like this is what Reham's room looks like?

[cjbenny]

1 hour ago, mEeEeE said:

Guys I’m so sorry about yesterday, I feel really bad. There’s a line, and I crossed it. This thread and its users don’t deserve the vibes I brought yesterday. I feel I don’t deserve to be on this forum. You guys are honestly really good people and I wish you all the best for the future. This thread is great, keep it up. Hope the rest of your Pride month year, is better

It's a forum and by virtue of that, a system that allows people from all different walks of life to discuss things. You deserve the ability to speak your mind (and others to disagree if need be) just as much as the rest of us. And we all make mistakes, I'm in my thirties and still enjoy learning new things from others because it broadens my horizons and helps me grow as a person. Wishing you the best

[cjbenny]

mEeEeE is one of the most entertaining voices here, even if I get some slight whiplash from their varying Taeyong posts. Honestly, with how dead this thread gets at times, at least mEeEeE often gives us something to discuss (or challenge) lol. 

[cjbenny]

1 hour ago, Taebear said:

So why can't we discuss his interactions with girl groups? Are we here only allowed to talk about his interactions with men? I didn't say he is straight I believe he is LGBT I just don't believe he is homosexual now and lean more towards bisexual

The thread title is "which male idols do you think are gay", not "which heavily speculated to be gay idol could be actually be bisexual based on..."

I mean, no one is policing what you can talk about but don't be surprised to get pushback from people who are both overwhelmed by the enormous number of "evidence" you posted and skeptical that it in any sense could give us a gauge on what Taehyung's (or any idol for that matter) sexuality is. 

[cjbenny]

Also, if you are a troll account Taebear, then I'm talking to the equivalent of a brick wall. if you're not, then I sincerely hope that you take some time to think about why you're so invested in this man and his sexuality. People go to this thread either to post funny/worthwhile things that could give us clues about LGBTQ idols or to read about said clues, not to scroll down endlessly as someone seems hellbent on proving to us that a certain idol likes women.

Edited July 5, 2022 by cjbenny

[cjbenny]

Oh dear sweet lord, I come into this and just see a wall of Taebear posts... 

[cjbenny]

I'm starting to feel that idols whose name begins with a "Tae" are casting some inadvertent dark magic on some folks that post here...

[cjbenny]

1 hour ago, mEeEeE said:

god I thought I was done with everything then saw this

 

I hate Kpop. Too confusing. 

This is how they keep the fans I swear

Ambiguity 

See mEeEeE, a post like this might foster some decent enough discussion, rather than a dissertation on Taeyong's childhood diary, astrology signs, or how his eye twitched while doing an interview. I truly to appreciate your input but for the novella length posts...just

 

[cjbenny]

2 hours ago, Shaandenigma said:

It's why it's so aggravating when people, like she who must not be named, act like there isn't a host of good reasons for someone to claim to be straight when they're behavior and other statements suggest otherwise. It's just so obtuse lol.

We must do what we can not to summon her, she might feel a disturbance in the force and pop in here lmao

[cjbenny]

I usually post updates from Rainbow Teen Safe Space, run by DDing Dong LGBTQ Youth Crisis Support Center, an organization in Korea that focuses on helping LGBTQ teens. As always, here's a link to their page on the Global Giving website for those who may be interested in supporting them. 

DDing Dong (Rainbow Teen Safe Space) 32nd letter
By Hochan Seon - Director

#Rainbow Kits

Hello, this is DDing Dong. How have you been in the first half of this year? DDing Dong has moved to more comfortable and more accessible center. We have not been able to hold diverse offline events due to COVID-19 since 2020, but we participated in Seoul Queer Culture Festival (SQCF) finally held in three years, and met many LGBTQ youths, promoting our organization DDing Dong. Also, we went to Los Angeles, visiting organizations that help youths with shelter and housing for our Home, Pride Home project. In the second half of this year, we plan to meet LGBTQ youths in our new center and continuously send Rainbow Kits to LGBTQ runaway youths.

#Rainbow Kits

We consistently send kits containing foods and necessaries to LGBTQ runaway youths. From this year, we send Rainbow Kits not only to LGBTQ youths in their 10s but also to LGBTQ youths in their early 20s. When sending kits, we help them with counseling and supporting, and check whether they have other worries or difficulties. In the first half of this year, cosmetic brands such as LUSH Korea, DECIEM, and ISNTREE helped us make ample kits by their campaigns and donating goods.

#Happy Pride, Seoul Queer Culture Festival (SQCF)

DDing Dong also joined in Seoul Queer Culture Festival (SQCF). By opening and running a booth, we gave ice cream to LGBTQ youths who are connected to us online. Also we ran a ‘fortune lot’ program. By this, we delivered their fortunes including proud messages full of support. This year, DDing Dong gave solidary speeches on congratulatory stage, delivering messages that all people can enjoy the festival without any discrimination regardless of their identites or ages. Though it rained heavily that day, we successfully ended the SQCF finishing with parade.

#DDing Dong’s volunteers, DDinga DDinga

‘DDinga DDinga’ program in which volunteers meet LGBTQ youths and do various activities together, has been running this year, too. In the first half, we did ‘Online Outreach’ program through regular meetings to think how we can meet LGBTQ youths online and non-face-to-face. Also, we planned surveys for HIV/AIDS and STIs, and are doing survey of Research on the experiences and recognitions about using condoms of LGBTQ youths in their 10s. DDinga DDinga plans to do other various activities untill the end of this year, so please look forward to them.

#Moving to the new space

DDing Dong had started first in Seongbuk-gu (District of Seoul) in 2015 and moved to Gangbuk-gu in 2018. Recently, we moved to Jangchung-dong in Seoul. The new center still has an open hall where LGBTQ youths can rest, eat and read, and cozy counseling rooms. Also we have telephone counseling rooms where we can counsel LGBTQ youths non-face-to-face (untact) and online. Lots of LGBTQ Youths curious about the new space visited and used the center. 

This is all we prepared for the news letter about our first half activities. A variety of other news are ready on our homepage and blog (Korean only). If you have any questions, please feel free to contact us by [email protected]. Thank you.
 

#Happy Pride, Seoul Queer Culture Festival (SQCF)

#DDing Dong's volunteers, DDinga DDinga

#Moving to the new space

[cjbenny]

mEeEeE, I love you, truly (and I'm glad to see you back!). But your fluctuating opinions on Taeyong makes me go

sometimes lol

Edited August 27, 2022 by cjbenny

[cjbenny]

[cjbenny]

44 minutes ago, gam3 bo1 said:

pannchoa released a post of knetz reacting to the haruto being homophobic scandal. now, i'm aware pannchoa comments are only a small selection and won't always be reflective of the general opinion but i thought i'd copy and paste them here since we did talk about this topic a few days back

  Hide contents

1. [+124, -8]

Personally, I can totally see why someone might think that way, but to make it so obvious and say it out loud is problematic 

 

2. [+96, -4]

It's fine that he hates them, but regardless of being a celebrity, to hate something out loud is a bit.. It's true he needs to be more careful 

 

3. [+94, -2]

But it's been 5 days he said it and seeing how Pann only released it now, it means that Pann really aren't keeping up with Treasure ㅋㅋ If they were idols that Pann were hating on everyday, they'd be be eaten up so bad that there would be articles written about it 

 

4. [+86, -53]

Honestly, me too I find gays repulsive... But Asian gays even more... They're also severely misogynistic. Unlike BLs, where they have lots of female friends around them and they're the ones who "understand" women, this is all delusion. In reality, they hate women, and the gay community cheer when they see women's lives get screwed over. 

 

5. [+79, -5]

What is this?

"Leaves a note to pretty fan"... YG's Treasure member Haruto, private account gets leaked"

"YG Treasure Haruto friends with his sasaengs..."

 

That number 4 comment . "Gays are disgusting, I know because I clearly watch enough BL's that I can use them as a gauge for how gay men do/don't behave in real life!" 

Edited April 10 by cjbenny

[cjbenny]

7 hours ago, K-Poppie said:

Did Semantic Error really have that much of an impact in Korean pop culture? I remember reading somewhere that it was one of the most talked about Korean dramas in 2022(which is pretty impressive for a low-budget web drama), and that it helped popularize the BL genre in Korea overall.

My own anecdotal experience but there were a few Semantic Error and Seoham themed cafe's in Seoul last year that were packed with people and it genuinely surprised me at the time.