Which male idols do you think are gay?

[witchcocktor]

I don't think he is either. Jin has rumors (even in Japan) of being bisexual.

Where do these rumors even come from? All I know is that one '' rumor '' (or fact?) that he has frequented gay bars and got along with the gays there. But then again, a gay bar is probably the best place for a national male idol to hide from the public while still enjoying a good time. Other Johnny's do this as well, I hear. 

Edited May 15, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

A male idol/female idol barely looking at each other = super real, must be dating!!1

2 idols of the same sex (esp guy/guy) being openly flirty and touchy feely with each other = so delulu, you don't understand tru friendship!!1

The same old ass hypocrisy

 

I'm sure this topic has been visited before, but I think a lot of us have been raised in cultures that deem any kind of physical or emotional closeness between two men as gay, while this might not be in some East Asian countries, like Korea or Japan. Part of this might be because the concept of homosexuality is so foreign and repressed in those societies, and it does seem like '' best friends '' and '' brotherhood '' is highly romanticized as well. Taking those into consideration, men probably have more freedom to explore strong platonic relationships and skinship, despite no underlying homosexual/romantic tension (though it still might exist). Besides, friend groups are generally very gendered, and there's learned acceptable behavior on how to behave with the same sex, and how to behave with the opposite sex. No kidding men are going to feel more freedom with other men, rather than the opposite sex (granted they are attracted to them).

 

I'm no expert in Asian, or for that matter Korean culture, so I might be completely talking out of my ass so if anyone knows better, feel free to correct me. With that said, as a man myself who has hung around dudes, I've had my nipples pinched and ass slapped and rated by straight men, of course jokingly. Generally '' totally hetero '' male on male skinship is a way buddies tease each other, and that's something to keep in mind as well. But, I've also noticed that usually the ones being teased with skinship are usually those who are probably thought to be gay and very insecure about it to begin with, but that's just my own assumption lol.

 

What I'm trying to say that cultural differences exist even in subjects like these, so one should take that into consideration. I'm not trying to be a partypooper, but just stating my own view. Though yet again, I'm not Korean, so if there are Korean people here, might as well shed light on whether I'm completely wrong or right.

 

Both of the situations stated above aren't really telling of anything, I think we can agree on that. Whether it's eye contact  between two people of the opposite sex or playful bonding between men, that's not really a hint on anything. Personally, I'm much more convinced on words rather than actions. But certainly it all depends on the situation at hand.

Edited May 21, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

While I agree with what you're saying to an extent, I think labeling any type of speculation as "delulu" simply because in some East Asian countries same-sex physical affection is more common is going too far. The way some people shut down any possibility of idols being actually gay/bi simply because "in Korea same sex friends are affectionate with each other" and proceed to defend their heterosexuality like no tomorrow, do reek of homophobia. Obviously not everyone doing skinship is gonna be attracted to each other (but that happens even with male/female friends), but not everything is gonna be "simply a pure platonic friendship" either and anyone who thinks otherwise is "delulu". In fact, I'm pretty sure many lgtb+ idols use skinship and fanservice as a way to express themselves and get away with it because most people aren't gonna suspect precisely because same-sex skinship is seeing as common there.

 

Also, I'm not Korean either but I've been both in Korea and Japan and I haven't really seen that many skinship between same-sex friends. Sure, they're a bit more comfortable with skinship than in western countries, but it's not nearly as exaggerated as people think.

Well thankfully I'm not labeling all type of speculation as '' delulu '' I'm just saying that in most cases, same sex skinship and opposite sex people having brief eye contact are pretty equally telling of one's sexuality, and that's not much, taking into consideration the cultural differences. 

 

I'm not an expert either but... 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUm9cE6_XlI

 

 

I'm not sure how Korea is but Japan definitely seems... interesting!

[witchcocktor]

Pretty sure the comment meant '' Jimin is a real life human person, not some 2d soft gay bean boy uwuwuwu made for your shipping and fetishizing pleasures ''

Though that comment is completely invalidated by them shipping two real life people together so them trying to take some moral high ground is just dumb.

Edited May 22, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

About Heechul, when did he say that? I don't think I've ever seen that quote.

 

Either way, Heechul has about 980458609 receipts of interest in men and explicit disinterest in women, even from pre-debut, and all of it is confirmed over and over by how others in the industry treat him. Fans twist themselves in knots to prove Heechul is straight despite over 10 years of consistent evidence. He acts super gay all the time because he's gay. It's really not that deep.

 

Also, about Taehyung, I'm not sure if you could chalk it all up to acting, considering they mentioned him having a hard time long after Hwarang aired. We'll probably never know, but I hope he's feeling better now.  

What do people make of this, though? I don't think HSC would be disingenuous enough to fabricate a fake story like this to help Heechul be in the closet, unless he is flat out teasing him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTR9ropQWwc 

Edited June 1, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

What baffles me as an outsider is how many South Asian K-Pop fandoms will tolerate, even encourage, very blatant same-sex antics between men in these groups onstage, etc, but when it comes to them actually saying 'I am gay/queer, not straight' there's this attitude that that's the worst thing they could do because fans wouldn't believe it. Though there are lots of fans that would and do support it too. Just I notice a vocal bunch of antis in among them. 

 

Many S Asian fans I've come across seem to be totally amenable to onstage tactile behaviour among men but woe betide anyone that actually proves to be gay and just wants to admit it and/or support LGBT+ rights. 

 

In the UK, fans just accept it when someone comes out. If you're gay you're gay, just say it everyone's like 'okay cool' we been knew anyway, and then talking about the next album (and 'who's their boy/girlfriend!', lol). But the pressures will be a lot different between more liberal societies with LGBT rights and those with less to none. 

 

In K-Pop I do wonder if same-sex contact among the guys esp. is encouraged by management because they're are not going to be able to date women (or men) openly, so it's like, 'take your frustrations out on each other, because fans will never believe you're gay anyway'. But then there's also the hiding in plain site thing that must surely happen and I believe is happening right now. I think the skinskip tactic serves many purposes. 

 

When you get fans shrieking that proud and chaotic people like Ten ("I want to have sex with you fatass, love you darling") cannot possibly be queer there's definitely a disconnect going on somewhere imo! 

 

It's kind of how like with yaoi and Japanese fujoshi, there's the '' world of yaoi '' and the '' world of gay '' which don't necessarily intertwine. Yaoi is a fantasy, gay is reality. That's why you rarely see legit gay characters in yaoi to begin with, because it doesn't emulate the real world, but it follows the rules of yaoi and the fantasies of fujoshi. In those fantasies, LGBT commentary and the fair, more truthful portrayal of gay people is not on the forefront at all. That's not the fantasy yaoi is trying to achieve.

 

Same ideology can be traced to kpop '' gay '' fanservice. I think for most fangirls, it's just a fantasy. It's acting and more like a '' homoerotic courting dance made specifically for fangirls to squeal about '', nothing more, nothing less. It's something the idols do to get the attention of fangirls, and give them a piece of fantasy. But that fantasy breaks when someone legit enjoys being with men physically and emotionally, being gay or bi, that doesn't fit the fantasy anymore, for whatever reason. It's much the same as straight men being totally into seeing two girls making out, doesn't mean they are pro-LGBT by any means.

 

As times move forward, I guess this kind of '' yay for fanservice and casual homoeroticism between idols, nay for actually gay people '' train of thought will be seen less and less, but part of the change needs to be idols coming out of the closet, which we know won't be happening any time soon, but time will tell.

Edited June 2, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

Damn this boy has a set of pipes on him. He really deserves a listen if you haven't, this is an amazing tune:

 

 

 

magical! deserves so many more views, what the heck

[witchcocktor]

The topic is '' which male idols do you think are gay '' not '' which male idols do you think are tops/bottoms. ''

While not inherently offensive, it doesn't really belong in this thread, or the non-18+ section.

 

And who really gives a rats ass about who takes it up the pooper, or if they do at all?

Edited June 19, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

Earlier i used to believe heechul was gay for sure, but recently on Ask Us Anything(or Knowing Bros), there have been a few small things which make me think he may be straight, or at least bisexual?

 

hong seok chun wouldn't make things up right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTR9ropQWwc

I've wondered about this before like 20-30 pages backwards, and I think the general consensus was that HSC is helping him stay in the closet (for the time being). 

 

A few notes about the whole story though:

- Heechul specifies that '' it was a long time ago '' in which he might've still tried being with women.

 

- Don't you find it a bit weird that HSC goes into detail regarding what type of '' women '' Heechul likes despite that not being related to the conversation or the story AT ALL. It felt like the whole point of that story and specifying his preference was to squash the rumors about him, and what's more effective than to hear it from the mouth of an actual gay guy, because '' he'd know if he was gay or not '' or whatever.

 

- I might be splitting hairs with this (well, the whole post is splitting hairs) but the specific type Heechul has is pretty interesting: pretty and voluptuous. Asian cultures don't really idealize a voluptuous body on a woman (especially women themselves), and it's more of an acquired taste unlike in the west where it's more sought after. It kind of feels like stating this specific preference is to create distance, make him more unachievable and unobtainable because his preference for women is something that most Korean/Asian women are not and don't necessarily even want to be, making his lack of rumors about dating women less '' worrisome. '' 

 

- It might even be that this is a totally true story... just that Heechul was with a man, instead a woman. If you are a Korean idol/celebrity, and you want to do something with a same sex partner outside of your apartment, you probably aren't going to trust just any establishment not to leak your potential gay/bi status to the press. You could also be blackmailed. HSC being in the restaurant business, and being an openly gay celebrity, you bet your sweet ass closeted celebrities are going to take '' advantage '' of that and use his restaurants and businesses to have a place outside of your home to have fun with your same sex date/partner. HSC won't spread any rumors because it's his business and his image on the line as well because he is a public figure, as well as him being a good guy. 

 

 

Now, about HSC not faking things... 

 

I thought the same, HSC is very truthful and isn't afraid to say what's on his mind, and I'm sure he'd like if there were more openly gay celebrities in the Korean entertainment scene. But, he himself knows the downside of coming out and the problems that arise from being open about your sexuality in Korea. Even he himself considered suicide. So despite possibly knowing a lot of closeted stars, he wouldn't put them in a position where their sexualities could be questioned. Because if an openly gay man starts suggesting X might be gay, then that's going to spread like wildfire. In the end, HSC is a good guy, that's what a lot of celebrities say about him.

 

Another thing, I remember watching youtube videos about HSC a month backwards, and he was talking about how so many celebrities are so open with their secrets with him, and how he is kinda (really) tired of it. These secrets could include being a sexual minority, duh. HSC is probably in a really rough spot in having to cover for closeted celebrities and support being in a closet, but in the end, he is that good guy who doesn't spill any secrets, because he knows how it can backfire, and him being a celebrity himself it will backfire to him as well. So he really is the perfect person to open up to, possibly even BECAUSE he is gay, cuz '' you accept yourself despite what others say, so you'll probably accept me as well '' and '' it's not like you can judge me, being gay and all. '' 

 

Whew, well those are my thoughts on the subject. Heechul could be bi or gay, or maybe even straight for all we know, but after reviewing the clip myself and thinking about it, it doesn't necessarily mean he is not gay. It might all just be bogus, to squash rumors for the time being, whether HSC wants or likes to do it or not.

Edited June 21, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

I feel like a lot of people here say he is definitetly gay cause he is feminine and loves fanservice (this is not an attack to anybody btw) but I need more than this to think that someone is gay 

not to be a buzzkill either but i think being feminine and loving/partaking in fanservice is the biggest reason for speculation in here to begin with no matter who the idol is.  

[witchcocktor]

Click here to view the Tweet

Goddamn MRSHLL looks hot. And Holland looks so good with his hair down like that. He should keep it that way.

[witchcocktor]

'' they can make sexy kids. ''

 

That's.... wow.. did he really use those words, lol.

Edited July 28, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

Rainbow is NOT directly associated with LGBT or pride in asian countries, at least by the majority of the population.

Edited July 31, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

I really wish people would stop using '' gay panic '' as some kind of a cute thing because there's absolutely no positive association with that word.

 

For instance, '' the gay panic defense is a legal defense, usually against charges of assault or murder. A defendant using the defense claims they acted in a state of violent temporary insanity because of unwanted homosexual advances from another individual. The defendant alleges to find the same-sex sexual advances so offensive and frightening that it brings on a psychotic state characterized by unusual violence. ''

 

Though maybe I'm just super sensitive lol.

Edited August 13, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

Speaking of Holland, it is pretty hilarious that any agency could just scoop him up and make him their (international) product and a big star. He has the rabid following, now you just need to train him as an artist, singer, dancer, etc, and make lots of cash. But nobody wants to sign him, and most of it is certainly just because he is gay. Like come on, there's money to be made! 

 

But maybe for now, this is for the best. It's nice to know that Holland isn't a COMPLETE product. He definitely has more creative freedom this way, and he should enjoy that perk. But he does need a lot of training if he wants to reach new levels.

Edited August 30, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

The ONLY confident gays

[witchcocktor]

 

a bit off topic, but i thought it was interesting anyway

 

this is a couple in korea who have been together for over a year but only admitted that they were together a few months ago. before they admitted this they posted a video lying and saying that they weren’t together (which is totally understandable). they have since taken the video when they lied down. the video i have linked was uploaded today, so after they have announced they were together, and is the outtakes from when they filmed the video when they lied and said they weren’t dating. so all these moments happened in between them coming up with a story about how they were just friends. i found it interesting because in this video you can really see what happens when a couple tries to hide that they are together.

 

i hope that explanation makes sense.

 

Ooooohh so THAT'S what the video was about! Honestly, pretty freaking cool. 

[witchcocktor]

I love how in some posts, people are like '' I don't want to stereotype that gay men are feminine '' and then basically continue with '' but let's do it anyway! '' 

 

When it comes to evidence of someone being LGBT, I prefer to look at what these idols SAY, rather than what they wear, how they move or what they are interested in. For instance, if someone doesn't specify '' girl '' when they are asked their specific type. I think that's pretty bold, as well as telling, especially since I don't see the positives of being vague, I don't see how that'd be fanservice either.

[witchcocktor]

Bringing back these lovelies too. 

 

 

 

 

The other stuff is pretty great, but this...

 

Come on now, these rings mostly look culty and edgy for most people, I'm LGBT and had no idea what a transgender symbol is. Never even heard of it. I wear a shirt with Buddha in it, because it looks cool and culty, not because I'm a Buddhist. I also wear clothing with satanic imagery in them, doesn't mean I praise Satan. 

 

I think most people would see these rings and think ooh, that's kinda cool and edgy.

[witchcocktor]

Uh, I don't want to be too disrespectful towards homeboy, but.. I wouldn't sign Holland even if he wasn't gay. Musically, he is not great, and if he wants to play with the big boys, he needs to be more than a face for the LGBT community of SK and a social media darling (mostly supported by western fans). Then again, his second single was miles better than his first, so I'm hopeful for his career.

 

I'm not denying that homophobia exists within idol companies and record labels, BUT Holland has other battles to fight as well.

Edited December 15, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

I'm not saying anyone has to like Holland's music and I'm not pretending he's any kind of Beyonce vocal, but can we also remember that idols in a company have months if not years before debuting to train with vocal and dance teachers, as well as being put on diets/training regimens and pressured/coerced into plastic surgery to change how they look. And musically, the songs are entirely written for them, especially when they're just debuting. Holland hasn't had any of those resources. As far as I know, he hasn't had any formal training, and with his music, he recently said he does everything but produce himself: "I don't produce songs. Except that, I decide everything, such as genre, lyrics, concept, music video, hair, make-up, costume, cover design and marketing. Of course, I always communicate with the song producer."

 

Again, you don't have to be a fan of his songs or voice or face or whatever. But personally I think it's amazing what he's managed to do so far with zero help from a company. 

 

Now that's true, and it's NOT like idols are widely known for being the top of the country in terms of talent (I'm not trying to be mean here, just realistic). If Holland had all the resources other idols did, I'm sure he'd come out feeling like a true idol, even though realistically you wouldn't want anyone to go through such a problematic training regime. 

 

Then there's always the issue of whether Holland was let to be as gay as he wanted with a company backing him. The reason we know of the openly gay Holland today IS because he is indie and without a label. So for that, we can be thankful.

[witchcocktor]

Regarding Holland- with a vocal couch he could be vocalist for a group. 

 

Honestly, I think if he had the resources he could easily be in the industry. Not in a top, super popular group or anything, but he has shown talent writing lyrics, and say what you want about his voice, but I like it. He just needs training. 

 

 

This, pretty much. 

 

Would he be signed if he wasn't gay? we don't know, and it doesn't matter, because being gay is part of his identity as an idol. Although, if he has said that companies wanted him as long as he was in the closet, that kinda answers the question.

 

Also off topic but not really he's cute as hell go give him some love.

 

Click here to view the Tweet

 

I don't know what '' visuals '' mean but some people stated that Holland doesn't have visuals. I don't know, I think he looks pretty great, better than some guys in already popular kpop bands.

 

But as stated I have... NOOOOOO IDEA, what visuals entail. He is a bit skinny though which makes me worried at times, hopefully he takes good care of his health.

 

I'd love to see him grow his hair though, going for more androgynous look.

Edited December 15, 2018 by witchcocktor

[witchcocktor]

I think you need to remember that idols wear whatever the stylists give them, especially when they're onstage as Junho is in this picture. People on this forum sometimes use what an idol is wearing as proof that they're not straight or that they're not homophobic when it's not that deep. They wear what is given to them most of the time. I think Junho's actions in the past speak louder on his opinion of the LGBT+ community than what a stylist most likely gave him to wear. 

I agree 100%

 

but the stylist is still there, putting these idols in '' lgbt supportive '' merchandise and I love it. These stylist (probably some gay too) just using these idols to spread love and acceptance, which I find hilarious and smart. Way to go stylists!

[witchcocktor]

I only support male idols who take good care of their male fans. Much love for them!

[witchcocktor]

I don't know. I mean outing someone is obviously a nasty thing to do, and completely detestable.

With that said, I'm still frustrated with successful, popular celebrities and artists deciding on a closeted life. They have a pedestal to do something amazing for the community, but they won't, or can't for whatever reason. That doesn't mean I support outing anyone but it doesn't take away my annoyance.

 

It's painfully obvious that it's the new generations of LGBT artists, celebrities, idols and talents that'll bring any kind of change to the entertainment industry. They cannot count on the older generation to do so, or to even support them. Thankfully some change is already happening, and we are just starting to see the change. One can only hope that the future generations, bless their hearts, have a wide variety of LGBT people to look up to, fictional and real.

Edited December 28, 2018 by witchcocktor