Official Vocals thread (READ OP FIRST)

[BabyKBK]

A baritone that "resonates" A4s to a classical standard

A large part of speaking/singing voice is culturally and socially defined. It's the reason why koreans like to think "light lyric" encompasses 98% of kpop when that's statisically impossible, and the only heavier voice types acknowledged by pop are black women lol

Didn't C.Y. say there were heavier baritones than him, but he's still lumped into dramatic baritone?

Sent from my LG-D852 using OneHallyu mobile app

A4?!!!! For a Baritone?!!!! WHAT l want receipts of this masterpiece and him photoshopped onto the vocal chart. I haven't heard many heavy baritones, at school our current vocal group is made up of mainly tenors and a few baritones. Ahmin's heavier than everyone in the school vocal group.

 

EDIT:CY Hyung where are U?? I am callinggggg youuuuu show yourself and let me hear your voi-oi-oi-woah woo woah woo oh oh woah woo oh oh oh oh OH OH WOW yeah-eah-eah-yeah-eah-yeah-ah-woo-hooooioo VOICE. Phew that run tho. 45 notes in 5 seconds, coloratura who?

Edited August 4, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

This is so true. I was having a conversation with my tutor the other day when I argued that even though he technically took me down to a G#2, I didn't feel like I could or should count that as part of my range because it was so quiet - and how would I be able to use that on stage? My voice doesn't need a mic even for relatively large orchestras and spaces etc. but I definitely would've for that. And his reply was that it's still part of my range but it's just not part of my tessitura, and that people tend to kind of use the word/term tessitura a little wrong these days.

 

Like yeah, I might be able to sing from G#2-C7, but my voice is most comfortable and most pleasant to the ear between E3 to E6 or so, and isn't that what a tessitura is?

Let's form the C7 club. I feel like almost everyone has 4 octave ranges secretly, albeit the extremes of their range being unpleasant. Most females and like a quarter of males have the potential for whistling right? That's what I heard somewhere. It's just most people haven't unlocked it. Edited August 5, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Sungjae teaching Rose how to hit them notes lol.

 

Does anyone notice Rose doesn't sound like she used to? Like she doesn't sound "forced" and "unique" like in Blackpink songs lol

 

 

Well she's kinda just shouting the high notes lol. Her predebut clips are better than her blackpink vocals so this leads me to think YG purposely wants Rose to sound a certain way on songs. Which is tragic..... I honestly hope Rose doesn't end up declining like Park bom. With correct technique Rose could achieve a level of skill that makes her sound MUCH MUCH better than she currently is with that super nasal style so honestly YG trying to make her sound "unique" with incorrect technique is so stupid and will be damaging in the long run. Edited August 5, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Well what do you know, here's an example of a Japanese vocalist who is not singing with a pushed down larynx to sound dark and yet still sounds fairly manly.

 

 

.........This is a guy right?? If this is a girl WHAT. Damn she darker than me and half of kpop males. No this must be a guy it can be it's impossible his baritoness is just so obvious. Now you're making me confused ahmin

This is the type of voice I imagine on like a big brute soldier or a wise old man or something.

 

EDIT: l imagine CY sounding like this.

Edited August 7, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

baritoness ?

 

it's a woman, she sounds like a woman but quite androgynous

Idk if I'm crazy but I hear a clear cut man xkdjxkdjdj. Like her voice is so dark and heavy and screams 50 year old dad I can't even. But then again l haven't had much interaction with contraltos. I don't even know any in real life. My perception of voices might be different coming from a family where every female is soprano and every male is tenor with light voices all round, none of us engage in much chest.

 

EDIT: I showed my parents and grandparents and they all thought it was a guy.

Edited August 7, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

No, I'm not Chinese, but I've lived in China for a year. Sorry it took me so long to get back to you; I just got back to Dixie, lol. In my opinion, Han Hong is great. She's one of the only sopranos I know with consistent support to around C3/C#3 and up to B5. Her mix is very heady, so I think some people wouldn't like her, but she has an amazingly-developed voice. I saw her live last year, and it was just unreal how good she was. She was trained in a classical conservatory under a classical instructor, and I think it's pretty evident in her singing. She's got a really strong foundation for her technique and support throughout her range. Her technique is so healthy. I do think she sometimes brings too much weight into her upper notes to get a more dramatic sound (not often), and it can make the vibrato too wide and slow, but usually she's really something else.

Ooh Dixie, I'm from Shanghai:). I thought Han Hong would be quite well developed! She always talks about how her training was strict on the Voice China and how if her voice was airy and unsupported her teacher would tell her to go home. I like her mix lol, it's so soothing.

[BabyKBK]

clearly he was talking about my breakdancing skills lol

 

1) yes, happens all the time in every single genre, both in famous contemporary singers and famous classical/opera singers. very VERY good faking, to the point that almost everyone can't tell.

You know I'm actually a Bass right? I only fake my voice, my range actually starts at F1.

 

Anyways lol I feel like a lot of Filipino singers try to fake bigger voices a lot. Literally a super low larynx is the to go method there. I feel like guys get mistyped a lot more than girls cause some of them(like some students at school) try to sound deeper cause they think it's not macho -_- Personally I'm a sucker for head dominant and light weight voices so I don't mind high voice faking( I even like it).

Edited August 15, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Wow at you being a shady,

again.

 

Lol so anyway, a lot of you stress the importance of developing a chest voice, but when exactly do you know you're transitioning from your chest to your mixed or head voice? I've been reading this for a while now and backtracked about 20 pages, but tbh, I'm learning new things, but at the same time, these new things confuse me a lot.

There should be a flip between your registers me a change in effort, tone and power( if your mix is heady or you use a weak falsetto it's more obvious with the transitions. Do you know Beyonces Halo? At the start of he song with remember those walls l built etc she uses chest and then in the Halo Halo chorus she's belting in mix. Then with the ooh ooh ooh parts near the end that's her voice. For me it feels like a flip like a change in gears. You should send a clip of you singing if you can't identify your registers. A good indicator that you're in mixed voice is if you're belting. A good way to find Head Voice is by singing ooh ooh.

 

omg F1?! OMGGGG okay you're definitely a bass xD I consider myself a low baritone and the lowest I can go is B1, even with vocal fry

 

 

 

I love this! Thanks <3

 

Her C5 in "Stuff Like That There" gets me every time tbh. Queen :')

The truth is l can't maintain tone below E3 and struggle for 100 years to hit my lowest note B2(some days l can't even hit C3). I know vocal fry is good for learning to connect chords but it can be damaging right?? Everytime l hear fry it sounds like the chords grinding together and l cry cause it sounds painful.

no because she's a pop singer lol

 

you know a lot of pop singers don't really have "depressed" larynx problems. They have constriction in some way of course, and their larynx may in a lower position of various degrees, but a larynx being much too low is more of a classical singer issue. It is possible even in pop but it's just not as frequent or extreme as people view it as. I don't like this way of describing things either because it makes singing with a lower larynx appear like a bad thing when it is the COMPLETE opposite when you do it correctly. There are a gazillion singers with their larynx fairly neutral and are still constricting a lot, but no one just goes and says "that note was bad because it was neutral larynx". and no one goes "that was a strained neutral larynx". But that's what happens with lower larynx singing. You are supposed to focus on the constriction, not the larynx being a bit lower lmao.

 

and btw all bigger singing is done with more depth/lower larynx positions, even the bigger voices people are used to hearing in pop are doing this to a noticeable degree

 

oh you like heady and light voices? I couldn't tell lol

Is it possible to achieve a large sound as well using 80% Head resonance and 20% chest resonance? I know it would sound lacking in depth but I'm trying to find pathways for my voice stylistically in the future when l train train train since That's more my vocal style l prefer. Edited August 15, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Thanks for the response! I guess I should make a recording because I'm still quite unsure. Aren't all falsettos weak? I thought it was impossible to support in falsettos... Also what are some examples of vocalists with a more heady mix, because until now almost every vocalist I've read about had a chesty or balanced mix and I don't know if my mix is either (though I'm pretty sure I'm on the more chestier side). When singing oohs, doesn't your voice at a certain point switch from an actual head voice to a falsetto? I think my head voice is pretty okay, but it could just be my falsettos aren't very airy. idek

Falsettos don't necessarily always have to be super airy, Theres varying degrees of control of airiness. Vocalists with headier mixes would be Jo Kwon, Eunji(I think she's more heady now than before) and Seohyun. Send a recording! I'm curious about your voice.

[BabyKBK]

Are you sure you mean like... E3? Because E3 isn't that low, especially for a bass :o are you sure you don't mean E2?

 

like, here's an example of my singing from A3-D4 :o

 

 

https://soundcloud.com/anthonykkokko/lion-heart-2017-06-13-1217-am

 

 

also im not trying to promote myself or anything, but if youre interested in hearing my voice, i sing with a pretty airy style xD

like in this cover i hit E4 a lot of times in the chorus, which is outside of my comfort range for belting, but its easy for me to phrase by making it super airy

 

https://soundcloud.com/anthonykkokko/cover-back-then-from

Lmao I was joking when I said I was a bass. I'm a very heady high tenor who has neglected to develop and explore chest register. I'll listen when I get home. Edited August 16, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Oh I didn't say there is no scientific basis, I just mean that if you look only at the frequency distribution charts, you can quite reliably tell who is not resonant, but you get some false positives that you have to listen to in order to strike them out.

 

I had to actually ask my tutor because the titles are entirely in Chinese characters haha but here are the links:

 

Here is without distortion:

 

 

And here is with distortion:

 

 

 

Boi if my lowest note is a G#2 you can hit a B2 you flop

(jk ily <3)

TBH there's not really a need to go that low tho. Pop songs very very very rarely go into 2nd octave for our voice types. When do you start struggling?? I start struggling to death at around Eb3.

 

jo kwon isn't heady where did you heard that he was heady?

Wait mess an error on my part. I was trying to use him as an example of someone who uses a light approach which I like but my lack on concentration when I typed his name faultered me. Edited August 16, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

I tried teaching myself how to do a blues/soul/gospel growl but i'm failing at it. I mean I can growl but it's more growl than tone, so it sounds like the cookie monster if I fuck up. I prefer to sing clean but it's just a little stylistic tool that I want, but it's hard for me to get the growl to be sustained with the note or phrase.

 

5:56- 5:60

 

 

random but Mahalia Jackson grew up listening to Enrico Caruso as a teenager. they needed their voices to carry in churches without mics at times back then too so singing with depth and chest has remained a thing today especially with female singers in similar styles

 

or a better example actually, since this guy is a baritone like me @ 1:06-1:10 or 3:11 - 3:15

 

Please post some clips hehe I want to hear you singggggg. Is growling considered a bad vocal habit and damaging ? I've heard people say it's bad technique but others say it's not. I'm curious cause Beyonce does growl when belting at times although she has shown she's capable of belting the same notes without growls. Personally if I sound growly on a note l tell myself it's time to sleep and go on vocal rest LOL. Literally clean or no singing.

 

Lmao I know I'm just teasing ya - altho keep working on your chest voice because dem muscles will help you so much in your mix. I'm only really 'reliable' down to C3, although that is still low in volume. Below that I struggle to go on my own, but my tutor (who never takes no for an answer lmao) could probably take me down to like an F2 lmao

 

I'm not sure exactly what my tutor means or what he's thinking when he says this (most of my other voice tutors said it too, even those I only went to for one or two sessions) but he always tells me I have so much potential, and that's why he always pushes me to go lower/higher when we do scales. He's also always like 'why'd you stop? you can keep going' when I say I can't go lower/higher.

 

OML when I had a tutor 1million years ago I went down to A2 every time we did scales. Unfortunately my voice especially chest voice has regressed since my younger years( I used to be chesty like mamamoo btw). Although I have gained more whistle range now hehe. I'm really scared of getting pushed by tutors cause I always have this fear that my vocal cords will get wrecked and start bleeding and get permanent damage like Adele and others( although I know Adele uses a much more chestier approach and females are much more likely to get vocal damage) still tho it haunts me at night. I don't wanna be mute before I turn 18. Edited August 16, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Lmao I fell asleep so I forgot to upload my "covers" onto Soundcloud, but anyway, I just uploaded two. They're shit quality, but a good representation of what my voice is currently capable of (though neither songs were very challenging lol)

 

https://soundcloud.com/user-593329090/teenage-fantasy-short-attempt

 

https://soundcloud.com/user-593329090/work-song-short-attempt

Slayyyyyyy I love your voice, have such a soulful voice. Both your covers are in a comfortable range. Your voice reminds me of someone but I can't put my finger on it. What's your Range??

 

Are you sure you mean like... E3? Because E3 isn't that low, especially for a bass :o are you sure you don't mean E2?

 

like, here's an example of my singing from A3-D4 :o

 

 

https://soundcloud.com/anthonykkokko/lion-heart-2017-06-13-1217-am

 

 

also im not trying to promote myself or anything, but if youre interested in hearing my voice, i sing with a pretty airy style xD

like in this cover i hit E4 a lot of times in the chorus, which is outside of my comfort range for belting, but its easy for me to phrase by making it super airy

 

https://soundcloud.com/anthonykkokko/cover-back-then-from

Ooh ok you don't actually sound that deep or dark for a baritone tbh, you don't sound like a low baritone to my ears at least. Your pitch is decent and good most of the time.I'm impressed by your Chinese btw, as a native speaker I can actually understand a lot of what you're singing and your tones aren't bad, do you take lessons?? Your vibrato was delayed at some moments like at 1:29 but I actually really like your vibrato and the tone of your voice, it soothes me. You aren't a chesty mixer. I like your back then cover a lot better cause in Lion heart at the start it almost sounds like you're trying to copy sooyoungs voice LOL. In lion heart you can clearly hear the transitions in your voice. The chorus was mix except for the tell me why and nae gata which were head. Do you hear the quality difference?? Could you feel the flip when you were singing that? I really like your voice :chu;

 

Oh my tutor has me do it in a healthy way haha and like if he hears me doing it wrong he stops me and tells me what to change. He also asks me how my throat is feeling after I go from doing it wrong to doing it right. Also when we do scales I don't use mixed voice, it's mostly just a matter of bridging from chest voice to head voice and not making the switch in quality too obvious or abrupt.

 

With mix though, usually I come to him with songs where I'm struggling in my mix (usually because the song starts low and goes higher and I don't lighten it enough) and he just forces more head voice exercises on me despite anything I say hahaha (it does help tho)

how much stamina do you usually have lol?? Even when I was taking lessons my stamina was really bad. My teacher thought I was lazy but l don't think my muscles allow me to sing for a full hour yet. That's one of my concerns with lessons lol singing a full hour. Edited August 16, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

oh i'm sorry...I'm very confused LOL but welcome back

 

 

i'm not too sure what that sounds like lol. Are there male singers that you like and wish to sound like as a goal? You don't need to worry about "depth" as a male pop singer, I mean you need just enough to not be completely high larynx or whatever but that's all.

My goal is to be like a headier version of Ryeowook and Jo Kwon that also utilises whistle register in singing. I honestly struggle with my larynx a lot it seems no matter what I do to try stop it going up it keeps going everywhere. Although I do feel like I've improved since I last send recordings here. I think my voice is more connected now.

 

Is it bad that I keep thinking your name stands for Chinese New Year except missing a N. I feel hungry now yum yum. I really want to add that N.

Edited August 16, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Oh back when my technique was bad my stamina was also bad, I worked for like half a year to be able to sing my 15 minute scholarship repertoire when I was 16/17.

 

Now I can pretty much sing forever though. My vocal chords don't ache or hurt in that 'tired' way at all when I sing properly. If they start hurting it's because I'm mixing or placing wrong so I stop and do head voice exercises. Then I lighten my mix by starting from head voice and adding in chest instead of the other way round, which is harder for me because I tend to not lighten enough and that hurts my vocal chords.

Hehe I avoid this problem by using sneaky ways. I'm in the school vocal group and we perform at end of school assemblies and stuff but the thing is we can pre record our vocals. lip sync nation till l can get a healthy technique. Edited August 16, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

Y-You're a f-fraud!! HOW DARE YOU BESMIRCH THE SACRED VOCAL PRACTICE IN THIS WAY

 

No but in all seriousness I've never heard of a choir prerecording their vocals lmao

Lmao , I could see myself doing this if my school allowed it

Well our vocal group is small lol(8 people) it's a contemporary vocal group not really like a choir in the traditional sense lol. I think it's good cause we can do so much more with our voices in pre recordings since we can record multiple takes. I managed to pre record a fluke E5( why was I trying an E5 don't ask why) I did a fluke one after 1026838363828 tries. All my E5s are so squeezed and strained I won't even try b

ut the fluke one is slightly better, at least bearable but obviously still high larynx and forced to no tommorrow(like those twinkle F#5s)

.

Edited August 16, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

I'm

lol thanks baby! (wait should i call you baby, kbk, or babykbk lol) i guess im not a low baritone, just an untrained one :p (and pssst im actually chinese lol. but i speak canto mainly so my mandarin isnt perfect.) but thanks for listening to my covers ^^ yeahhh in back then i was deliberately trying to minimize the chest in my mix since i had to sing a lot of E4s xD but when i sing in a more medium range, im a lot chestier. in lion heart i wasnt trying to be sooyoung lol but i was trying to channel the playful tone of the song, so it might have been a bit excessive hehe. when i was younger, i didnt understand how to use head voice, so i was either using chest voice or falsetto, which made my singing really awkward because i couldnt make smooth transitions between the two, and  there was just that abrupt cut-off in the middle of my range. but as i got older, i started using head voice more and more, and now i think i lost the ability to use my falsetto D: i probably still can, but its been so unused that its hard for me to even access that "flip" in my voice anymore. so now when i sing high notes, i just use a heady mix instead :o (or maybe i dont, im still not good with technical terms lol)

Omg you can call me any of those but most people here call me babykbk. OMG you're canto ehdhfkeujsdusj I thought your tones were a bit

Too accurate for a foreigner. I sing with a super heady mix lol. I lost my falsetto as well but I heard it's normal when you learn Head Voice. It's better to use Head Voice since it's healthier so the ideal is to extend your head voice as high as possible..

 

 

Actually, scratch me saying I don't know my range lol. It's actually E3-F5(F#5) I have a tragic lower range with an okay upper range. I didn't make notes of my comfortable range though. When it comes to singing I want to develop both my upper and lower range, but idk what has priority lol.

  

 

Considering you're a male and your lower range only extends to E3 and your chest is weak start with chest. My chest is very underdeveloped as well but l can sing in a high range easily. There's no use in singing high if you can't support it and don't have the basics of chest coordination first is what I've learnt so I'm working on chest more now to develop support and strengthen my mix. Of course that doesn't mean only work on chest but you should try to develop it it's super important.

[BabyKBK]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXmeo84RMlg

 

Out of the idols who were there they definitely could have picked better people for this song, or at the very least have arranged and distributed it to better fit Hwasa and Seulgi's voices.

Oml this surprised me a bit. The arrangement is really tragic....... this version was honestly so anti climatic and flat to me. But at least they dodged some of the Bang Bang high notes and avoided some pain.... The worst collabs I've seen were definetly the Ailee and Girls Day problem cover and the infamous Chandelier cover with ChoA but this is by far the worst and might I add the LAZIEST arrangement. Edited August 17, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

someone or maybe more than one person has been consistently downvoting me for whatever reason, and I don't care about that at all but if you think what I am saying is so wrong, just openly debate me on it here because that would be more useful than a downvote

 

no it's almost certainly at Bb3/Eb4, A3 is a bass-baritone's first passaggio.

I've noticed the downvoting too but I've been liking posts to reverse this stuff. I'll help you Chinese N.... l mean CY hyung. CY what do you think of the baritenor voice type LMAO. I heard it being discussed online a lot by self proclaimed vocal experts and what's your passagio? I still haven't heard you sing DAMMIT(mainly cause I don't know how to find the vocal clips you posted). Edited August 17, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

I feel so freakin bad for teachers tbh. Constantly shouting over classes and getting paralysed. Now finally some rooms at my school have microphones. Phew. Now if only they would invent vocal chord replacement surgery so everyone can have a damage free Voice forever.

Edited August 19, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

From Changmins analysis:

"His throat tends to also close, the back of his tongue tensing up and his larynx raising, causing the sound to become thin, tight and nasal overall. He has the bad tendency of choosing to constantly sing songs that stay in this range, going high up above on C5’s quite often, straining his voice every single time he chooses to sing up this high. He does not tend to get throaty or push his chest voice up, but rather produce a heady nasal whiny sound which still will damage his voice over time."

 

Was ahmin secretly writing about me omg. I didn't know Changmin could mix G5 tho WHUT. The male Sohyang with lesser technique.

Edited August 19, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

If I was a teacher I'd just find an something that makes an extremely unpleasant sound or other and just use that every time I want the class's attention lmao

Like, oh idk, an airhorn or smth :P

Lol I think it's more than just get attention. It's the fact that they constantly have to project their voice for people at the back of a classroom or hall for like 6+ hours daily. I can't imagine projecting for 6 hours. Even talking normally for 6 hours straight already sounds like a painful ordeal. I usually try to talk without projecting and and less as possible for Voice care. I got a check up recently and my vocal chords are in tip top shape and the doctor said it's not necessary but still for safety lol.

 

EDIT-Sang an accidental C7 as a result from a very sharp B6. I'm starting to have more control on F#6 but above that is still a wild mess. I can sustain a G6 occasionally.

Edited August 19, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

I'm not too familiar with vocal analyzing and such yet and i was just wondering

 

sustained note at 3:14 is a D5 right?

 

 

was it executed better than her D5 at 4:04?

 

Yes it's D5. But none of these D5s are well executed or supported it's out of her supported range. Edited August 20, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

I need advice for how to stop voice envy lmao

 

Like ever since I started singing I've wanted the typical light lyric soprano voice where you sound so like free and light and fluid and instead I got this heavy ass dramatic soprano voice and I get envious of the girls I tutor sometimes

 

AND YES I am aware of the irony that I am a soprano complaining about how I want a different subtype of soprano but you don't understand my struggle

Well I don't have a heavy voice but l totally understand everyone wants the freeness of a light Lyric soprano on those highs Just be happy that you can drown out a light Lyric easily tho. You won't envy what you can't hear hehe. I hope I'm a leggero pls pls pls. Edited August 22, 2017 by BabyKBK

[BabyKBK]

 But it doesn't even matter that I can drown out anybody these days when we have microphones and I just  

 

Like in a really weird way I feel ripped off because I'm a soprano and this is bullshit I shouldn't be feeling this way  

If only one day I could make a dramatic tenor feel the same way about me.... JK

 

I enjoy your rich tone. Work it girl, a well trained dramatic slays a light Lyric. Caprinhas is a lower soprano/higher mezzo as well.