Official Vocals thread (READ OP FIRST)

[Chungie]

I'm not sure where, and it might not be very supported but there was some of it, I guess it was on her live vocal range video. Yeah Gaga has got a very solid lower range, I remember Ahmin saying he was shocked since it was as effortless as speaking for her, but Beyoncé still has a hand since she supports lower and does have chest resonance and good placement even in such lows

Ahhh that's alright. It's good that Beyonce can sing B2 with support lol This makes her supported range wider lol

[Chungie]

I guess she doesn't have the B2s consistent XD but hey having C3 or even C#3 for a coloratura mezzo is impressive af  :rlytearpls:

Now if only some Kpop females could support notes below mid-3rd octave lol

[Chungie]

seriously though wtf is going on here lol why cant she pronounce words properly  :rlytearpls: If i didn't already know the words I probably wouyld have understood only 1/3 of it. Has her diction always been this bad?

https://www.facebook.com/ArianaHelpedMeWhenNobodyElseDid/videos/1035081346505001/

lol no it wasn't this bad before. But it wasn't great even then.

Edited September 28, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cS-IiArGmcU&app=desktop

 

0:44 and a few other times, supported C3's for Kim Jinho. Good, it's expected of a baritone though. He sings with a somewhat locked jaw and doesn't relax it nor drop it low enough to create a more opened sound in his voice, as I'm noticing from the falsetto section. He has a bad habit of keeping his neck tight and stretched up, which also causes tension. 1:57 very nice full chesty resonance on that E4. He could relax more. 2:17 strained G4. He can often sound quite tight due to his jaw position, but he does have good placement and resonance up to E4. 3:39 ~ 4:01 strained G4's all over. Beautiful song though. Differently from Hwang Chiyeol, Kim Jinho pushes too much chest voice up in his mix and becomes really throaty around F4 and higher, too much jaw tension. It's fascinating to compare baritones. (I should make a post/video about Baritones in K-pop)

Isn't that SG Wannabe's vocalist?

[Chungie]

Teaser 1 for VTBoys' debut! (I just came up with "VTBoys now, if you have a better suggestion pls tell me lol)

 

Note that our actual debut song will be in video form.

This is just the first chorus of the song in acapella, so without the instrumental.

Look forward to the full song hehehe....... 

 

Wear earphones pls~

https://soundcloud.com/anthonykkokko/mr-mr-teaser-1

 

p.s. it sounds like I'm being extra, but I really only have lines around the beginning and then I disappear at the end lmao. 

Matty and Keith are main singers, I'm lead, and for our debut, Daniel is supporting but it's only because he requested for less lines - I'll eventually force him to be a lead with me later on because his voice is good too!

Matty - leader, main vocalist

Keith - main vocalist, represents us on variety shows (hehe)

Daniel - maknae, vocalist (soon to be lead)

Anthony - lead vocalist, visual (hehe jks everyone is a visual hehehehehe)

I'll post the lyrics along with who's singing them onto the video so that ya'll can follow along hehehehe

 

omg  :hurr:  :hurr:  :ahmagah:  :ahmagah: 

 

 

It sure is. Baritone. 

You are finding Baritones left and right LOL

 

oh so there is a reason lol

 

ya like ive watched some performances before where the diction was just annoying but this is like inaudible lmao

 

And can I just say wow beyonce's stamina is amazing  :rlytearpls: like I thought lady gaga had pretty good stamina with all the dances and movements in her concerts and she gets noticeably exhausted and her technique suffers slightly but she still sings well and still sings majority of the songs entirely, leaving only usually the chorus to backtracking and I thought that was already really great but i just watched a bunch of beyonce concert vids and damn that gurl doesnt seem phased at all  :stare: amazeballs

Whenever I hear her sing it's like she's just using vowels without closing it. :derp:
I don't even understand her in studios let alone live.

[Chungie]

he said that Hoya and Sunggyu were his favorite 'students' so he taught them I guess

and I quite don't get who you are talking about in the last sentence

Sungyeol and Sungjong, who else :smile:

[Chungie]

aah yess, isn't it like Sungyeol is the one who asks for less lines ?

But you know, Sungjong is the one who has like no work outside Infinite lol Sungyeol atleast does dramas.

[Chungie]

yeah he should get something out

Prolly not lol

 

Don't hate! He's my fav! 

 

I'm not hating!!!

pls anticipate  :smile:

Okay so I got lazy and I just uploaded the song on soundcloud  :rlytearpls:

 

This is kind of a hot mess but it's okay

 

https://soundcloud.com/anthonykkokko/mr-mr-collab

 

Lyric split:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1LA3sCo7lyTYQ-4doolSk3n5NBNy3cr3UmXU8qcVurVQ/edit?usp=sharing

I shall start the hate-dom :smile: :donthinkso:

[Chungie]

Taeyeon solo debut on Oct 7 !! #prayforgoodD5s

 

I hope its not all ballads though

 

#PrayItFlopsHard :hurr:

THEN DRAG AND EXPOSE SIS!

What :unsure:

[Chungie]

Wow you guys are serious? lol Korean is super easy IMO the words are easier and simpler to pronounce. I can more or less sing/read Korean without needing the romanisations and just seeing the Hangul lol Japanese though.. I find it harder especially when they skip on syllables (which are always written in the romajis lol).

Edited October 4, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

I find korean easy now, but starting out, the romanization systems are less intuitive (for someone with an american english background) than the japanese romanization, and it does have more sounds than japanese does... and I didn't have any guidance on how to pronounce things beyond my own ears, so it was a bit tricky.  Yeah, japanese songs feel like they can be tricky to sing not so much because of actual pronunciation but because rhythmically how the lines come out can also be unintuitive.  Kpop feels more straightforward.

Most Korean words are similar to my mother tongue, so maybe that's why I found it easier to learn. But really? Every hangul guide I found online had guides on how to read a word and the rules of basic writing. So that is weird lol

 

And pretty much. Singing Japanese while reading lyrics is tough imo because the way the words are sung is tricky. So I find Korean miles easier to read/sing lol

Edited October 4, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

Yes!!! @Uji analysis.

 

lol, glad to be of service.

 

I never actually consulted any hangul guides when I started, I just dove in. XD  With Japanese it was just... obvious, even before I had any formal instruction in Japanese... also pretty much the same as Spanish.

 

Anthony will be sad. XD

 

The non-title track I like from AOA is Come To Me... I think it would be like A#2-D4?

lol then you don't know how easy learning how to read and write Korean is xD Japanese is way harder lol

Edited October 5, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

No, I'm aware that Korean essentially just has an alphabet, and I get the gist of how the characters are constructed even if I can't read them.  Japanese can go to hell (although I can read furigana just fine).  My Chinese sucked too much to help me when I was learning Japanese. XD

Japanese reading and writing truly can go to hell LOL! XD

[Chungie]

Is the G5~Bb5 head voice?

Yes it is.

[Chungie]

I didn't check the video yet but Taeyeon did hit Bb5 with head voice? isn't that some improvement since she didn't use to have access to her head voice ?

IDK what criteria is to be considered. I personally don't count a note if they aren't good when evaluating someone lol

[Chungie]

who needs practice when you have divine hair-dye powers lmao

Maybe I should dye my hair blonde as well then lmao

[Chungie]

wot @ comparing two singers of different eras. 

And basically range is irrelevant if the notes aren't well supported.  Falsetto /fry/whistle don't really add anything technically to a person other than more range because, unless I'm mistaken (and someone correct me if I'm wrong pls) you can't resonate with any of those and what we really care about is resonance. 

Not true. Whistles requires training, if they are to be used properly. Not everyone who accesses whistles uses it well.. Mariah was a master of that register. So it actually counts as an advantage for her. Falsetto and fry are different stories, especially vocal fry. Almost no one uses vocal fry when they count range.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

as far as I know, yes, slightly. I mean Beyoncé is better currently with no doubt since Mariah has her instrument damaged and all, but back to their primes, and from what I know of Bey and from what her fans told me, she used to have much backup and MR usage in her performances even in her prime, they assumed that her actual LIVE supported range  is something around E3-Eb5/E5, whereas she could support much higher (and lower) in studio, up to ... G#5 or A5 with mixed voice .. idk tbh, but she isn't as stellar live from what Ive been told, she has inconsistency with keeping the larynx neutral and optimising her throat shape above Eb5, so like if we happen to compare, Beyoncé

-has a better lower range, a very solid one down to C3/C#3 with actual chest resonance and forwardness in such a low range

- has a somewhat better mixed range, I'm sure again about how consistent Mariah was with her mixed voice live but Beyoncé had consistency of resonance and good placement on F5 and even F#5, for a mezzo that's quite... high 

- has a better head voice with no doubt, it is all due to Mariah's style since she relied more on her whistle register and she didn't tend much for head voice even if hers is developed and highly supported and all, whereas Beyoncé's head voice is just beautiful up to D6/Eb6, and again for a mezzo that's high

- has great agility, Mariah has great one likewise but I read people saying Beyoncé could perform faster rund than Mariah (?), not sure about this one but they both yeah have great contemporary coloratura skill.

so all in all without mentionning other things, Beyoncé sounds like she could be considered better than Mariah Carey, I'm sure about the infos about Carey but I believe Beyoncé was slightly better, actually better live than Mariah (and I hope Bey stop growling for fuck's sake)

I really hope those are some credible a f fans that you're taking opinions from  :soul: . I really don't know the exact answer to this either, but I just want to bring up some points for the sake of clarity.

 

The thing about Mariah's prime is that people debate her live consistency with disregard for her innate vocal health. If she was properly warmed up, she could do all the things that are associated with her prime with ease; without proper warm-up, she would do the things that were associated with her vocal decline lol. This isn't exactly an issue about technique as much as it's an issue of her inconsistent vocal condition when performing. You really don't go from live resonant G5s~ to not as good E5~, back to resonating G5s~ in the next concert because your technique is lacking, unless I'm mistaken; it would be more of a vocal health thing, no? Also, you keep saying "For a Mezzo, that's really high" a mezzo is like.. 1 note below a soprano... really, the difference between a well-trained mezzo and a well-trained soprano is 1-3 steps, really, depending on which soprano and which mezzo you're comparing.  

Directly comparing points:
-Are you saying Mariah didn't have a developed lower range because I'm pretty sure she had tone down quite far, fullness down to about Eb3 @ "Without you" and "Vision of Love", maybe D3 with Emotions. Going off the top of my head, tho.
-Mixed range I brought up first already
-Head voice.. Okay imho her head voice was her weakest register, with only going up to was it C#6/D6 before she relied on whistles? But it was by no means weak, just comparatively to her Mixed and Lower registers it her weakest register, esp with expectations of her as a soprano 
-I really don't know about agility. Tbqh I really can only hear about 5-6 notes a second and any faster it takes a lot of listening.. like a lot. Bey's "fastest" runs (the one off the top of my head would be from Bootylicious) are faster than this tho.

In the end, I really don't know who's better between the two of them. Bey has made meticulous effort to keep her voice in good condition, though, and has always had a vocal coach through the years of her career, while I believe Mariah didn't through her prime. 

Again, I really hope you have some credible a f fans you're taking opinions from  :soul:

Lexi is right. Beyonce is not better Mariah. Mariah is not better than Beyonce. They pretty much even out.

 

Mariah's prime was highly hindered with her vocal nodules, which easily fatigued her. But when she was rested well, and had proper warm-up, she was brilliant. Beyonce is a coloratura mezzo, so a coloratura's mezzo's tessitura is higher than other mezzos, so F5s and F#5s are not high for her. Hell from what Haruko has said, Anastacia has resonated an A5, and she's a dramatic mezzo, now that is a criteria to hold. The counter to this maybe "Mariah's a coloratura soprano as well", but as mentioned above she was highly hindered by her nodules, but when she could she did F5s, F#5s and G5s brilliantly live.

 

Also if Beyonce hitting F5/F#5s as a mezzo is to be used, then there's another counter argument to this - Mariah's lower register. She supported her low notes down to E3s consistently, and sometimes below E3s (even though they muddled out a bit), which is amazing for a "coloratura soprano".

 

Beyonce's mixed range is not better than Mariah. She might have more volume because of her voice, but Mariah's mixes are superb, even though chesty. I will not say one is better than the other, because both have great mixes.

 

That is true. Beyonce's HV is better. Mariah's HV is not as developed as Beyonce or Whitney.

 

Not true. Mariah's runs are faster. Mariah has done some of the fastest runs in pop music - Butterfly run is a good example. While yes Beyonce's agility is great, but Mariah had a faster voice.

 

I'd advise you to not listen to either Beyonce or Mariah fans (and Whitney fans). They are crazily biased and gives BS infos. I've seen Mariah fans say Beyonce is closed throated strainer.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

I again have only been told so, the dude who did knows somehow what he's saying, I have no credit of all what I said about Mariah, so I'm being corrected here since I'm not a fan,  I replied to Lexi with what I know as far, I don't know what is bey's fastest speed nor Mariah's so I said both have great agilities, again agility isn't a very crucial standpoint to judge voice as much as it comes for registers and tonality. Beyoncé is coloratura as well, and she supports down to C3 with resonance, have shown some support on even B2s and kept tone down to ... G2 ? so like both have great lower ranges but Beyoncé slightly stands out here since both are the highest types of their principal voice types and Beyoncé's placement was somehow better, slightly.

I will take out what I said about Beyoncé having a better mixed range, I actually meant a more 'consistent' live mixed register, which is something we all agree of, both are coloraturas so the comparison goes basically with soprano and mezzo as basic voice types. I'm glad everyone agrees on how Beyoncé's HV is better  :rlytearpls: , and again, I have told all the stuff of Mariah so if anything is slightly declined in what I said please take it lightly since I am now being corrected

Coloratura mezzo's lower register is part of their range though (Operatic coloratura mezzos have very developed lower register + upper extension higher than normal mezzos) lol so her supporting down to C3s is not really an argument in the for column lol

 

lol Beyonce's HV is better, no brainer. It's very well developed. Rn, the only people I can think of who has HV developed around her level are Sohyang and Natalie Weiss.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

why not ? as Lexi said, mezzos are 2/3 steps down compared to sopranos, so Mariah's E3 with that would equal C#3 or D3 for a mezzo, both are coloratura and I didn't say coloratura mezzos don't happen to have a very developed lower range, Im just comparing both of their lows, so it seriously goes C3/C#3 for Beyoncé, put as D3/Eb3 for a coloratura soprano, which isn't something Mariah consistently had in her supported range, you mentionned how Mariah had present tone lower than that, I said that Beyoncé did as well have present tone in such lows, so I don't see why bringing Beyoncé's C3 has nothing to do with this comparison tbh

Here's how it went lol:

- You said Beyonce had F5s and F#5s for a mezzo. I countered it by saying shes a coloratura mezzo so their range consists of higher extension.

-And you bringing that up, brought up another counter argument to it. Mariah's lower register and her being a lyric coloratura.

-You countered that by saying Beyonce has C3s for a coloratura.

-I added coloratura mezzos lower extension is supposed to be well developed, so it's not an argument for her lol

 

Lol this is getting confusing. Let's leave it at they are excellent. :lol: :lol: It's like comparing Sohyang and Beyonce xD

 

Vanessa Amorosi has a brilliant lower register, and a great mix (she gets throaty both me and Haruko noticed that but that's more stylistic I think). But not a good HV, and she rarely uses them as well.

Monica Naranjo has a better lower register than Sohyang but no HV. Her mixes are brilliant though. Vanessa and Naranjo both lack connected registers though.

From what I've heard from Lara Fabian, her mid belts are brilliant as well. But not a good lower register, and have no idea about upper extension (if she even has one lol).

 

lol This discussion could be interesting.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

omg haha okay, I just happen to agree with all of what you said, I took down my say on Bey having a better mixed range, turning it into having a more consistent one. yeah let' leave it that way, they all used to have very great registers, at least now Beyoncé is fortunately keeping the spirit up  :meow:

lol Read what I added after edit.

[Chungie]

!'m completely unaware of Monica's technique but like really her head voice wasn't that developed ? I agree on the Vanessa thing since I checked some stuff of her and her head voice is .. weird, it has chest in it, it reminds me of Lee Younghyun in a way, I mean her head voice would have some steel to it since she's a  dramatic soprano but it really has some .. chest in it from what I have listened to

Vanessa rarely uses her HV. She just mixes everything besides that.

 

Is/was Anastacia as good as Beyonce? A5... that's only a couple of notes behind Sohyang's highest resonated note.

I've no idea. I remember Haruko mentioned her resonating on an A5 on YT longtime ago. I personally do not know any songs by her.

[Chungie]

sadly no, you could slightly get some right informations on the 'comments' in divadevotee but it's full of fans and bs and bias tbh

lmao divadevotee is BS, it makes Kongwee's comments look like true musical theory.

 

I'd love a discussion on Aretha/Patti/Barbra  :ahmagah:

She's a rock singer. That's kind of.. their thing, isn't it?

Are we bringing up heavier voiced singers because I see a dramatic soprano, a comparison of dramatic vs w.e SH is because people can't settle on something, and a Full Lyric.

Wait, I was under the impression that Vanessa Amorosi was considered excellent. This is giving me the impression she's not quite excellent? 

Lara Fabian was classically trained, so like... I hope she has a developed upper extension. I know she has a head voice, tho, but I really don't know that much about her. 

 

 

Unfortunately, no. The closest you could get would be having the Singwise lady give her 2 cents on a singer, probably, since she seems to be the only credible person who is remotely interested in analyzing contemporary artists, but her perspective is majorly classical. Do not trust Divadevotee / criticofmusic... too much bias. 

 

Vanessa is great, no question. Excellent is a thing I cannot comment on.

lol No. Just the so called "best" in the world ones.

 

I DID NOT know Lara was classically trained. Her legato is just amazing.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r18oGfyWmLg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiUtGBD0gXI

 

 

Her voice is... unique.

Fantastic elastic

lol it is. She's the only dramatic mezzo I know about. But I find it unpleasant... which is why I don't listen to her lol

[Chungie]

the thing is , in divadevotee, the only right things are the weaknesses lol the usual strength part is just bs, TOO much bias, TOO much biased description and sugarcoating, like they here say X's mix is great, whereas they say they have laryngeal issues in the weaknesses like .. ?? I only check divadevotee for the vocal ranges, I absorb nothing else, and the comments are bullshit
is divadevotee the site saying Justin Bieber is nasal as fuck but has resonance on C5 ? like what kind of bs is this , this could start a world war like wtf is this outrageous contradiction

The thing about DD which annoys me is the voice typing. DD called Adele, Toni Braxton, Alicia Keys, Rihanna etc. "CONTRALTOS". Lea Michelle an "Alto", etc. like wtf. First of all don't mix up contralto and alto. Contralto is the voice type, alto is the line in music. Secondly, stop calling everyone a contralto lol

 

 

 

I think some of it has to do with her phrasing/dialect too

With a more traditional mezzo/soprano voice she would have probably been more popular.

But with the diseases and illnesses she's gone through, her story is quite inspirational

I've no idea about that. But she had resonant moments in the videos. And projecting D3s... that lower register lol

Edited October 11, 2015 by Chungie

[Chungie]

omg damn, did they really use both terms, like usually people stick to one term, but like this .... 

 

 

 

and wait , Anastacia is .. a mezzo ? dramatic mezzo ? and she can mix B5 and have resonance on A5? this' SO WOAH  :omg:

like her .. her G5s/ G#5s are nice, the steel though .. I don't like that quality tbh

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJBIXtucw4s

Yeah they did. But even worse is how the hell can they call Rihanna a contralto lol

 

 

 

http://www.livetheshade.com/2012/06/series-first-instalment-in-vocal-summer.html

Oh wow I forgot about that one.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Chungie