Official Vocals thread (READ OP FIRST)

[caipirinhas]

@ahmin and @cy

 

Which singers who have below average technique do you have a ~soft spot for? Like, they have an interesting color, and you enjoy listening to them. Strained singing and all?

 

I have a few myself. So, I'm lowkey curious.

[ParkHyoLee]

ah shit woops I forgot to timestamp something very important

 

 

listen to 5:56 in the above video again, she sings in a thin mix voice with no depth. Compare that with the rest of her E5s in the video. Now of course, she is purposely doing it exaggerated and making it whiny and nasal. But the thing is, if she just made it a bit less exaggerated and sang it more seriously with a tinge more depth, it could pass for bubblegum "light lyric" pop singing.

 

Screaming at how big the difference is 

 

i was binge watching covers of Tears lmao this song is fucking great all these high notes have been giving me life 

I am physically tired from intensely lipsynching to this song for a good hour now 

Yeah i really had no idea he was a guy o.0 thanks!

Tbh ain't nobody actually trying to hear exactly where a person is straining and KOMS's sound system has some next magic to it, so 

 

What are some songs or performances that have lots of high notes that you LOVE like even if its all strain

you're just like YASSS SLAYYY   

 

some examples:

 

Of course, Slayriah Anytime You Need A Friend: 34 D5s, 18 E5s, 17 F5s, 9 G5s, 

 

 

 

SNSD You Think - they were just like fuck it we aren't gonna sing this live anyway let's throw in Fs and Gs 

 

 

 

Ariana Grande Break Free - she decided to break free from logic and belt out tons of high notes. You may ask, why did i use a fancam instead of a real performance video? Well there are shirtless backup dancers so yeah 

 

 

 

PS. Yes i know this is bad for the singers and will hurt them in the long run if they are straining it, but it is enjoyable nonetheless 

 She also broke free from clear enunciation in all her live perfs of it  Jk love her tho #KweenOfNobodyKnowingWhatShesSaying. Rihanna is shook

 

The lowest note here is E4 lol. After the intro she immediately starts sitting at Eb5 and only goes up from there  

 

 

 

 

weave dragging

I am SHOOK  My weave has been snatched by the pitch accuracy and the resonance on your Eb5  

 

Anyway, omg you finally shared your singing with the thread   

Edited April 16, 2017 by ParkHyoLee

[caipirinhas]

Yeah, health issues. With reminds me to ask you, are there any thyroid issues that can hurt your voice?

 

idk if there are commonly accepted/documented vocal risks with thyroid disease. However, I went to school for classical voice while simultaneously dealing with Grave's Disease -> thyroid ablation -> total thyroidectomy and have been singing the whole time. So, I can share at least my ~personal experience.

 

I think forms of Hyperthyroidism that present with goiter (as in an actual growth in the area) can physically inhibit proper phonation because there is a literal thing there that shouldn't be there. But in my experience, the only real effect it had was related to my general health. Thyroid disease presents in about a BILLION ways, but if you are generally unwell, your singing can suffer. Left untreated, any thyroid disease can affect your singing because you are sick. And the voice relies so heavily on physical health to be at its best. 

 

I remember being scared when I had my thyroidectomy. The most common surgical risk is longterm hoarseness if the nerves in the area get pushed around too much. I was very lucky that I was in good shape pretty immediately. And I'm still singing today. And sound pretty much the same. I occasionally have more tightness in my neck area than I like, but I think a lot of that is psychosomatic. 

 

anyhoo, I just ranted for a really long time lmao sorry

[AhMin]

 

 

 

honestly there's so much to say to that but I just decided to show some examples instead of a long essay. First off, listen to that guy Kevin posted. That is what an actual higher tenor sounds like when singing very very thin. That is what someone with an actual higher passaggi sounds like. Taeyang could not possible make any sound like that on those pitches. I can hear his passaggi just fine. The problem is you have objectively incorrect passaggi locations and your concept of a "baritone" sound is limited by your own opinions. It's like how most people think masculine heavy voice = baritone, now you wouldn't agree, but that is the general opinion is it not? See all I'm doing is taking the parameters for what a baritone sounds like further than you do, just like you take them further than the average person.

 

you also might be misunderstanding that I don't just think Taeyang is like this one guy who is baritone that sounds diff than most others like Key and Junho. The truth is there are much more ways for a baritone to sound than you think, he is not actually the only baritone in kpop you are calling a tenor....such as JYP LOL. Taeyang and JYP are just the baritone equivalent of the feminine sounding guy from masked singer, that's all. Nothing peculiar about it to me. I'm surprised your concept of a baritone sound is so limited, I mean how do you think baritones sing in a typical r&b or hard rock/metal sound if all they can do is sound like Key and Junho? lol

 

listen to all these timestamps

B4 @ 2:48 - 2:52, G#4 @ 3:22 - 3:25, G#4 @ 2:06 - 2:09

 

so anyway I told you to listen to it because I am about to do the DUMBEST THING ANYONE HAS EVER DONE on this thread, I am gonna imitate the fuck out of JYP (and basically what Taeyang and many other baritones do). for people that don't know anything about me, I'm a lower baritone, with a speaking voice like Hwanhee from Fly to the Sky. After listening, just imagine what I could do or sound like if I was a higher baritone with a naturally brighter and lighter sound to my voice. Also, this is the first time I have ever tried singing like this, I have not spent all my life imitating Michael Jackson like JYP has LOL so I may not be as uhhh stylistically "convincing" as he is but the depth/vowel shape and coordination is about the same. Might be flat on pitches because...this is not my range to be in, obviously. I am also purposely straining the hell out of my voice and embarrassing myself for the sake of SCIENCE LOL. I do not know Korean so I just very crudely imitated the language, I apologize LOL

 

basically I imitate all the timestamped phrases in the JYP video here, the B4 and G#4s

 

 

this next one is influenced by my idol "Changmin Tenor" and his Eb5 @ 3:39

 

me trying to reach the excellence of "Changmin Tenor"

https://soundcloud.com/ceeyc/o_o

 

this is a short snippet of my serious singing below, my contemporary voice is done in vowels that are more "normal", and honestly I think all the singers you consider high baritones have very "normal" vowel shapes, they are obviously not all influenced by MJ. So it sounds more like what you think is an "obvious" baritone. Their solo singing seems to consist of very ballad-y singing which would not be done with the vocal tract as shortened as the way Taeyang, JYP, and I sing in those examples.

 

https://soundcloud.com/ceeyc/20170416-143952a

 

and lastly, my full classical voice...self-explanatory, sounds baritone af. RIP Italian speakers, I butchered the pronunciation of the words at the end

 

 

my ear was certainly not always trained well. A singer I was wrong about in the past which I realized later was Onew, who is definitely a tenor. I have no problem admitting to myself when my ears were off, but it was always because I tried to bite off more than I could chew for where the level my ear was at. I even had my own ridiculous parameters when I used to listen to Hwanhee or w/e. But that has been like 2 years or over, the way I hear EVERYTHING is different ever since I met the right experts. I have had much more experience hearing singers of all different sub-types (lyric, spinto, dramatic tenors/baritones/sopranos/mezzos singing in many different ways (rock/pop/jazz/r&B/soul/musical theater) in neutral to low larynx, at many different skill levels. I can say with 99% certain that he is actually a baritone. I even mentioned this a long time ago I was told by a true expert that there are more baritones in kpop than people think.

 

If I agreed that baritones have manly voices, I would think I'm a tenor. So no, I don't really think like that. I don't know why you're mentioning Junho like I have never talked about any other baritones ever but okay. It'd be nice if you didn't belittle me when you talk to me by calling my vision limited, you know. If I thought that to be a baritone you had to sound manly or thick, I wouldn't think that Hyunsik is a baritone. 

 

 

 

I hear the light shouty quality and even though Hyunsik can mix up to like D5, I can hear his passaggi much lower than that and I can hear him mixing in a baritone range when he sings in a baritone range. I just don't hear JYP nor Taeyang mixing as early as Hyunsik, for example. 

 

 

 

One thing though, you can mix really high and I don't understand how cause I just...can't. Like I can't strain for free, my voice wants to be head voice if I try to strain so you manage to just strain B4 and D5, I honestly don't physically understand and I kind of envy you. Oh so you agree that Onew is a tenor? Good, cause I thought you were going to bring him up as a baritone as well in this discussion and I was going to have to say I really disagree with that, but you and I can both agree he's a tenor. The thing is Onew is trained, he has a much better foundation of technique than both JYP and Taeyang..or even Hyunsik, who does not support at all to me. Now the thing is for some reason, I hear that Hyunsik is a baritone and to me, I hear a similar quality that you're describing in JYP and Taeyang in how Hyunsik sings, but I just don't hear JYP and Taeyang being baritones, personally. Honestly with such little technique and skill level for both of them, it's hard to voice type them at all. More so JYP than Taeyang. I honestly could be wrong, I just don't hear them mixing in a baritone range, which is what I asked you to show me. I didn't ask for the imitating tenor thing because I get that, but I'd have to hear them mixing in a baritone range for me to be convinced. That is my stubbornness and perhaps my lack of ear ability. When you mentioned experts before, you did mention someone agreeing with you that Onew was a baritone and I could not agree and now we both agree with him being a tenor. As for JYP and Taeyang, honestly I wouldn't mind labelling them "voiceless" (jk but you know what I mean) for the time being as long as their technique is clouding the possibility of voice typing them, for me. 

 

You can agree with me that Hyunsik is a baritone, right? Because he is definitely not the Junho or Key type..or Hwanhee, or even other baritones. I just don't hear it in JYP and Taeyang and if you could show me them mixing in a range a baritone would mix, then I would be able to hear it. I could admit to being wrong if I could hear it, but for now I just can't hear it. So I'd appreciate it if you could help me out with that. 

 

 

@ahmin and @cy

 

Which singers who have below average technique do you have a ~soft spot for? Like, they have an interesting color, and you enjoy listening to them. Strained singing and all?

 

I have a few myself. So, I'm lowkey curious.

Below average? I really don't know if there are any off of top of my head.

Edited April 17, 2017 by AhMin

[galhadineas]

 

 

basically I imitate all the timestamped phrases in the JYP video here, the B4 and G#4s

https://soundcloud.com/ceeyc/20170416-125122a

this next one is influenced by my idol "Changmin Tenor" and his Eb5 @ 3:39

 

 

me trying to reach the excellence of "Changmin Tenor"

https://soundcloud.com/ceeyc/o_o

 

 

holy mother of high notes 

Edited April 16, 2017 by DanReborn

[Jstarfully]

idk if there are commonly accepted/documented vocal risks with thyroid disease. However, I went to school for classical voice while simultaneously dealing with Grave's Disease -> thyroid ablation -> total thyroidectomy and have been singing the whole time. So, I can share at least my ~personal experience.

 

I think forms of Hyperthyroidism that present with goiter (as in an actual growth in the area) can physically inhibit proper phonation because there is a literal thing there that shouldn't be there. But in my experience, the only real effect it had was related to my general health. Thyroid disease presents in about a BILLION ways, but if you are generally unwell, your singing can suffer. Left untreated, any thyroid disease can affect your singing because you are sick. And the voice relies so heavily on physical health to be at its best. 

 

I remember being scared when I had my thyroidectomy. The most common surgical risk is longterm hoarseness if the nerves in the area get pushed around too much. I was very lucky that I was in good shape pretty immediately. And I'm still singing today. And sound pretty much the same. I occasionally have more tightness in my neck area than I like, but I think a lot of that is psychosomatic. 

 

anyhoo, I just ranted for a really long time lmao sorry

 

This whole post feels like #me but anyway yeah I agree with everything you said, just wanted to hear what somebody else had to say regarding the issue.

 

I have pseudohypoparathyroidism - super rare, super annoying. I had managed not to be in hospital for hypocalcemia this year until a couple of weeks ago, so my current record of four months was sadly broken lol but yeah, because that and all my other diseases I'm kind of just always on high alert for everything that could possibly - and would, given the chance - kill or severely harm me.

 

Surprisingly the thing that ruined my voice the most was a surgery I had in high school, when I was 16. The actual surgery itself had nothing at all to do with anything near my throat, or even my airway at all. The closest they got was my left hip for a bone graft, but the main surgery was my left ankle.

 

It was my second surgery, and because of my first surgery I knew that I have a small airway and that they would always need to use smaller than usual intubation tubes. The anaesthesiologist thought I was just being a lil' bitch, and didn't do so. When I woke up, I was hoarse and sore as all hell, couldn't eat solid food for a month because of the sheer swelling.

 

My advice for anyone having surgery for any reason would be to tell the anaesthesiologist to start with smaller tubes, use the smallest tube possible, and to be gentle. 'Cus honestly that ruined my voice way more than when I got flu and secondary tracheitis and laryngitis (also an ear infection but that's not relevant lol).

 

Replied to your rant with another rant lol

[biaswrckers]

Hi. Sorry to interrupt you guys' discussions, but what are your opinions about Jinyoung's vocals?

I know he is supposedly weaker than Youngjae and JB, but I think he is improving a lot and sometimes even sounds better than JB (though this probably is mostly because of his vocal color).

 

[SixSevenHate]

 

 

It's weird that the conversation was about barritone because I was about to ask if this guy is a light barritone or a full one.

 

AND

 

Did the girl support all the note from 1:21 to 1:27

 

I'm 100% the guy support everything but I'm not sure about the girl.

 

[abra]

 

 

Below average? I really don't know if there are any off of top of my head.

I think you've said that you like Bom and Gayoon's tones?

 

 

 

Or maybe it was I who said it

[AhMin]

 

 

 

It's weird that the conversation was about barritone because I was about to ask if this guy is a light barritone or a full one.

 

AND

 

Did the girl support all the note from 1:21 to 1:27

 

I'm 100% the guy support everything but I'm not sure about the girl.

 

 

There is no light lyric or full lyric baritone. She was all throat and tongue tension from what I heard.

 

 

I think you've said that you like Bom and Gayoon's tones?

 

 

 

Or maybe it was I who said it

LOL I mean I like Hyomin's tone actually now that I think about it!

 

 

Hi. Sorry to interrupt you guys' discussions, but what are your opinions about Jinyoung's vocals?

I know he is supposedly weaker than Youngjae and JB, but I think he is improving a lot and sometimes even sounds better than JB (though this probably is mostly because of his vocal color).

 

Someone asked me about this performance before:

 

"Jinyoung also has a pretty voice. 1:05 flat He sounds a lot less airy than Yugyeom, but he is really singing in his throat and he sounds really shallow. 1:16 1:22 F4’s, it’s really just in his throat. He is not relaxing at all. He reminds me a lot of old 90’s K-pop vocalists or like Lee Seunggi, pure throat but not necessarily airy. I mean I agree that Jinyoung improved since his debut with JB & Jr. but not after his last improvement, like to me after his more major improvement in pitch and tone production, he’s stayed pretty stagnant."

[ANTI]

 

I need a Luna/Ailee cover of this song 

[Full Moon]

Hi guys, just wanted to ask your opinion on this, i know he struggled with this song but how much is my question

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8JWeesN5So

[Secre]

Hi guys, just wanted to ask your opinion on this, i know he struggled with this song but how much is my question

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8JWeesN5So

Honestly I was watching this when it came out cause I really like the song. I can't believe I used to think he was at least A to AA. This was literally just throat. His falsetto is so tight, and airy and you can hear the huge drop in volume from his mixed voice. Like listen to his transition at 4:31, and the strain at 4:38 I have no words. He went really flat at 4:48 too. He really needs to just relax, and take it easy. 

Edited April 18, 2017 by Secret

[Full Moon]

Honestly I was watching this when it came out cause I really like the song. I can't believe I used to think he was at least A to AA. This was literally just throat. His falsetto is so tight, and airy and you can hear the huge drop in volume from his mixed voice. Like listen to his transition at 4:31, and the strain at 4:38 I have no words. He went really flat at 4:48 too. He really needs to just relax, and take it easy. 

So it was more being nervous and not loosing it rather than bad technique? I know he is not best technique wise either but maybe it was because it was the first time performing it and i too really like the song, was anticipating this live 

Edited April 18, 2017 by 잡아줘

[Jstarfully]

So it was more being nervous and not loosing it rather than bad technique? I know he is not best technique wise either but maybe it was because it was the first time performing it and i too really like the song, was anticipating this live 

 

It could be nervousness but it's definitely not entirely nervousness, at least in my opinion. He's just pushing his chest voice up so high and that's why he's straining, maybe he hadn't practiced enough and wasn't secure enough in his transitions to 'let go' and start mixing lighter, I don't know. This is the reason why you need to look at more than one performance, you don't know if on one particular performance the artist was nervous, in bad condition, couldn't hear themselves, the audio system was bad, or really anything happened to make it not what their 'average' performance would be. 

Edited April 18, 2017 by Jstarfully

[AhMin]

 

I need a Luna/Ailee cover of this song 

I absolutely love this song. 

[C.Y.]

 

If I agreed that baritones have manly voices, I would think I'm a tenor. So no, I don't really think like that. I don't know why you're mentioning Junho like I have never talked about any other baritones ever but okay. It'd be nice if you didn't belittle me when you talk to me by calling my vision limited, you know. If I thought that to be a baritone you had to sound manly or thick, I wouldn't think that Hyunsik is a baritone. 

 

I hear the light shouty quality and even though Hyunsik can mix up to like D5, I can hear his passaggi much lower than that and I can hear him mixing in a baritone range when he sings in a baritone range. I just don't hear JYP nor Taeyang mixing as early as Hyunsik, for example. 

 

One thing though, you can mix really high and I don't understand how cause I just...can't. Like I can't strain for free, my voice wants to be head voice if I try to strain so you manage to just strain B4 and D5, I honestly don't physically understand and I kind of envy you. Oh so you agree that Onew is a tenor? Good, cause I thought you were going to bring him up as a baritone as well in this discussion and I was going to have to say I really disagree with that, but you and I can both agree he's a tenor. The thing is Onew is trained, he has a much better foundation of technique than both JYP and Taeyang..or even Hyunsik, who does not support at all to me. Now the thing is for some reason, I hear that Hyunsik is a baritone and to me, I hear a similar quality that you're describing in JYP and Taeyang in how Hyunsik sings, but I just don't hear JYP and Taeyang being baritones, personally. Honestly with such little technique and skill level for both of them, it's hard to voice type them at all. More so JYP than Taeyang. I honestly could be wrong, I just don't hear them mixing in a baritone range, which is what I asked you to show me. I didn't ask for the imitating tenor thing because I get that, but I'd have to hear them mixing in a baritone range for me to be convinced. That is my stubbornness and perhaps my lack of ear ability. When you mentioned experts before, you did mention someone agreeing with you that Onew was a baritone and I could not agree and now we both agree with him being a tenor. As for JYP and Taeyang, honestly I wouldn't mind labelling them "voiceless" (jk but you know what I mean) for the time being as long as their technique is clouding the possibility of voice typing them, for me. 

 

You can agree with me that Hyunsik is a baritone, right? Because he is definitely not the Junho or Key type..or Hwanhee, or even other baritones. I just don't hear it in JYP and Taeyang and if you could show me them mixing in a range a baritone would mix, then I would be able to hear it. I could admit to being wrong if I could hear it, but for now I just can't hear it. So I'd appreciate it if you could help me out with that. 

 

 

Below average? I really don't know if there are any off of top of my head.

 

well u did call me close minded once so we're even now LOL. no no you misunderstood me, I meant that most people in the world think that of a stereotypical baritone sound, but YOU don't because you have opened your mind to further possible lighter sounds. I'm saying that just because most people think that an "obvious" baritone sound can only be masculine and heavy does not mean it is necessarily true, so I just think that Taeyang also not sounding like your concept of a "obvious" baritone sound does not mean that he can't be one either.

 

I don't think Taeyang is bad, like normal human bad do you know what I mean lmao. He is arguably professional bad but he is skilled enough compared to non-singing people to tell his passaggi.

 

You're right I DID ask someone about Onew, but that guy turned out to be a complete no ear classical guy like most of them. I trusted him and then later found out he could not even hear the simplest things, I trusted him simply because he explained things eloquently, was educated on paper and had authority but I was wrong. That's why I can't stand some classical people if you have not noticed LOL, when I say "expert" now, I truly mean people who have taught singers to sing well and can sing well themselves. I did not experience either of that with that teacher beforehand but I trusted him out of authority as most people in life naturally do, then found out the hard way. One of the real experts that told me about there being more kpop baritones is the same one that helped with Hwanhee, Jk kim dong wook (who are now painfully obvious baritones now that my ear does not suck anymore)

 

in pop singers it's not 100% reliable to just listen to the first passagio around Bb3/B3 - C#4, you should anyway and though you can hear things often, the way different pop singers sometimes sing can blur it. Eb4-F#4 is much more reliable and around E3 and below. the point of the low note clip with Taeyang isn't that his lower range is spectacular, I mean Hwanhee's is about the same, it's about the way baritone voices sound down there. it's the intensity curve and sound in the low notes that is different than a tenor voice, no matter how good the low notes of the tenor are, even if you are listening to Jung Dong Ha. you also need to take into account that he was casually talking to the producer there and trying to explain something to him, putting in zero effort to sing those notes

 

2:03 - 2:08 he hits an F#4 on "miss" and then an E4 on "miss", 2:10 - 2:12 a Eb4 and C#4

 

 

 

that's Key's E4 @ 1:18

 

 

i'm gonna compare them to the other guy in Big Bang who is a tenor, what's his face ummm Kwill. I mean Daesung w/e.

he hits a bunch of E4s and F#4s at 1:38 - 1:49

 

 

or the Weeknd is an obvious as hell tenor with a very obvious higher passaggi because he sings thin as heck too

0:32 - 0:36 he hits a bunch of E4s, G4s, A4

 

 

personally I don't think the hyunsik guy sounds like a tenor, he sounds like a pop baritone to me. It's not like he sounds like The Weeknd or Chen or the up10tion guy.

 

@ahmin and @cy

 

Which singers who have below average technique do you have a ~soft spot for? Like, they have an interesting color, and you enjoy listening to them. Strained singing and all?

 

I have a few myself. So, I'm lowkey curious.

I wouldn't say they are all "below average" but they're not completely healthy in technique, I'm gonna put it that way. I listen to a lot of bad western soul/r&b/rock/blues singers lol

 

for Korean singers I guess I like Dean

I like Matt Corby ummm..Jeff Buckley...Thom Yorke...Frank Ocean...Chris Cornell...Ville Valo... Donny Hathaway

 

there's this Filipino indie singer from the U.S. called Passion that I like...umm YUI the Japanese singer o_o

I don't know a lot of current Korean singers but I guess I still like BoA since I grew up listening to her lol

 

probably a lot more

 

holy mother of high notes 

 

lmfao of course Dan would enjoy those

Edited April 19, 2017 by C.Y.

[galhadineas]

 

 

 

well u did call me close minded once so we're even now LOL. no no you misunderstood me, I meant that most people in the world think that of a stereotypical baritone sound, but YOU don't because you have opened your mind to further possible lighter sounds. I'm saying that just because most people think that an "obvious" baritone sound can only be masculine and heavy does not mean it is necessarily true, so I just think that Taeyang also not sounding like your concept of a "obvious" baritone sound does not mean that he can't be one either.

 

I don't think Taeyang is bad, like normal human bad do you know what I mean lmao. He is arguably professional bad but he is skilled enough compared to non-singing people to tell his passaggi.

 

You're right I DID ask someone about Onew, but that guy turned out to be a complete no ear classical guy like most of them. I trusted him and then later found out he could not even hear the simplest things, I trusted him simply because he explained things eloquently, was educated on paper and had authority but I was wrong. That's why I can't stand some classical people if you have not noticed LOL, when I say "expert" now, I truly mean people who have taught singers to sing well and can sing well themselves. I did not experience either of that with that teacher beforehand but I trusted him out of authority as most people in life naturally do, then found out the hard way. One of the real experts I'm talking about now is the same one that helped with Hwanhee, Jk kim dong wook (who are now painfully obvious baritones now that my ear does not suck anymore)

 

in pop singers it's not 100% reliable to just listen to the first passagio around Bb3/B3 - C#4, you should anyway and though you can hear things often, the way different pop singers sometimes sing can blur it. Eb4-F#4 is much more reliable and around E3 and below. the point of the low note clip with Taeyang isn't that his lower range is spectacular, I mean Hwanhee's is about the same, it's about the way baritone voices sound down there. it's the intensity curve and sound in the low notes that is different than a tenor voice, no matter how good the low notes of the tenor are, even if you are listening to Jung Dong Ha.

 

2:03 - 2:08 he hits an F#4 on "miss" and then an E4 on "miss", 2:10 - 2:12 a Eb4 and C#4

 

 

 

that's Key's E4 @ 1:18

 

 

i'm gonna compare them to the other guy in Big Bang who is a tenor, what's his face ummm Kwill. I mean Daesung w/e. I chose this one on purpose because he isn't singing well in this performance, I know he can do a bit better

he hits a bunch of E4s and F#4s at 1:38 - 1:49

 

 

or the Weeknd is an obvious as hell tenor with a very obvious higher passaggi because he sings thin as heck too

0:32 - 0:36 he hits a bunch of E4s, G4s, A4

 

 

personally I don't think the hyunsik guy sounds like a tenor, he sounds like a pop baritone to me. It's not like he sounds like The Weeknd or Chen or the up10tion guy.

 

I wouldn't say they are all "below average" but they're not completely healthy in technique, I'm gonna put it that way. I listen to a lot of bad western soul/r&b/rock/blues singers lol

 

for Korean singers I guess I like Dean

I like Matt Corby ummm..Jeff Buckley...Thom Yorke...Frank Ocean...Chris Cornell...Ville Valo... Donny Hathaway

 

there's this Filipino indie singer from the U.S. called Passion that I like...umm YUI the Japanese singer o_o

I don't know a lot of current Korean singers but I guess I still like BoA since I grew up listening to her lol

 

probably a lot more

 

 

lmfao of course Dan would enjoy those

 

 

I'm asking myself when will I ever 

[AhMin]

well u did call me close minded once so we're even now LOL. no no you misunderstood me, I meant that most people in the world think that of a stereotypical baritone sound, but YOU don't because you have opened your mind to further possible lighter sounds. I'm saying that just because most people think that an "obvious" baritone sound can only be masculine and heavy does not mean it is necessarily true, so I just think that Taeyang also not sounding like your concept of a "obvious" baritone sound does not mean that he can't be one either.

 

I don't think Taeyang is bad, like normal human bad do you know what I mean lmao. He is arguably professional bad but he is skilled enough compared to non-singing people to tell his passaggi.

 

You're right I DID ask someone about Onew, but that guy turned out to be a complete no ear classical guy like most of them. I trusted him and then later found out he could not even hear the simplest things, I trusted him simply because he explained things eloquently, was educated on paper and had authority but I was wrong. That's why I can't stand some classical people if you have not noticed LOL, when I say "expert" now, I truly mean people who have taught singers to sing well and can sing well themselves. I did not experience either of that with that teacher beforehand but I trusted him out of authority as most people in life naturally do, then found out the hard way. One of the real experts that told me about there being more kpop baritones is the same one that helped with Hwanhee, Jk kim dong wook (who are now painfully obvious baritones now that my ear does not suck anymore)

 

in pop singers it's not 100% reliable to just listen to the first passagio around Bb3/B3 - C#4, you should anyway and though you can hear things often, the way different pop singers sometimes sing can blur it. Eb4-F#4 is much more reliable and around E3 and below. the point of the low note clip with Taeyang isn't that his lower range is spectacular, I mean Hwanhee's is about the same, it's about the way baritone voices sound down there. it's the intensity curve and sound in the low notes that is different than a tenor voice, no matter how good the low notes of the tenor are, even if you are listening to Jung Dong Ha. you also need to take into account that he was casually talking to the producer there and trying to explain something to him, putting in zero effort to sing those notes

 

2:03 - 2:08 he hits an F#4 on "miss" and then an E4 on "miss", 2:10 - 2:12 a Eb4 and C#4

 

 

 

that's Key's E4 @ 1:18

 

 

i'm gonna compare them to the other guy in Big Bang who is a tenor, what's his face ummm Kwill. I mean Daesung w/e.

he hits a bunch of E4s and F#4s at 1:38 - 1:49

 

or the Weeknd is an obvious as hell tenor with a very obvious higher passaggi because he sings thin as heck too

0:32 - 0:36 he hits a bunch of E4s, G4s, A4

 

personally I don't think the hyunsik guy sounds like a tenor, he sounds like a pop baritone to me. It's not like he sounds like The Weeknd or Chen or the up10tion guy.

Well I guess now that we are even, we could it call it quits and just be nice and sweet to other another? lol I agree with you that just because he doesn't sound like even my usual concept of a baritone, it doesn't mean he can't be one either...I just could not hear it. Oh sure Taeyang is not technically that bad, but he's not a good example of vocal technique. The thing is Taeyang's voice type changing is a bit of a big deal. JYP doesn't matter to me, if he's a tenor or baritone he has no supported range, so nothing would change within his analysis but Taeyang being a baritone would really alter his analysis. Well some people have a lot of theoretical knowledge but don't have good ears, that's a sad reality we face with singing. I mean JK Kim Dongwook, I knew he was a baritone but Hwanhee I just always doubted it because of how high he constantly sang, but hearing him speak was like a dead giveaway baritone for me.

 

You're making some valid points and even though I'm still skeptical, I may be able to hear it. I mean Hyunsik is a baritone, I have no doubt but he can mix really high quite constantly. Did you just shade Daesung? lol

 

 

@2:57 Taeyang struggles a lot to mix above G4, his A4's and B4's are really tight but I always just attributed that to his lack of technique, and considering how tenors could mix around E4/F4, I wasn't sure what to think. @1:22 even his D4's have enough of a degree of mixing that make me be unsure but see how it could be one or the other. The thing is that if Taeyang does turn out to be a baritone, I'll have to analyze him again. Cause he has enough of a degree of support that it would alter his rating even if only by half a rating. Or at least it would have in 2011. Either way, I need to ponder on this. 1:37 his F4's don't strike me as straight up baritone in the Beyonce cover though...ugh he is really making me unsure. 

Edited April 19, 2017 by AhMin

[AhMin]

Finally our covers

 

 

 

 

 

[abra]

Maybe we could call him a Taeyang tenor

 

 

Or revive the phrase baritenor

Edited April 20, 2017 by abra

[ParkHyoLee]

Maybe we could him a Taeyang tenor

 

 

Or revive the phrase baritenor

 

Sent from my LG-D852 using OneHallyu mobile app

[galhadineas]

btw, do you guys think Roa (Minkyung) can support? 

 

she sings at 0:55 and 1:36

[Secre]

I suppose you might not know how it works for us to do analyses. We only analyze vocalists who are lead or main vocalists, which I see that you know. But the other requirement is that they need enough material. 5 ~ 10 second long parts in their main songs is not considered material, especially when it's a studio track. We need substantial material to write an accurate vocal analysis, we can't just analyze her without listening to a variety of songs, with a variety of genres in a considerably enough range to talk about her technique. The only song you posted that's actually live and she actually sings is Gee, but that's not a very good song to talk about singing as a whole. Also this is not enough material to talk about her vocal range because this is barely showcasing a two octave range, if at all. We do not analyze vocalists who have only been around for a year or less. We might analyze vocalists who debuted in 2015 this year later on, but 2016? Not a chance, unless they have a LOT of material. All of those things you're asking for will be included in an analysis if she is analyzed, which I can't promise she will be, but this is currently not enough material for an analysis at all.

 

What I can do is copy-paste two videos and the answer to those videos from sometime ago:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyYWRCxFCfM

 

 

“Seola is very nasal in the first song, very much in her throat and a bit too airy. Dawon’s support is much better, much better tone production. Much fuller and opened placement, much more connected to her diaphragmatic breathing than Seola. Seola is just air throughout. Dawon’s falsetto is underdeveloped, but her harmonies aren’t bad. Seola sounds like her voice is very much in her throat. 3:10 so much better placement by contrast, she is like noticeably using better technique. 3:40 that run was sloppy, the overall approach was weak and with a lowered larynx, it was just A3 ~ E3 all pushed and airy. She anticipated the E3 before it came and already lowered her larynx on A3 which is not low enough for that.

3:21 now that’s when they’re singing way too high for the development of their voices so far. Eb5 is definitely way out of their comfort zones. 3:34 so I hear that Soobin has better connection than Seola but still weak support, lots of nasality and shallowness. 3:10 though…Dawon’s C5’s are not bad whatsoever. She has the potential up there, her B4’s in Say Something were pretty nice too.

Anyway so Soobin and Dawon are main vocalists and Seola is a lead vocalist? I see. Well depending on how well they showcase their voices throughout their careers or this year in general, I could see Soobin and Seola as weak or weak to average vocalists, whereas Dawon is either average or Average to Above Average…for now, Dawon could improve. She reminds me of Oh My Girl’s Seunghee although I feel Seunghee is the best one of the two for sure.â€

 

Dawon and Soobin were main vocals with Seola, and Dayoung being lead vocals, but after Yeonjung got added Seola kind of lost her position. Now it's Yeonjung, and Dawon as main vocals. Soobin and Dayoung as lead vocals.

 

[galhadineas]

 

Dawon and Soobin were main vocals with Seola, and Dayoung being lead vocals, but after Yeonjung got added Seola kind of lost her position. Now it's Yeonjung, and Dawon as main vocals. Soobin and Dayoung as lead vocals.

 

 

even Dawon lost her MAIN vocalist position