Official Vocals thread (READ OP FIRST)

[Jstarfully]

I mean, Yu Huiyeol's Sketchbook has been known to do live autotune and pre/post recording, so it's not really a reliable source.

[Jstarfully]

Thanks, everyone, for answering my question much earlier. I have another similar one to check if I'm learning anything.

C5 @ 2:50

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8sa3gIlPRU

Sejeong's mouth makes me like 99% certain this is lipsynced but here it is anyways. Would this also be described as throaty or pushed?

 

I'm not 100% sure if that's lipsynched, it looks real enough for me, but I'd have to look at the whole performance, which usually I can't be bothered to do with ballads because (for me) a lot of them are boring. It wasn't overly pushed, and I don't think it's throaty, but I do think she could've opened her mouth more. I don't think it's that she's pushing her chest voice up, because it doesn't sound strained, but she's just not letting her head mix actually 'fill out' and resonate more. Idk, for me it's hard to explain, someone else might pick it up lol

Edited April 29, 2017 by Jstarfully

[Jstarfully]

I love Hyungseob so much, but he's a really weak singer tbh. However he's never had any sort of actual vocal training so how this man knows his talent level is beyond me.

That trainer is absolute shit, I make a concentrated effort to block out everything he says tbh

[Jstarfully]

So i dont know if you remember but you along with one or two users more answered my question about harry styles performance and you guys said that he didn't relax his throat at all so it might have been because of nervousness of performing the song for the first time but we couldn't be sure. Thankfully he performed a second time and he actually managed to hit the high notes and did the falsetto parts more easily compared to the first perf. Of course this are all my assumptions without actually knowing any vocal technique so i would be thankful if you can tell how he did this time.

 

 

Well, he hit the notes, but the straining and not relaxing his throat is still present. Plus he's pretty much not mixing at all, he's just pushing his chest voice up, and when you're at that level of strain it's easy to miss notes if you're at any less than optimal condition because it just wrecks your throat. I think he's been doing it for a long time and it's starting to really hurt his voice, because even on the first line which is a relatively low note, I was shocked at how strained and 'choked' he sounded.

 

Also, regarding the Baekhyun part, I can't really comment. I don't really agree with classifying purely pop singers into classical classifications anyway, because really we won't ever really know until they sing that way, and also if you're trained properly it doesn't have nearly as much impact on your repertoire as it does in classical singing. (take a shot for every time I said something that started with 'class' lol)

[Jstarfully]

tbh Kyungsoo never gave me an impression of being anything but tenor but that's just my amateur ear lmao.

He has a slightly heavier voice. It's not much darker, but it's heavier and fuller.

[Jstarfully]

Luhan was more of a main vocal actually, he always tagged along with ChenBaekSoo for things. And Suho is lead vocal, no doubt. He is always in the vocal line songs and projects, we have video of him doing vocal training pre-debut at SM. 

 

My point was, it's not always the instructor's fault a student doesn't make progress. You can teach someone the right way, but maybe you don't have enough time with them to really work it into them, or they don't put in the work for whatever reason. 

 

EXO-M main is Chen, lead was Luhan

EXO-K main is Baekhyun, lead was D.O

EXO mains/leads before anyone left were the ones above. Now it's more like they have three mains and no real leads.

[Jstarfully]

No, mains have always been Chen/Baekhyun/Kyungsoo. They've always introduced and referred to themselves as the main vocals. Luhan was a lead vocal, but he got a lot of lines, and was put with main vocal line pretty often, far more than Suho ever was.

 

here's a little 'main vocal battle' they did before anyone left, Kris threw himself in there for fun's, but it was sparked by the hosts teasing them for having 3 'main' vocals. 

 

 

That's also what they said themselves though. When they debuted their official profiles were what I said, but tbh I kinda don't really care hahaha I just hate calling Suho lead anything (except leader but whatever lol)

[Jstarfully]

But do you mean official official profile, or one of those profile sites? Because those are most often inaccurate. 

 

I don't mean to be a stickler about this, but it's something people say a lot, even though it's not true. If you look it up in hangul, korean profiles and official media, Kyungsoo is a ë©”ì¸ë³´ì»¬, main vocal. Not a ë¦¬ë“œë³´ì»¬, lead vocal. And they never update these things, whatever goes out at debut is what sticks with them forever, which is why Taemin is still just a "vocal" despite rising so much. 

 

I mean official official profile, but I might be wrong since it was a long time ago. They used to have them on SM's website, not sure if they still do though. I also hate when people say stuff like that lol it gets to me when people automatically call whoever is 'best' main when that's not always the case (like for ex. Jimin is actually main dancer in BTS even though J-Hope is best)

[Jstarfully]

That's more of a personal question but do you guys think that you could compete against some K-Pop Idols who are the main vocalists of their group in singing and win ?

Like are some of you only capable of hearing things and analyzing their vocal techniques or are you competent singers yourself as well ?

 

I'd fancy myself a chance against some main vocalists, yeah. I recently overcame my bridging problem in my mix lol so my voice is pretty solid now. Other than getting more comfortable in my transitions, the only thing I could work on now would be whistle register, because I've kinda hit both the bottom and top of my range, which is pretty big too.

 

Tl;dr: yeah

[Jstarfully]

are you serious ? like of everything else that you could work on developping, you want to give time for the .. whistle register ?

 

I meant if there was something 'new' to develop, that'd be it. Tbh it's pretty useless, don't really think I would for any other reason than just to see if I could. But yeah, other than becoming more comfortable in my transitions and practicing flexibility, I don't have anything else to work on atm, that's why I said that haha

[Jstarfully]

TL;DR: YEAH!! LOOOOOOOOOOOL Like it was 3 sentences omg

 

Haha it was more in case they were looking for a one-word answer 

[Jstarfully]

What kind of conventional wisdom in the K-Pop Industry and fans about singing and what makes a good singer do you guys disagree with alot ?

 

That you have to 'push' your voice to hit high notes. I hear that a lot and it's just... no. If you're regularly pushing you're going to shred your vocal cords.

[Jstarfully]

Which kind of K-Pop Idols would you want to coach the most or what kind of company would you guys like to be a vocal coach for if you had the choice ?

 

Maybe YG? They have so many vocals that have such huge potential but their current trainer just sucks balls and trains their 'tone' instead - which like, don't even get me started on.

Or BigHIt because what are they doing with those boys? Jin and Jimin could do so much better with their singing smh

[Jstarfully]

 

 

3:08

 

What do you think of Kim Sook's hight note here? It sounded really powerful. I know she's not a singer but...

 

The first part was okay, but the second 'hey' around 3:10-3:11 was strained and not open enough.

Edited May 8, 2017 by Jstarfully

[Jstarfully]

Hello!

I would like to ask for help to know more about my bias in the vocal area~

I will start first with her solo song and songs where shes the main vocal:

 

 

 

^

shes the first one to sing

 

 

^

she starts singing at 0:38 in 'Sonatine'

 

I will move into '100% live' videos now:

 

 

 

And now to some live stages:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu6er-dLyXU

 

 x x

 

 

In some articles it says that she trained under the company for about 1 year and in other articles for about 5 to 6 months so im not sure,she mentioned in all articles that predebut she was in her school's choir [elementary school] and she participated in a festival after her teacher adviced her and there she was casted by the company:

 

 

 

I hope it was enough,and thank you in advance for answering and helping me learn more about my bias~

 

She doesn't mix when she goes high in any of those, so I can't comment on her high mix, which what I'm best at lol. She does do a D5 in Love&Live but it's hard to hear over the backing track and it sounds like she's using her head voice to do all the high notes for the lives. Support is either not there, or at the times when it is, shallow. Mix is generally quite heady, but on the descending notes in 'My Melody' she quite quickly gets throaty and it also sounds quite weak, she doesn't know how to place low notes for them to be stable and heard properly.

[Jstarfully]

Thank you very much for answering,maybe this can help you about the Love&Live problem,the backing track isn't as loud as in the previous stages : x

 

Haha I'm still having trouble hearing it, but if it's like that on many performances it's usually because it's just very quiet. I'd like to see someone mix a D5 quietly lol so I'm guessing it's head voice, although of course I can't say that for certain.

Going off of the music in the backing track, the mix doesn't sound too strained or throaty to me, but support is shallow and (something which I apparently complain every time someone asks me about anyone lol) there isn't enough openness for the note to resonate properly.

Edited May 8, 2017 by Jstarfully

[Jstarfully]

Hi! I don't know if you guys have heard Lovelyz new song Now, We. I was wondering about Kei's line from around 2:34 to 2:43 here. It's falsetto, right? How high is it?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlRHgQpO12I

 

And is it just me, or is the chorus really high in this song? 

 

The highest note she sings in that interval is a D5, and while it sounds high it's not that high, especially in falsetto. The chorus sits at around a C5, not that high either, although they've done well to continually mix a C5 and not have too much of a belting-quality type sound.

[Jstarfully]

 

Is it me or was Mino's high note supported ?

 

His falsetto after the high note was tragic but I didn't hear any strain or throaty sound 

 

 

 

Definitely not supported, and although there wasn't audible strain he was still throaty.

[Jstarfully]

Hey guys, do you know any tips or exercises that you know that would help me stop singing through my nose?   I sound nasal all the time and I want to fix it.

Is it true nasality? As in, when you sing and 'sound nasal', if you pinch your nose shut, does your tone change?

[Jstarfully]

Thanks!

Hm, I think I go really nasal when attempting higher notes, does that make sense?

 

Well the higher you go, the more the sympathetic vibrations (what you want lots of in resonance) move upwards, with high notes resonating in your 'mask' or the nasal bones. When you think you sound nasal, try squeezing your nose shut with your fingers and see if you go all quiet, if you do then you are truly singing nasally. For this you can do exercises where you shut your nose with your fingers and do scales, that helps you get used to placing your voice differently.

 

If not, it's probably just that you're not rounding out your twang properly. In that case it's more of a matter of changing your tone and diction, which is a bit harder because it really depends on how you're singing and what the resulting sound is, so you might have to get a tutor to help you.

Edited May 12, 2017 by Jstarfully

[Jstarfully]

Pitch issue .... where i didn't heard that 

I can hear it even just in that fancam you replied to. She's just like ever so slightly off (half a semitone or less) on about 75% of the notes, although most of the time she manages to slide back onto the note and it's mostly at the start of each new note.

[Jstarfully]

I can't @ people in various places who are saying that Sook is better than Yewon in Unnies now that the song has officially come out. Lord give me strength not to go off  

Edited May 14, 2017 by Jstarfully

[Jstarfully]

Well sook is, to their opinion and to their standards of a better singer, since she had more confidence and determination to use her voice whereas Yewon is still getting back to her prime.

 

I seem like a nobody here but I just had to say it. I've been lurking here since 2015 and I've seen my bias, Jihyo from Twice be bashed so hard on how she's such a BAD SINGER, comparing her to literally a lot of sub-vocals and people agreeing. Can you agree that Sohye, Chaeyeon from IOI and Yoona from SNSD is a better singer than Twice Jihyo? I won't answer that but in my past experiences as a Jihyo stan, yes, a lot of people thought that before. Jihyo literally had to do well on a lot on performances so that people would actually recognize her singing and be called an 'average' singer rather than the tone-deaf, can't carry a note image that Twice had before.

 

There have been idols who have been criticized for their singing but are actually good technique wise and some overrated singers when it comes to high notes, belting, etc. Just know that it's their opinion and you really shouldn't go full rage-mode on them for having their opinion. If Yewon is a better singer than Sook then okay. If Sook did better in the recording and the actual performance of right, then okay. If people don't agree with your opinion, then just accept it and if you want to answer, answer with reason and respect.

 

Sorry if I ranted a little, I just wanted to say this since I was like that before, and trust me, I regret every word I said since I knew I could've just been jamming to my biases' songs rather than spend my time showing my anger on the internet because we're not on the same page.

 

Eh, most of the time I don't care, but see something one too many times on a group that you do follow, like BTS or something for me, it's almost just a matter of time. Anyway, on the first bolded point, that's not why people said she's better. They said her high-notes are better and that she's a better vocalist than Yewon. As in, not a better singer, take all emotion and 'tone' etc out of it, essentially everyone was talking about how Sook is a better vocalist.

 

The second bolded point, I honestly don't really know how anyone could call Chaeyeon, Yoona or Sohye better singers than Jihyo, that's just plain bias. That has nothing to do with anybody talking about who is actually the better vocalist, that's bias driving people to put Jihyo down.

 

I think, as well, that your idea of 'going off' is very different to mine, and also most of the time I don't purely because I just can't be bothered. Me finding some examples of where vocalist A uses better technique than vocalist B isn't going to change the world, and therefore at the end of the day I just go 'fuck it' and move on. I did once go off at people saying that Jin is the strongest vocalist in BTS, but that's neither here nor there really.

 

Anyway, no worries for the slight rant lol, sometimes I'll put small posts like that here just to vent a little in a place where people understand that it can get tiring knowing a thing or two about vocals when so many people don't and still insist that they're right with little to no evidence. Like I'm perfectly happy to debate on who is better than who, but if the other person says that A is better because they 'hit' a higher note than B then... that's has nothing to do with anything unless it was hit properly, otherwise it's just part of their vocalisable range which is bigger than your real range for all but the most trained vocalists.

[Jstarfully]

 

that's really detailed LOL I wish I could hear all those things

 

 

is Yewon better? I know she had a vocal cord issue but I don't know how good she was before that lol 

 

 

Usually it's less than half a semitone if it's not to the point where almost anyone could go 'oh that definitely sounds off'

But yeah Yewon is better. Such a shame with the vocal edema, like she didn't even get that from singing, she got it from acting.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Jstarfully

[Jstarfully]

Anyways, bringing up an old topic: 

Who's singing the adlib from 0:23-0:25? Like I know I hear Jessica from 0:27-0:29 and then 0:31-0:35 is Taeyeon.

I'm pretty sure that's Taeyeon on the bottom and Jessica on the top. Because if you listen like before the actual high part of the note is, it sounds like it's them two starting on the same note, and the voice that goes higher sounds a lot weaker in this low part. Therefore I'm thinking it's Jessica on the top because she tends to only sound 'strong' on some high notes, but usually sounds weak and terribly unsupported in her lower range. Can't remember if she actually does have weak support in the lower part of her range or whether it's just that her voice sounds thin and ungrounded like that.