Official Vocals thread (READ OP FIRST)

[abra]

Bless yourselves

 

Edited February 26, 2017 by abra

[BadBadNotGood]

Hi vocal thread! Just a quick question, it was prob asked before but where would Ariana Grande list if you analyzed her on the analysis site?

[ParkHyoLee]

 

 

@0:12

Bey's agility is damn crazy
 

Hi vocal thread! Just a quick question, it was prob asked before but where would Ariana Grande list if you analyzed her on the analysis site?

Ari's voice is so pretty and she has a lot of potential, but last I checked she would be, with her consistency as it is, somewhere around an average to above average vocalist . She has supported in the fifth octave before and she used to, like before her days on nickelodeon, consistently have like C5/C#5 down, but the current her only has F3~Bb4/Maybe B4(?) and dealing with a whole bunch of issues with intonation, jaw tension, breath control, consistent support above the fourth octave, nasality 

 

 

 

This is what head voice sounds like:

 

 

 

0:47 is like my fave perf from her. The dress and the camera work were on point 

Edited February 26, 2017 by ParkHyoLee

[Celest]

 

 

@0:12

 

Bey's agility is damn crazy

 

Ari's voice is so pretty and she has a lot of potential, but last I checked she would be, with her consistency as it is, somewhere around an average to above average vocalist . She has supported in the fifth octave before and she used to, like before her days on nickelodeon, consistently have like C5/C#5 down, but the current her only has F3~Bb4/Maybe B4(?) and dealing with a whole bunch of issues with intonation, jaw tension, breath control, consistent support above the fourth octave, nasality 

 

0:47 is like my fave perf from her. The dress and the camera work were on point 

 

Would you agree with these verdicts?

 

- Jojo, Good 

- Tori Kelly, Proficient to Good

- Demi Lovato, Average to Above Average 

- Ariana Grande, Average to Above Average

[ParkHyoLee]

Would you agree with these verdicts?

 

- Jojo, Good 

- Tori Kelly, Proficient to Good

- Demi Lovato, Average to Above Average 

- Ariana Grande, Average to Above Average

I haven't listened to Tori in the past while so I'm not totally certain about her, but last I checked she was somewhere around P to G. I'm not part of the blog so I'm not sure if she exactly fits their criteria, but Tori is definitely skilled enough imo to be in that area with consistent resonance up to C#5 and support down to F3 and up to D5 (I'm not sure about her head voice).

 

Demi and Ari sound about right?

 

The major thing I disagree with is Jojo being good. No way she's only good with C#3~E5/F5~A5/Bb5 as a mezzo. Over the new year she showcased some really nice F5s, but I'm not sure how consistent she is with them. She was at least a Great vocalist before the New Year and honestly I'd vote for  Great to Excellent for her at the moment

Edited February 26, 2017 by ParkHyoLee

[Celest]

I haven't listened to Tori in the past while so I'm not totally certain about her, but last I checked she was somewhere around P to G. I'm not part of the blog so I'm not sure if she exactly fits their criteria, but Tori is definitely skilled enough imo to be in that area with consistent resonance up to C#5 and support down to F3 and up to D5 (I'm not sure about her head voice).

 

Demi and Ari sound about right?

 

The major thing I disagree with is Jojo being good. No way she's only good with C#3~E5/F5~A5/Bb5 as a mezzo. Over the new year she showcased some really nice F5s, but I'm not sure how consistent she is with them. She was at least a Great vocalist before the New Year and honestly I'd vote for  Great to Excellent for her at the moment

The only reason I didn't put her higher was because although her support is INSANE for a Mezzo, it's very inconsistent because of her sicknesses.  On good days, she's Great, but on bad days she's Good in my opinion.  Her consistent supported range in my opinion is C#3/D3-Eb5/E5-A5/Bb5.  As for Tori, she's shown to support up to C#5/D5 and on good days even as high as Eb5/E5, but like Demi, she's inconsistent and can sound shouty.  Her lows are good (audible and not pitchy) until E3/D3, but her head voice and whistles are top notch.  

 

Jojo, C#3/D3-Eb5/E5/F5-A5/Bb5

Demi, E3/F3-C5/C#5 

Ari, G3/A3-Bb4/B4/C5-??? 

Tori, F3/G3/A3-C#5/D5-G5/A5

 

They're the best pop girls at the moment so I follow them quite often: Demi more than the other three. :D 

Edited February 26, 2017 by NatsuLian

[lepidoptery]

the "back of the throat" is the pharynx. The pharynx is part of the vocal tract. And changing the dimensions of that space is done by having the larynx in different positions. So yes, it is the same thing. The problem is what you are saying is contradictory, to you he is singing from the back of his throat but is apparently still in a fairly neutral position. Am I understanding this part correctly? it is still a bit confusing here. It is completely accurate to say that he was singing with a lower larynx position, because that is what he was literally doing. Obviously I was implying he wasn't doing it well either, I didn't think I needed to spell that part out. The idea of "mask" and "placement" has been scientifically proven false for decades now, but that is usually a topic I am too lazy to get into so I am gonna ignore that part for now. But if you feel like challenging me on that, just say the word, I am not one to back out of my claims. You've probably never ever seen me use those two terms for a very good reason.

PHS aside, I'm interested in what about placement (or mask placement specifically?) has been proven false, if you feel like expanding on it!

 

Honestly, I always had this impression that some people were too optimistic about technically correct singing.  If your voice is "ugly" to people, singing in a technically-correct fashion won't necessarily make it sound attractive (even if it presumably wouldn't sound painful, at least (but lots of listeners don't hear strain when it's there anyway), and would extend your singing life).  That's why it's totally understandable that people do all sorts of improper things to achieve the sound they actually want from themselves.

[ParkHyoLee]

The only reason I didn't put her higher was because although her support is INSANE for a Mezzo, it's very inconsistent because of her sicknesses.  On good days, she's Great, but on bad days she's Good in my opinion.  Her consistent supported range in my opinion is C#3/D3-Eb5/E5-A5/Bb5.  As for Tori, she's shown to support up to C#5/D5 and on good days even as high as Eb5/E5, but like Demi, she's inconsistent and can sound shouty.  Her lows are good (audible and not pitchy) until E3/D3, but her head voice and whistles are top notch.  

 

Jojo, C#3/D3-Eb5/E5/F5-A5/Bb5

Demi, E3/F3-C5/C#5 

Ari, G3/A3-Bb4/B4/C5-??? 

Tori, F3/G3/A3-C#5/D5-G5/A5

 

They're the best pop girls at the moment so I follow them quite often: Demi more than the other three. :D 

I really wouldn't say that vocal health takes away from how skilled a vocalist is, though. That's like saying Mariah wasn't excellent because her vocal condition was inconsistent even during her prime    Unless you mean to say even if you were to take only D3~Eb5~A5, you'd consider her as a "good" Mezzo, which again I can't really agree with... like if we were to move everything up two semitones so we get more of a soprano sitting voice for the sake of comparing with the blog vocalists, that'd be E3~F5~B5. I'm pretty sure that'd still be something like a  great vocalist since it's sorta Ailee with a considerably better lower register, even though we can't really just directly translate a person's supported range into a rating since there's more to it than that

 

PHS aside, I'm interested in what about placement (or mask placement specifically?) has been proven false, if you feel like expanding on it!

 

Honestly, I always had this impression that some people were too optimistic about technically correct singing.  If your voice is "ugly" to people, singing in a technically-correct fashion won't necessarily make it sound attractive (even if it presumably wouldn't sound painful, at least (but lots of listeners don't hear strain when it's there anyway), and would extend your singing life).  That's why it's totally understandable that people do all sorts of improper things to achieve the sound they actually want from themselves.

The only classically-trained vocalist I know has a sexy-ass voice, so 

[lepidoptery]

I really wouldn't say that vocal health takes away from how skilled a vocalist is, though. That's like saying Mariah wasn't excellent because her vocal condition was inconsistent even during her prime    Unless you mean to say even if you were to take only D3~Eb5~A5, you'd consider her as a "good" Mezzo, which again I can't really agree with... like if we were to move everything up two semitones so we get more of a soprano sitting voice for the sake of comparing with the blog vocalists, that'd be E3~F5~B5. I'm pretty sure that'd still be something like a  great vocalist since it's sorta Ailee with a considerably better lower register, even though we can't really just directly translate a person's supported range into a rating since there's more to it than that

Theoretically I agree with you, but I feel like there's some value to expressing the idea that "X is a theoretically Great (or whatever) vocalist who you can usually expect merely Good performances out of due to reasons" if it's really that pervasive an issue.  Otherwise people's expectations will be too high and/or they'll just assume a performance from a Great vocalist is Great all the time.

[BadBadNotGood]

@0:12

Bey's agility is damn crazy

 

 

Ari's voice is so pretty and she has a lot of potential, but last I checked she would be, with her consistency as it is, somewhere around an average to above average vocalist . She has supported in the fifth octave before and she used to, like before her days on nickelodeon, consistently have like C5/C#5 down, but the current her only has F3~Bb4/Maybe B4(?) and dealing with a whole bunch of issues with intonation, jaw tension, breath control, consistent support above the fourth octave, nasality

 

 

0:47 is like my fave perf from her. The dress and the camera work were on point

Thank you! So in your opinion she actually regressed? Edited February 27, 2017 by Cerulyn

[ParkHyoLee]

Theoretically I agree with you, but I feel like there's some value to expressing the idea that "X is a theoretically Great (or whatever) vocalist who you can usually expect merely Good performances out of due to reasons" if it's really that pervasive an issue.  Otherwise people's expectations will be too high and/or they'll just assume a performance from a Great vocalist is Great all the time.

Is there even any meaning in giving a rating to someone when they're sick tho  Like I would just say "they're sick so you can't expect the best performance from them at the moment, but they're capable of consistently performing at a certain level when they're in their best condition". I would say there's meaning in that if they sing that way a very long amount of time tho, like it can't just be every so often they're not performing at their best, but they're consistently incapable of doing things they used to be able to, like Hyolyn or something vs Sohyang on her off days 

 

Thank you! So in your opinion she actually regressed?

I think everyone agrees that Ari was a stronger vocalist pre-Nickelodeon, and as Cat Valentine came in and she stuck with that way of singing, her skill regressed   . I don't really follow ariana like that, so I can't say if she's improved within like the past year or something 

Edited February 27, 2017 by ParkHyoLee

[lepidoptery]

Is there even any meaning in giving a rating to someone when they're sick tho  Like I would just say "they're sick so you can't expect the best performance from them at the moment, but they're capable of consistently performing at a certain level when they're in their best condition". I would say there's meaning in that if they sing that way a very long amount of time tho, like it can't just be every so often they're not performing at their best, but they're consistently incapable of doing things they used to be able to, like Hyolyn or something vs Sohyang on her off days 

 

I think everyone agrees that Ari was a stronger vocalist pre-Nickelodeon, and as Cat Valentine came in and she stuck with that way of singing, her skill regressed   . I don't really follow ariana like that, so I can't say if she's improved within like the past year or something 

It seems like Natsulian is saying she's sick that often, though.

[sakurahanabira]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJCA8EcxoFc

 

I don't want to name every single high notes in the song cuz they're everywhere but how were her high notes at 2:38, 2:40, 2:44, 2:49, 2:52, and 2:55? 

Edited February 27, 2017 by lavender mint

[BAZISSINO]

I haven't listened to Tori in the past while so I'm not totally certain about her, but last I checked she was somewhere around P to G. I'm not part of the blog so I'm not sure if she exactly fits their criteria, but Tori is definitely skilled enough imo to be in that area with consistent resonance up to C#5 and support down to F3 and up to D5 (I'm not sure about her head voice).

 

Demi and Ari sound about right?

 

The major thing I disagree with is Jojo being good. No way she's only good with C#3~E5/F5~A5/Bb5 as a mezzo. Over the new year she showcased some really nice F5s, but I'm not sure how consistent she is with them. She was at least a Great vocalist before the New Year and honestly I'd vote for  Great to Excellent for her at the moment

Tori Support Eb3/E3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoVL4ZaXzEA

[indigo]

Irene and Seulgi sang Tears 

 

 

 

But better yet, Seulgi covered Fate

 

 

 

and this No Doubt sounding song 

 

 

Edited February 27, 2017 by Indigo

[Avatarkyungsoo]

Irene and Seulgi sang Tears 

 

 

 

But better yet, Seulgi covered Fate

 

 

 

and this No Doubt sounding song 

 

 

they really love making people sing Tears on these shows lol

Edited February 27, 2017 by Kevin92

[Celest]

Thanks to everyone for answering my question! 

 

I can't wait to see how far Demi and Ari can go, although it seems Ari's hit a wall with her recent tour performances and Demi's starting to regain the ease she had in her upper register.  

 

Ari used to consistently support up to B4/C5 (C5/C#5 in her older days), but her recent tour has showcased her struggling to support B4's, C5's, and C#5s.  Additionally, she's begun to lose the ease that she had in her upper register with more strain and struggle apparent in notes above E5.  However, the biggest setback would be her falsetto and whistle registers: her voice struggles to hit notes above C6 and her voice has cracked multiple times on the B5 in "Dangerous Woman."

 

As for kpop vocalists, I cannot wait to see what vocals Taeyeon will showcase on her first full album and I'm waiting for Sistar (Hyorin) and Mamamoo to slay me with their comebacks. 

[칼릴�]

Irene and Seulgi sang Tears 

 

 

 

But better yet, Seulgi covered Fate

 

 

 

and this No Doubt sounding song 

 

 

That's Irene head voice that G5 lol..god I hate Heechul.......

 

Also..that song is "If I leave" not Fate lol.

 

Also omg...Seulgi really needs to relax and open up..she's really squeezing and singing through her nose..like literally projecting through her nose..she's really nasal....

[Avatarkyungsoo]

Taeyeon raining D5s upon us lol! The song is so good i can't wait to hear her sing it live

 

[칼릴�]

Taeyeon raining D5s upon us lol! The song is so good i can't wait to hear her sing it live

 

I was feeling these D5s.

[jeong jaehyuns boyfriend]

at this point can we just change taeyeon's supported range from C#5/D5 to just D5 lmao. she's nailing it

[칼릴�]

at this point can we just change taeyeon's supported range from C#5/D5 to just D5 lmao. she's nailing it

No, we can't. Saying that means she sings D5 correctly 100% of the time without fail..and that's not really true..so it's safer to have it as "C#5/D5" because it allows room for error, y'know? There are times that TaeYeon messes up C#5 so it's cool.

Edited February 28, 2017 by 칼릴�

[jeong jaehyuns boyfriend]

No, we can't. Saying that means she sings D5 correctly 100% of the time without fail..and that's not really true..so it's safer to have it as "C#5/D5" because it allows room for error, y'know? There are times that TaeYeon messes up C#5 so it's cool.

 

but im pretty sure that even for the singers that we do list as supporting up to D5, they wont sing it correctly 100% of the time... nobody is perfect

i think a more fair way to consider it is maybe a 70% success rate or an 80% success rate. not even sohyang sings everything 100% all the time

[indigo]

That's Irene head voice that G5 lol..god I hate Heechul.......

 

Also..that song is "If I leave" not Fate lol.

 

Also omg...Seulgi really needs to relax and open up..she's really squeezing and singing through her nose..like literally projecting through her nose..she's really nasal....

Im a flop, If I Leave is my fav ost too.

[칼릴�]

but im pretty sure that even for the singers that we do list as supporting up to D5, they wont sing it correctly 100% of the time... nobody is perfect

i think a more fair way to consider it is maybe a 70% success rate or an 80% success rate. not even sohyang sings everything 100% all the time

Yeah, not even Sohyang does..which is why her supported range is G3/G#3-C6/C#6-F6/F#6....and she is a very consistent vocalist...

 

Whether it is C#5/D5 or D5 it doesn't matter...it doesn't change anything lol.

Edited February 28, 2017 by 칼릴�