Pristin and Seventeen

[baechulgi]

I just wanted to start a discussion about Pristin and Seventeen. I was inspired to after watching Seventeen's Adore U and Pristin's Wee Woo dance practice.

 

This isn't a thread made to start any fandom wars and talk about which one is better than the other, hence why I don't have a poll here lol to vote about who is better or not

 

I like both groups after all and think both groups are great in their own ways. I do think it'd be pretty normal to compare the two groups tbh considering how they're from the same company, debuted within 1 or 2 years from each other, and are of similar ages.

 

Other than gender, what do you think are some things about both groups that differ from each other as of what we've seen from both groups so far whether it's music style, concept, choreography, on-screen personalities, the way they're marketed, and etc?

[good_morning]

I just wanted to start a discussion about Pristin and Seventeen. I was inspired to after watching Seventeen's Adore U and Pristin's Wee Woo dance practice.

 

This isn't a thread made to start any fandom wars and talk about which one is better than the other, hence why I don't have a poll here lol to vote about who is better or not

 

I like both groups after all and think both groups are great in their own ways. I do think it'd be pretty normal to compare the two groups tbh considering how they're from the same company, debuted within 1 or 2 years from each other, and are of similar ages.

 

Other than gender, what do you think are some things about both groups that differ from each other as of what we've seen from both groups so far whether it's music style, concept, choreography, on-screen personalities, the way they're marketed, and etc?

 

None is even thinking about it

[Grape Soda]

Nothing against pristin, they have amazing vocalist and the girls are talented but when I saw seventeen I knew they'd be popular because they have 'it' that star quality thing. Pristin in my eyes doesn't have it. Their debut was pretty weak (compared to svt) and hardly showed off what they were capable of as singers, dancers or composers.

Yea they had heavy debut support from IOI fans and fans of their showcases but I don't see them climbing with the likes of twice, gfriend, red velvet and blackpink but more on the Dia or wjsn level. Both groups are great imo, svt just found their 'thing' immediately and pristin needs to work on that.

[luminavi]

Well for starters, I feel that in Seventeen, they don't have a concept of a "center" at all whereas in Pristin you can sort of sense that some girls are being pushed more than others. But maybe it's a girl group thing, people don't tend to focus on things like the "center" position for boy groups

[TruthKing]

Nothing against pristin, they have amazing vocalist and the girls are talented but when I saw seventeen I knew they'd be popular because they have 'it' that star quality thing. Pristin in my eyes doesn't have it. Their debut was pretty weak (compared to svt) and hardly showed off what they were capable of as singers, dancers or composers.

Yea they had heavy debut support from IOI fans and fans of their showcases but I don't see them climbing with the likes of twice, gfriend, red velvet and blackpink but more on the Dia or wjsn level. Both groups are great imo, svt just found their 'thing' immediately and pristin needs to work on that.

 

I disagree with your opinion, Pristin definitely have that it factor

They have powerful stage presence and charisma that I don't see with many groups, and I personally love their debut album. Different people different taste I guess. The members are such stan attractors too. I can see many of them doing well in different fields in the future. 

[럴커]

I'm stanning both seventeen and pristin and its easier to find similarity from both of em..seventeen just older..

 

music style : i cant pinpoint their style yet bc i think pristin still too young and need work on that

concept : pristin power pretty and seventeen (idk?) passionate young boy (?)

choreo : they both have sharp moves, in sync, but still fun to watch..

personality : pristin gave you chic feeling more than seventeen lol.. seventeen just shameless kinda classmate feeling (?)

the way they marketed : idk how to answer this..

 

I love them both, they give me positive feeling

[baechulgi]

Well for starters, I feel that in Seventeen, they don't have a concept of a "center" at all whereas in Pristin you can sort of sense that some girls are being pushed more than others. But maybe it's a girl group thing, people don't tend to focus on things like the "center" position for boy groups

yeah i gotta agree about the center thing. I wonder if members of Pristin hadn't participated in PD101, would certain members of Pristin still be pushed more than others?

[StanSEVENTEEN2019]

Nothing against pristin, they have amazing vocalist and the girls are talented but when I saw seventeen I knew they'd be popular because they have 'it' that star quality thing. Pristin in my eyes doesn't have it. Their debut was pretty weak (compared to svt) and hardly showed off what they were capable of as singers, dancers or composers.

Yea they had heavy debut support from IOI fans and fans of their showcases but I don't see them climbing with the likes of twice, gfriend, red velvet and blackpink but more on the Dia or wjsn level. Both groups are great imo, svt just found their 'thing' immediately and pristin needs to work on that.

 

Hmmm Idk about you but the moment Pristin was introduce in the public back then in PD101, Actually they are the first goup Mnet Introduce and since then they capture a lot of interest for me atleast they give me the same feels when I discover Seventeen and this is coming from a fan who's been with Seventeen since Predebut. 

[carlodorz]

at least PRISTIN they make their own music unlike others got spoon feeding musics

[✨ Ass Fat ✨]

Nothing against pristin, they have amazing vocalist and the girls are talented but when I saw seventeen I knew they'd be popular because they have 'it' that star quality thing. Pristin in my eyes doesn't have it. Their debut was pretty weak (compared to svt) and hardly showed off what they were capable of as singers, dancers or composers.

Yea they had heavy debut support from IOI fans and fans of their showcases but I don't see them climbing with the likes of twice, gfriend, red velvet and blackpink but more on the Dia or wjsn level. Both groups are great imo, svt just found their 'thing' immediately and pristin needs to work on that.

I hardy disagree 

Pristin has that factor and even with Seventeen despite Adore U being good they were all called out as failures and that they would flop. 

Yes Pristin has a backing due to pre-debut activities but they have a lot of potential and whos to say groups like WJSN and DIA won't succeed? 

[luminavi]

yeah i gotta agree about the center thing. I wonder if members of Pristin hadn't participated in PD101, would certain members of Pristin still be pushed more than others?

I think the only difference would be Kyulkyung. She didn't appear individually in any other MVs unlike Roa (Falling Slowly with Han Dong Geun/Raina's You End And Me), Nayoung (Hanhae's Man of the Year), Siyeon (Nuest's I'm Bad) and Yuha (Nuest's Overcome). She only appeared in SVT's Mansae with the '98 line and even so you could barely see her face. I'm pretty sure Pledis didn't think she would blow up the way she did. Even the CEO was surprised she took no.1 visual during Produce 101. If she didn't appear in Produce 101, I wouldn't be surprised if she'd be part of the underrated line like how Jun and The8 are in Seventeen.

[Paragonatic]

Concept-wise, Pristin is a bit fiercer than Seventeen due to their "Power & Pretty" theme. Seventeen still has this fresh young boy image to them.

 

In terms of looks, it might just be me but I think Pristin looks older than Seventeen lol. Also Pristin looks really chic and elite while Seventeen seems like really friendly guys.

[KhAS]

If the existing famous members aren't pushed on debut, Pledis would just end up being criticized.  It's just like IOI crush video when ppl kicked a shit up about Yeonjung being too prominent and then they released version 2 of the MV.

People expect to see the famous ones, so you have to satisfy that expectation somewhat.

 

Of course pledis would want to promote other members so the burden of representing the group don't fall solely on 1 or 2 people, especially with a group that size - and this can be seen in line distribution for wee woo, as it's very fair overall - but it is a debut, and so it's basically like using their famous ppl as the MC's to introduce the rest to the members to the public.

 

If PD101 didn't happen at all, the main difference would be that the group would have been fronted solely by Xiyeon as she would have been the most recognized of all the members from all her pre-debut work - along with her 9 years of training and being Pledis's golden child and a reliable visual.  For a  debut model It would have worked fine, but it would also be a long slog to keep dropping members into programs and hope that ppl notice them eventually.

 

On another note, if Afterschool had never lost it's momentum, all of the Pristin girls would have eventually joined and they would be Afterschool by now.  The idea being the whole popularity of the group would ease the transition of a new member in, meaning you can just keep running the same girl group like a brand and swap ppl in easily.  The only problem was that the graduation system, I feel, is that it ended up becoming very stressful to fans.  The same model was basically how CCM tried to make Hwa and Dani happen, by putting them in T-ara, the only difference between Pledis and CCM was that CCM was just more upfront about it.  'New student' and 'graduation' is just another way of saying 'new member' and 'withdrawal,' and each should be done in moderation - instead, Pledis made it AS's concept.

 

The problem is that there will be a point where ppl say - It's just not "group name" anymore.

eg: If SNSD recruited a replacement for Jessica right now, and then another member left, and then another got recruited  - etc etc etc, at some point ppl would say "it's just not SNSD anymore"  and whilst Playgirlz/boyz have been mostly accepting and have been prepared for AS's graduation concept, it's disheartening when a favorite era has a member lineups that doesn't exist anymore.

[woozi's noona]

i've been waiting for pristin debut for a year and i'm kinda disappointed with them. i know pledis is trying to rebrand their artist as "self produced idol" but it's not working really good for pristin

 

i think it'sbecause pledis try to make it happen with pristin while it just happened with seventeen. woozi is their core and he even said that he became all of their song's writer without even realizing it. meanwhile i think pledis tried to push shannon as second woozi but it's so 

 

the girls still have a lot of time ahead of them, but seventeen has always been solid since their debut. from choreo, song, and even their role. they know what their weakness and strength and they use their resources well

 

on the other side, all of the pristin girls are so talented individually, but they seem to haven't found the right formula about them. they have many good singer but they don't use it in their title track which the only thing most people check out. they have good dancers but their choreo are missing something.

 

if i have to take example, look at pristin's black widow. i don't know what it is but it really missing something. they dont really have climax in the song, especially in their choreo. they put shannon to do the cartwheel but it didn't really make me go "wow it's so cool" because i think it;s kinda misplaced. they have the resources and the abbility but they don't know how to do things. 

 

i had a big hope for their debut but wee woo is just tragic. even though i love my girl yehana, there's no way i'm gonna support that song

 

i really hope they had a comeback with a more solid song. i really want to support them but i just can't stand wee woo. 

 

well, the girls still have a long way ahead of them so i hope they learned their lessons

[karecity]

yeah i gotta agree about the center thing. I wonder if members of Pristin hadn't participated in PD101, would certain members of Pristin still be pushed more than others?

I believe Nayoung was always meant to be the main dancer. It's obvious in their Mannequin performance during svt's showcase & PD101 Bang performance that she's mostly in the center for the point choreography. Her dancing skill may not be EXCEPTIONAL but I think she makes a good center for dance formations. I think Pinky has definitely been pushed more due to her being the most popular!

[modern times]

Nothing against pristin, they have amazing vocalist and the girls are talented but when I saw seventeen I knew they'd be popular because they have 'it' that star quality thing. Pristin in my eyes doesn't have it. Their debut was pretty weak (compared to svt) and hardly showed off what they were capable of as singers, dancers or composers.

Yea they had heavy debut support from IOI fans and fans of their showcases but I don't see them climbing with the likes of twice, gfriend, red velvet and blackpink but more on the Dia or wjsn level. Both groups are great imo, svt just found their 'thing' immediately and pristin needs to work on that.

 

 

i've been waiting for pristin debut for a year and i'm kinda disappointed with them. i know pledis is trying to rebrand their artist as "self produced idol" but it's not working really good for pristin

 

i think it'sbecause pledis try to make it happen with pristin while it just happened with seventeen. woozi is their core and he even said that he became all of their song's writer without even realizing it. meanwhile i think pledis tried to push shannon as second woozi but it's so 

 

the girls still have a lot of time ahead of them, but seventeen has always been solid since their debut. from choreo, song, and even their role. they know what their weakness and strength and they use their resources well

 

on the other side, all of the pristin girls are so talented individually, but they seem to haven't found the right formula about them. they have many good singer but they don't use it in their title track which the only thing most people check out. they have good dancers but their choreo are missing something.

 

if i have to take example, look at pristin's black widow. i don't know what it is but it really missing something. they dont really have climax in the song, especially in their choreo. they put shannon to do the cartwheel but it didn't really make me go "wow it's so cool" because i think it;s kinda misplaced. they have the resources and the abbility but they don't know how to do things. 

 

i had a big hope for their debut but wee woo is just tragic. even though i love my girl yehana, there's no way i'm gonna support that song

 

i really hope they had a comeback with a more solid song. i really want to support them but i just can't stand wee woo. 

 

well, the girls still have a long way ahead of them so i hope they learned their lessons

 

lol at seventeen fans once again putting down pristin to praise their faves, you all aren't slick.

 

seventeen's debut album was awful, 'hi! pristin' is a masterpiece in comparison, so i don't wanna hear anything about pristin "still lacking talent/training when it comes to composing and writing songs" or whatever you like to claim. there are a lot of people that love wee woo and, believe it or not, not everyone enjoys seventeen's songs. seventeen's pre-love&letter music was below average for the most part.

 

the girls are great performers and i'd say even more stable than seventeen were when they debuted. they're funny, beautiful and in my opinion do have "star quality" (something that is completely subjective lmao). they're doing extremely well already, their first week sales are AMAZING for a rookie girl group (they also out-sold 17carat's first week sales by a long shot, just saying) and their mvs/performances are getting lots of views on youtube. they are already more popular than seventeen were when they debuted, so i don't know why you think they aren't going to do well (or as well as seventeen) in the future.

 

to answer op's question, i think seventeen are better dancers on average than pristin but pristin are better singers (as in, have more decent vocalists). however, both are equally enjoyabe to watch perform, it's what made me like both groups.

[Kwon Fire]

lol at seventeen fans once again putting down pristin to praise their faves, you all aren't slick.

 

seventeen's debut album was awful, 'hi! pristin' is a masterpiece in comparison, so i don't wanna hear anything about pristin "still lacking talent/training when it comes to composing and writing songs" or whatever you like to claim. there are a lot of people that love wee woo and, believe it or not, not everyone enjoys seventeen's songs. seventeen's pre-love&letter music was below average for the most part.

 

the girls are great performers and i'd say even more stable than seventeen were when they debuted. they're funny, beautiful and in my opinion do have "star quality" (something that is completely subjective lmao). they're doing extremely well already, their first week sales are AMAZING for a rookie girl group (they also out-sold 17carat's first week sales by a long shot, just saying) and their mvs/performances are getting lots of views on youtube. they are already more popular than seventeen were when they debuted, so i don't know why you think they aren't going to do well (or as well as seventeen) in the future.

 

to answer op's question, i think seventeen are better dancers on average than pristin but pristin are better singers (as in, have more decent vocalists). however, both are equally enjoyabe to watch perform, it's what made me like both groups.

I stopped at the first sentence, you should respect everyone's opinion, just because they are 17 fans doesn't mean that they should give positives opinions.

 

Beside that my reply to the op :

Both groups are great and have great vocals and this is the most important part. Both have great and energitic performances, also a lot of charisma

Wee woo didn't show their vocals  and composition skills compared to adore U, and imo adore U >>>> wee woo ( tho I really liked both), but they are really capable, their others songs sound cleaner.

just give to the girls some time

[modern times]

I stopped at the first sentence, you should respect everyone's opinion, just because they are 17 fans doesn't mean that they should give positives opinions.

 

nowhere did i say seventeen fans had to give "positive opinions"? i'm a seventeen fan myself. i respect people's opinions but the people i replied to were being hypocritical. seventeen weren't musical genuines when they debuted either, so all the criticism towards pristin's music, which as a whole is at the very least just as good as seventeen's was in the beginning, just seems over the top.

 

maybe respect my opinion and actually read my post next time instead of downvoting it?

[Kwon Fire]

nowhere did i say seventeen fans had to give "positive opinions"? i'm a seventeen fan myself. i respect people's opinions but the people i replied to were being hypocritical. seventeen weren't musical genuines when they debuted either, so all the criticism towards pristin's music, which as a whole is at the very least just as good as seventeen's was in the beginning, just seems over the top.

 

maybe respect my opinion and actually read my post next time instead of downvoting it?

Hmm i've read and "seventeen's debut album was awful, 'hi! pristin' is a masterpiece in comparison" Not everyone think the same thing either, and you were basically putting down seventeen to praise pristin and made it seems like a fact lol.

"lol at seventeen fans once again putting down pristin to praise their faves, you all aren't slick." Meh ? They just gave their opinions, you don't have to claim that they are "seventeen fans" and make it seems like their put pristin down just because of that ?

---

And yes you are right, they shouldn't have putten their composition skills down because they have a lot of potential which they didn't show in wee woo but their others songs sound clean ( "we" did chart well and koreans liked it for exemple)

[Moa_Nunu]

i've been waiting for pristin debut for a year and i'm kinda disappointed with them. i know pledis is trying to rebrand their artist as "self produced idol" but it's not working really good for pristin

 

i think it'sbecause pledis try to make it happen with pristin while it just happened with seventeen. woozi is their core and he even said that he became all of their song's writer without even realizing it. meanwhile i think pledis tried to push shannon as second woozi but it's so 

 

the girls still have a lot of time ahead of them, but seventeen has always been solid since their debut. from choreo, song, and even their role. they know what their weakness and strength and they use their resources well

 

on the other side, all of the pristin girls are so talented individually, but they seem to haven't found the right formula about them. they have many good singer but they don't use it in their title track which the only thing most people check out. they have good dancers but their choreo are missing something.

 

if i have to take example, look at pristin's black widow. i don't know what it is but it really missing something. they dont really have climax in the song, especially in their choreo. they put shannon to do the cartwheel but it didn't really make me go "wow it's so cool" because i think it;s kinda misplaced. they have the resources and the abbility but they don't know how to do things. 

 

i had a big hope for their debut but wee woo is just tragic. even though i love my girl yehana, there's no way i'm gonna support that song

 

i really hope they had a comeback with a more solid song. i really want to support them but i just can't stand wee woo. 

 

well, the girls still have a long way ahead of them so i hope they learned their lessons

 

This is really great criticism and I agree with many of your points. Pristin still has a long ways to go in their creative endeavors because it's difficult to know what works with the general public until you put something out. Which is why you find a range of different styles and concepts with this debut... they're really testing the waters at this point. And about composition, I think they will get better over time... there are 10 of them and they all have different tastes in music. It takes experience to develop your own style and it takes time to develop maturity in songwriting. They will get there, I have faith in them and from where they've started I can tell they have potential. It's good to have room to improve imo. If everything's perfect then there's no reason to change or do something different.

 

Their pre-debut songs like Rollercoaster and We are excellent... but you can obviously hear traces of Woozi in Rollercoaster since he composed it. While I do think this kind of style fits Pristin, I wonder if the general public would be more receptive. I hope they do give this a try next time and see where that goes. Even though things like positions, songwriting, choreo might be a little messy... I still find Wee Woo really enjoyable... and that's something. If people don't like the song I honestly don't blame them, however, their potential is amazing because their foundation is really solid. There is gold there to be mined... Pledis just needs a bit of time to figure out how to best use that wealth of talent.

[Moa_Nunu]

Nothing against pristin, they have amazing vocalist and the girls are talented but when I saw seventeen I knew they'd be popular because they have 'it' that star quality thing. Pristin in my eyes doesn't have it. Their debut was pretty weak (compared to svt) and hardly showed off what they were capable of as singers, dancers or composers.

Yea they had heavy debut support from IOI fans and fans of their showcases but I don't see them climbing with the likes of twice, gfriend, red velvet and blackpink but more on the Dia or wjsn level. Both groups are great imo, svt just found their 'thing' immediately and pristin needs to work on that.

 

Hmm... you're allowed to have your own opinion and that's cool, but honestly what attracted me to Pristin/Pledis Girlz in the first place is that they have that 'it" quality. From the first time they stood on the pd101 stage I could feel it and when you compare them to other trainees on that show... you just know that they have it together. Outside of their talents and skills, they have awesome charisma. They have that star quality that demands the attention of your eyeballs. It might take some trial and error for them to figure out how to best utilize their strengths and weaknesses as a team, but they're honestly doing quite well imo.

 

One thing I have to stress when it comes to performance is that it's really difficult to directly compare girl groups with boy groups because males and females are different. There are athletic things that males can do that females just can't because their bodies aren't built the same... that's normal. Otherwise there wouldn't be male and female categories in the Olympics. You can look at kpop covers where girls try to do boygroup choreos... it's not always successful and a lot of times they would have to adopt a different way of moving to compensate which sometimes make things look awkward. This is why Pristin's Adore U choreo is different and feels different.

[Moa_Nunu]

Why am I writing essays about Pristin lol... I should be studying.

[KhAS]

Pristin's debut is fine.  The point is to introduce everyone in the group - that's why weewoo tries to cover all the members personalities whilst giving them a fair distribution of lines - the track itself is unconventional and allows for more dance highlight points, but while it's not as familiar as standard pop tracks, it's easy to get accustomed to after multiple listens.  

[Grape Soda]

lol at seventeen fans once again putting down pristin to praise their faves, you all aren't slick.

 

seventeen's debut album was awful, 'hi! pristin' is a masterpiece in comparison, so i don't wanna hear anything about pristin "still lacking talent/training when it comes to composing and writing songs" or whatever you like to claim. there are a lot of people that love wee woo and, believe it or not, not everyone enjoys seventeen's songs. seventeen's pre-love&letter music was below average for the most part.

 

the girls are great performers and i'd say even more stable than seventeen were when they debuted. they're funny, beautiful and in my opinion do have "star quality" (something that is completely subjective lmao). they're doing extremely well already, their first week sales are AMAZING for a rookie girl group (they also out-sold 17carat's first week sales by a long shot, just saying) and their mvs/performances are getting lots of views on youtube. they are already more popular than seventeen were when they debuted, so i don't know why you think they aren't going to do well (or as well as seventeen) in the future.

 

to answer op's question, i think seventeen are better dancers on average than pristin but pristin are better singers (as in, have more decent vocalists). however, both are equally enjoyabe to watch perform, it's what made me like both groups.

Me being a seventeen fan has zero to do with my opinion of pristin. It was purely constructive criticism, if you can't understand that oh well.

[MOONBIN]

idk imo I think some Pristin members don't stand out as much as others. While in Seventeen every member is highlighted in a certain way even if they have more members. Maybe it's an effect of p101