Importance of ethics and morals training in K-Pop

[Skyblue4U]

I've been reading a lot on K-Pop idols with blackface controversies, cultural scandals and bad manners and there are some things that we should discuss as a community of k-pop fans.
Idols are not perfect. They're humans. Humans make mistakes. Defending the mistakes the idols do is not a job for fans. Instead we should focus our energy on supporting them if and when they learn from their mistakes.
If someone no longer wants to be a fan because they feel offended then it's in their every right.

So we recently read about Mamamoo's black face controversy. This question is brought up often..."When will K-Pop Idols learn?" This goes beyond K-Pop and more on korean or even asian culture in general. My family is Filipino and they watch a lot of Filipino shows. Black face happens there too. It happens in other aspects of Korean Pop Culture such as variety shows and comedy shows. It's part of their comedic culture. Should we judge them on this?
In America, we find sexual jokes as a great source of comedy in our pop culture. A great example is American Pie. Regardless if you find that movie actually funny or not, the sexual comedy there is acceptable while in conservative countries like China and Korea, that comedy is very sensitive. 
The comparison might be unfair but I just wanted to demonstrate that their are cultural differences in our comedy.
Should blackface be defended. ABSOLUTELY NOT! but we need to understand that there's context beyond what's ok for us as international fans and what korean fans are ok with.
This is where training comes in. JYPE makes their trainees go through ethics and morals courses that teaches them about being appropriate and making sure their idols are positive role models for their fans (both domestically and internationally). It's not bulletproof. JYPE artists obviously had their share of controversies. [Got7's Bambam for example] but it's a start. K-Pop as an industry is becoming more popular globally and as an international fan I would love for our idols to be more aware of what's ok in other cultures . With that type of training JYPE offers i doubt you would see a Twice member calling their fans gross and making them want to vomit (unlike a former Boys24 member) but because Korea is so culturally different from other countries, it's a hard line to walk on. No one is safe.
Even veterans of the industry like SNSD's Tiffany was caught posting something at the wrong time and Korea was very upset. A lot of SONES where like, "netizens need to chill" but culturally, it's a very sensitive topic to them. Like how blackface is a sensitive topic for international fans, I'm sure there are k-fans writing somewhere that we need to chill.
It's all perspective! and it's difficult. 
I'm a geography major and I minor in anthropoly.(probably not gonna get a job when I graduate) 
cultural globalization is a thing. but it takes time.
We shouldn't defend our idols when they make mistakes that offend us but we also need to have an understanding of what their jokes mean to them.
Point being, I hope Mamamoo understands why blackface is wrong. I hope BTS coming from a smaller company has the racecourses to get trained on these cultural sensitivities. I hope Korea isn't still mad at Tiffany.
As K-Pop fans, we need to hope that the idols we look up to get educated because they're not perfect. Like us, they also need guidance at times.

[Sour Patch]

Honestly all trainees should receive some sort of cultural education. Especially since kpop groups are starting to rely on international fans for money and touring. 

[MilkLatte]

Honestly all trainees should receive some sort of cultural education. Especially since kpop groups are starting to rely on international fans for money and touring. 

 

Agree. Although Kpop hasn't quite yet broken into the mainstream internationally, there is still a lot of support and international fandoms are another income revenue.

[PARADISE.MP3]

Great read

[ASS]

Btw about BTS getting educated..they had a reality show in 2014 called AHL set in LA. Where they learned the true meaning of hip hop. They actually learned a lot and I for one am glad they had that chance. And I hope many other groups get the chance to get educated on these issues.

 

It was nice reading your thoughts btw.

[Full Moon]

Oh look someone who is not yelling "Cancelled"  "Disgusting" and " Unstan" and is actually adressing the issue with actual arguments and at the same time compare both cultures and situations

Thank you for this tbh

[crush2NE1]

I agree. It still surprises me how many of these issues come up when K-pop companies should well know how much international fans get offended by these things.

[Daria~]

This is the best response I've seen so far concerning recent events. Considering how small the Korean entertainment industry is, and their over-reliance on the international Kpop fandom, it will really be in the best interest of idols to either take the initiative upon themselves to learn these things or for their companies to teach them. Besides not wanting to piss off international fans for monetary purposes, it's really just basic human courtesy to learn about the culture of people you interact with.

[Catallena]

Oh look someone who is not yelling "Cancelled"  "Disgusting" and " Unstan" and is actually adressing the issue with actual arguments and at the same time compare both cultures and situations

Thank you for this tbh

!!!

[hallah]

it's a whole clusterfuck, tbh. black mirror did a great episode on this. the moment someone makes a mistake and that mistake enters the spotlight, the witch hunt begins, no matter how unintentional the mistake.

 

i'm so tired of the fact that you can't just enjoy anything anymore. so-and-so is "problematic." they're "canceled" because they're not "woke" and they need to be "educated." but then on that same token it's fine for kpop fans to criticize and fetishize koreans and their culture.

 

i'm not forgiving black face or racist or colourist comments. i think they're awful. i think idols who do make these mistakes need to be educated, and if they refuse to learn, then i do agree they deserve to lose fans. but i don't know. i guess i'm just "war-weary." there's just always some kind of controversy. you'd think after all this time companies and their idols would learn.

[Skyblue4U]

Btw about BTS getting educated..they had a reality show in 2014 called AHL set in LA. Where they learned the true meaning of hip hop. They actually learned a lot and I for one am glad they had that chance. And I hope many other groups get the chance to get educated on these issues.

 

It was nice reading your thoughts btw.

It's great to know that BTS takes their hip hop genre seriously and are getting educated in that aspect. I also appreciate how Rapmon takes the time to learn other languages to better interact with his fans. BTS has great intentions and im sure theyre striving to be good examples for their fans. Sometimes they can be inappropriate too but so are we at times as well.

[DeeDeeDD]

Honestly all trainees should receive some sort of cultural education. Especially since kpop groups are starting to rely on international fans for money and touring. 

hmm... I think "international" here is kinda vague (?) In western country or Asian ? Kpop is not mainstream in western country tho. But they're relevant enough within Asian, they also rely on those "international" fans. That's why Asian-culture-related controversial issue are matter more, like Tzuyu flag issue, Tiffany Japanese issue, Quran CL issue (SEAN country like Indonesia, Malaysia, Brunei are mostly Moslem), etc. but not smth like blackface.

[JessicaRabbit]

Agree with ASS about how important it is being introduced to other cultures beside your own. Learning about the music you're singing can open your mind, your eyes and your understanding. Example: Through meeting Alex, Z.IU learned more English and fun facts about America and Blacks. Girl stayed up to watch Obama's goodbye speech in the car lol.

 

EDIT: Its weird how so many of these idols don't bother to look up things though. Since listening to JPOP and KPOP, I've learned so much about the history and the holidays and the culture. It started off just for the music but to understand more about the people I follow, I looked up some things. How these people are "real rappers" or "into hip hop" but can't even tell you where and why hip hop started. 

 

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[Skyblue4U]

hmm... I think "international" here is kinda vague (?) In western country or Asian ? Kpop is not mainstream in western country tho. But they're relevant enough within Asian, they also rely on those "international" fans. That's why controversial issue that relate to Asian culture is matter more, like Tzuyu flag issue, Tiffany Japanese issue, Quran CL issue (SEAN country like Indonesia, Malaysia, Brunei are mostly Moslem), etc. but not smth like blackface.

absolutely a good point! In terms of training they should definitely be aware of where the majority of their fans come from. Considering K-Pop is mostly an Asian thing for now, they should be trained in asian culture awareness. but things that are blackface related or for example. if an idol where to be asked what their ideal type is and they respond "I don't like dark skinned girls/boys"

Those are issued that can hurt an idols personal brand regardless if they're just being honest with their taste...it hurts peoples feelings. So i believe that their should be more awareness in what idols say and do

[Hwayoung]

this was a good read

 

but tbh in terms of international presence (as in beyond asia) i'm really not feeling that coming from kpop rn it's still niche 

i think people r thinking/making it out to be bigger than it actually is since they're biased from consuming and actively participating this music culture

[Livy]

Even veterans of the industry like SNSD's Tiffany was caught posting something at the wrong time and Korea was very upset. A lot of SONES where like, "netizens need to chill" but culturally, it's a very sensitive topic to them. Like how blackface is a sensitive topic for international fans, I'm sure there are k-fans writing somewhere that we need to chill.

It's all perspective! and it's difficult. 

I'm a geography major and I minor in anthropoly.(probably not gonna get a job when I graduate) 

cultural globalization is a thing. but it takes time.

We shouldn't defend our idols when they make mistakes that offend us but we also need to have an understanding of what their jokes mean to them.

Point being, I hope Mamamoo understands why blackface is wrong. I hope BTS coming from a smaller company has the racecourses to get trained on these cultural sensitivities. I hope Korea isn't still mad at Tiffany.

As K-Pop fans, we need to hope that the idols we look up to get educated because they're not perfect. Like us, they also need guidance at times.

 

Dude, knetz were calling for Tiffany to get executed and raped, hoping she'd "join her dead mother". Sones saying "netizens need to chill" was HIGHLY justified. If knetz had just been calling her stupid bitch while demanding an apology I would've been understanding, but the witchhunt went WAY beyond that. Plenty of (non-sone) koreans INCLUDING JTBC defended her saying the witch hunt was blown way out of proportions.

[onieyez]

 I think Mamamoo will get away from this unscathed

since it's not really that much of a problem for Korea, since they see blackface as a comedy

 

but we'll see, i haven't seen any translated comments of knetz yet

[Ploopy678]

While tiffany's incident, for example, was tiffany's fault (it was her personal decision to post the photo with the caption), mamamoo's black face was smth mamamoo was assigned to do by their company as part of their schedule, so u can't really compare the 2 situations....

 

That being said, I agree with the fact that netizens overreact and blow things out of proportion and if they really are SO CONCERNED about the issue (which i doubt is actually the case) they should try to educate the artist, company and the general public. I think most of these netizens that overreact are just looking for opportunities to take these idols down though... and I doubt they are actually as passionate about the issue as they claim they are

[Kevin Bacon]

Great, great thread. Couldn't agree with you more.

[Skyblue4U]

Dude, knetz were calling for Tiffany to get executed and raped, hoping she'd "join her dead mother". Sones saying "netizens need to chill" was HIGHLY justified. If knetz had just been calling her stupid bitch while demanding an apology I would've been understanding, but the witchhunt went WAY beyond that. 

Thanks for giving me more context. 

'm sure most comments where "this stupid bitch needs to leave our country"

and for those asking her to die and get rape. knets need to chill is HIGHLY JUSTIFIED indeed

 

Tiffany's scandal escalated a lot because of how sensitive the subject is in Korea.

If there was a white female celebrity that did blackface in the U.S you can expect some nasty comments and a witch hunt sent her way too.

 

I still hope my point got across in terms of how Tiffany's scandal could've been avoided if she was more careful or more educated. More trained. It's a mess and it's horrible

[Septiplier]

I think it's important to have conversations and discussions about issues like this even if it makes some people uncomfortable. Going back and forth yelling at each other doesn't move the conversation forward. Dialogue is important seeing other peoples perspectives is important. Being open minded to how others feel is important. We could all learn something.

[Skyblue4U]

I think it's important to have conversations and discussions about issues like this even if it makes some people uncomfortable. Going back and forth yelling at each other doesn't move the conversation forward. Dialogue is important seeing other peoples perspectives is important. Being open minded to how others feel is important. We could all learn something.

Having good dialogue skills and willingness to see other peoples perspectives is an important thing to have. Forums are a great avenue to have proper discussions and dialogues but it's also an easy avenue to drop a hate comment out of frustration without it affecting you negatively.

Forums and even Twitter is a sharp double-edged sword.

[Apple Gel]

Honestly all trainees should receive some sort of cultural education. Especially since kpop groups are starting to rely on international fans for money and touring. 

 

Agree with this. After what happen to Tzuyu, political education is needed too

[Skyblue4U]

Agree with this. After what happen to Tzuyu, political education is needed too

For Tzuyu's case, I believe there was a Taiwanese celebrity that took to social media when she saw the flag. From what I understand, it's not Tzuyu's fault at all. She was just the scapegoat for a bigger problem. and it's awful that it happened to a 16 year old.

I'm sure she had some knowledge of that type of politics, but ultimately that wouldn't matter.

She would've gotten in trouble if she didn't wave her flag, she still got in trouble because she did wave a flag.

Ultimately JYPE learned from this mistake and succeeded in preventing other similar scandals.

Like the fan that handed Mina a hat shaped like Mt. Fuji and she didn't see the rising sun symbol on it. The staff was quick to deal with that and thankfully the fan apologized for his mistake.

Everyone learns 

[First Order]

Kpop companies usually think that only Koreans that visit YouTube or other sns.and their groups only exist for koreans only.So,that's why they don't bother anything about other races culture.