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[MBC Drama] "The King Loves" / Siwan, Yoona & Hong Jonghyun


Konjo

  

101 members have voted

  1. 1. Which team are you on?

    • Team Won x San (WonSan)
      29
    • Team Rin x San (RinSan)
      63
    • Can't decide!
      9


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I just started watching! I'm not a drama (even anime/series) person since I get really emotional. But I started to watch this for Yoona and it's really good. The story progresses fast enough for my short attention span and the scenes don't feel too heavy! ahmagahplz.png

 

I envy the romance and the bromance. Heck, I don't know who I want to replace given the chance. San's just damn too pretty and endearing, Won's smile is heart-fluttering, and Rin makes me question my sexuality. warstarplz.png

 

I laughed so hard at the bold part above! laugh.png

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which pair should be the real one? gosh. the writer makes me invest more in wang won love story.. dont blame me for loving how sweet won treating san.. (i always love nice guys, who makes his lady smilling than sad.)......... because i also would  blame writer to makes me this way..
 

since there was no love line from san side to won in the novel.

wishing writer to stop making this complicated love triangle if she want to stick with novel ending. or giving me little hints if she is suppose to love the another man, than giving leading lady smile for sweetest crown prince everywhere when she was with him.

(i dont know where the spoiler tag lol) sorry

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I laughed so hard at the bold part above! laugh.png

 

Rin brings out the inner needy me. ​Seriously, freaking dreamy. rlytearpls.png

 

He be poppin' mah non-existent ovaries.

 

 

I have never been this invested in a show. I just want all of them to have happy endings. warstarplz.png

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Rin brings out the inner needy me. ​Seriously, freaking dreamy. rlytearpls.png

 

He be poppin' mah non-existent ovaries.

 

 

I have never been this invested in a show. I just want all of them to have happy endings. warstarplz.png

 

Agree with everything you said. Lol you do you....

 

I have never fell so hard for the second lead before. Now we have like less than 24 hours before the new episode. So excited ahmagahplz.png

 

I can see an open ending where San leaves but I'll flip tables if that happens lol

 

I'd burn my TV. Pls don't let this one happen. I don't want to feel like I wasted my time watching it.

 

Btw, off topic but anyone else experiencing hard time with this site recently? It became too slow and I always get the error page. unsure.png

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Ive read this in TKIL thread in Soompi. and honestly I enjoyed lurking there. The insights of people there are really amazing. 

Under the spoiler is one of the users POV. 

 

FOR WONSAN SHIPPERS ONLY. ahmagahplz.png

Rinsan shippers you have been warned.

 

 

Post by PACKMULE3. This user just translate into words everything that is on my mind. rlytearpls.png and i quote.

"1. On flaws

Last week, I mentioned one obvious flaw of Rin that many shippers tend to downplay. For a supposedly loyal and upright character, Rin lies so easily to his friend Won. While I can understand an adolescent Rin being rattled by his older brother’s false equivalency (i.e., being a bystander to a massacre is as heinous as plotting the massacre and hiring the assassins), I expect more discernment from an adult Rin. If I were San, that kind of family secret, plus the fact that he kept it hidden from me, would indelibly alter how I felt for him and color how I viewed him. It could even be a dealbreaker, depending on the duration of his cover-up. The longer he withheld the truth from me, the more I would doubt his honesty and sincerity.

But I don’t know if the scriptwriter’s being deliberately obtuse or she simply doesn’t care about the irony of Rim (Rim!! who deceived and continues to deceive his friend) advising San to tell Won the truth so he could be armed with all the information he needed to make the right choice.  In this week’s Episode 9, there were so many missed opportunities for him to own up to the truth. Let me enumerate a couple: 

One, after Won confronted his mother about Dan's inclusion on the tribute list. I thought the scriptwriter was being satirical when the Queen ordered Rin to reiterate what she had told Won as her son would only believe the words coming out of his friend’s mouth. Rin didn’t have to tell Won straight away about the switch, but afterwards, he should have explained. It was a good thing that Won kept on digging for facts and found out about the Rin/Dan trade-off. 

Two, after Rin learned that Won went to their house to ask for Dan's hand in marriage. Rin should have insisted that there was no need for Won to marry his sister. Remember, by the time Won visited the Wang household, he already knew that Dan was off the tribute list and that Rin volunteered to become the substitute. Won offered to marry Dan because he felt guilty for messing up their plan to save Dan with Jeon's wedding. But that guilt was groundless, and there was no obligation for Won to fulfill. The fault actually lay with Rin's precipitous intervention. As I said before, he messed up royally when he LIED to Won and withheld information from him because he wanted to prevent San's marriage to his brother.  

Three, after their sparring. Instead of running off to get the medicine, he could have waited until San left and told Won the truth. To be honest, I disliked his comment that he had to go find medicine for Won because he would be in big trouble should Won sport a bruise due to him. To me, it sounded self-pitying, and passive-aggressive.  Lol. San was fussing all over Won’s split lip. But he too got was hit “well†-- by Won’s admission -- yet he received none of the attention from San. 

More importantly, after the King accused Won of attempting to kill him with his arrow in Episode 10. Rin should have spoken up FOR HIS FRIEND by disclosing his brother’s and SongIn’s plot. Even if he didn’t want to implicate his brother, he could link the Snakeman to SongIn. He witnessed the attack, and he was later approached and informed by SongIn of the conspiracy to replace CP. Had he revealed the conspiracy, he would have absolved Won from wrongdoing. But Rin remained silent. 

For me, apart from his dishonesty, another problem with Rin is that he retreated whenever he was beleaguered. Contrary to popular paeans to his loyalty and valor, when push came to shove, Rin fled. Lol. I had to laugh when the bodyguard JangEui asked Rin when they were surrounded, “Do we fight to win this or to escape?†and Rin answered, “To escape.†Sure, I know it's a rhetorical question. But to me, the scriptwriter was being superfluous. Of course, Rin’s answer was to flee. He had been running away quite a lot in these past episodes. 

For instance, when they were young, and overheard the plot to ambush the Minister's caravan, he wanted to leave the problem to the authorities to sort it out. On the rooftops with San, whenever the conversation became serious, he flew across the tiles. With the problem of the San’s wedding, he left the scene and went missing-in-action for six days.  When his sister was placed on the tribute list, he negotiated to leave the country in her place without telling Won -- to another disastrous consequence. In regard to his love for San, he also wanted to flee. “As I thought, His Highness does not have any idea. I wish to leave, not because of him. I wish to leave because of me.†He did the same thing with his sister, Dan. One minute, they were having a heart-to-heart conversation, then the next minute, he apologized and vanished without an explanation or a goodbye. 

That’s why I said Rin was pretty good at running away. Given the choice of fight-or-flight to a perceived threat or harm, his instinctive response was flight. 

And now, Won asked him to be a flagpole? Pfffttt. I feel like reaching into the laptop and cuff Won upside the back of his head for his naivety. I want to warn him, “Your so-called friend is not to be trusted. It’s not that Rin is a bad man per se, but he isn't steadfast as you believe he is. You don’t know when he’s lying to you or when he’s going to leave and disappear on you -- out of noble idiocy.†default_smile.png.1a17920c0f0ac6da5e6bf8

Mark my words, bebe1989. Between the two of them, Won is the one who sticks and stands by his friends regardless of circumstances. He’s reliable to come through for a friend. And I think some of the knetizens are aware of this. One of the top comments (on Naver? Nate? I don’t know your source, bebe1989) was “San ah, it is not Rin that will come no matter when. It is Won who sent him over….â€

2. On friendship

Like @julie721, I think San slowly but steadily recognizes what Won is capable of doing for his friend Rin. For example, the day when she met Rin outside the Geumgajeong after the canceled wedding, she observed that “It seems like he (Won) does not know who I am yet. He did not know who I was. And yet he came. You must have asked him to do it.†She discovered that Rin had only to ask and Won would do it for him. Then, later on, she saw Won endure the king’s insulting command to pour tea for Jeon and the Minister, and pretend that his drunkenness prompted him to break up her engagement, rather than drag Rin’s name into the fray.  Thus, San explicitly began to trust Won when he told her not to worry about Rin’s departure to Yuan. She replied, “If you will not let him go, I am no longer worried.†She was beginning to grasp Won’s temperament, and like what she told Rin at the maypole dance, Won wasn’t the type to hold back when helping out a friend. That was why she had kept him in the dark about her looming marriage to Jeon. 

By Episode 9, it’s been well-established how dependent Won was on Rin to act on his behalf.  He had utmost confidence that Rin would do things for him that he was otherwise unable to do on his own due to his royal status. Like saving her on rooftops. She discovered that Rin was the one who helped her out that night and grabbed her by the waist and shoulder. She pondered, “Now, I know whose hands held me safe that night. If I ask why, he will say his friend sent him to watch me.†Also, despite being sometimes misguided (i.e., his lies and cover-ups), Rin could be expected to act in Won’s interest. That was why Won tasked him to bring San to the maypole dance. He was asking as a man to another man to bring San to him. Won had complete trust that Rin had his welfare in mind, that Rin had his back. In Rin’s list of priorities, Won might come a close second to his family’s top spot, but at least Won was still uppermost. 

To me, then, this whole friendship thing that San desired from Won must be revisited because I don’t think she meant it the way most viewers – and the Queen – understood it.  The Queen had asked her how she felt about Won in her heart and she responded, “I would like him to be my friend forever. I envied him and his friendship with Master Rin. I wished to be part of that.†The general view is that she had “friend-zoned†Won. 

In my opinion, she’s projecting her own ideas of friendship onto the Won/Rin relationship. She didn’t mean “just†friends, in a platonic sense. Remember in the first episode when the three of them spent the night at the cave, she was also confused about their closeness, and thought their relationship to be gay love. She imagined that they were lovers because their friendship looked deeper than ordinary. Lol. She thought they were strange. Then, when she was spying at Wang’s house and met the two of them, she again commented about their extraordinary relationship because they seemed to come as a pair.  

I think she meant a friendship that’s almost akin to love in its trust and inter-dependence, and protection. It’s a friendship that cannot exist without the other person, and will do anything for that person, including laying down one’s life. It’s a friendship that forsake all others. That was the kind of friendship she envied. She saw the close bonds of the two, and she wanted the same for herself.  And remember what I wrote here before about the kind of marriage that Won needed?  Since he grew up in a hostile environment, with his parents trading barbs at every occasion possible, he needed to learn a love that is rooted in friendship and mutual respect. 

That’s why the ring necklace was an important gift. In my opinion, she gave it to Won NOT because she was feeling gratitude, sorrow or pity for him, for suffering  humiliation for Rin’s sake, for her broken engagement, and for the grubby bracelet she had given him. To me, she’d intentionally given him the dingy bracelet to rile him, just like she wiped her snotty nose on his sleeves.  But she gave the necklace to him as a pledge that she would be there for him in the future. No matter what he would asked of her in the future, she was confident that she’d be able to grant him that favor. 

A girl like San wasn’t the type to give such a gift casually or haphazardly.  Both the bracelet and the ring necklace were significant because they were handmade and personal. She made them as a set, and she gave them to him one by one. More importantly, she had WORN them; they were against her skin or clothing before she had given them to him. They weren’t new pieces ordered from the merchants. The ring necklace, especially, was a memento of her deceased mom, so it was tenfold more meaningful. Lastly, a gift of a bracelet, ring or necklace sends a subtle and subconscious message of being bound or connected together.  

Not only that. She backed up her necklace gift with action. She CHOSE to stay by his side and work at the Geumgajeong where he would be. Now that her secret identity as a servant was blown, she could have stayed in her father’s house or return to the safety of the mountains. But she didn’t leave town; she hung around where he was. Although she admitted after her broken engagement to feeling confused as to which one of the men made her heart ache more, she opted to discombobulate herself a little bit more and stayed by his side in case he needed her. (hahaha. She’s a masochist after all.) That day on the bridge, she asked him if she could stay by his side. Until he could finally reveal his dark secret to her, she asked to stay close to him. 

Won: You? Close to me?
San: If you need help, someone to lean on, or someone to vent at. Just tell me and I will (be there)… 

3. On the days leading up to the tea party

It’s most unfortunate then that this “secret†that Won had to keep from her was not one of his doing, but Rin’s. The secret which held him back from San was his marriage offer to Rin’s sister. In my opinion, Rin should have come clean and told his friend Won unequivocally that he was NOT to blame for the tribute fiasco, and that he should NOT feel obligated to clear up the mess by marrying Dan. I don’t understand why Rin comforted Dan that she was no longer on the tribute list so marriage to Won wasn’t necessary, BUT he neglected to tell Won that HE too was off the hook. 

That night, all three of them, Rin, Won, and San, were outside thinking of the upcoming tea party and the difficult choices they must make. For Won and San, their musings paralleled each other. Won was waiting outside in the cold for Dan. He said, "The winter is extra-long. And the wind is still cold. I have little power and many people to tiptoe around. This is the best I could do. My methods are pitiful, but I hope you understand."  He was actually addressing Jin Gwan, his bodyguard with a crush on Dan. As usual, Jin Gwan heard Won’s address to him, and he bowed in gratitude and indebtedness to the favor granted by Won to him by saving Dan from being sent to Yuan.

Meanwhile, San and her maid are talking out in the cold. Her maid scolded her, “The wind is still cold. What are you doing outside?†and she replied, “To see if spring is coming.†The maid told her that she must make the CP like her to save her life. But San wondered out aloud if she should risk her life instead. Both Won and San realized how puny their attempts were at organizing their lives. 

The maid asked San if the man would be upset if the CP liked her. San replied cryptically, "One man will be pleased, he will clap and he will even commend me. But the other man will be very sad. Not because of me, but because of the other man. He has to go very far away….Because of me, both are about to become very unhappy.  Then they will both hate me." 

At first glance, it seemed like she was referring to Won as the man who’d applaud for her, and then to Rin who’d be sad. But in my opinion, the first man she was talking about was Rin. He would be pleased and commend her for marrying the CP.  He practically said as much when they met in the morning on the rooftop and he urged her to tell Won the truth about her identity. Rin wanted her to marry Won so she’d be saved from the tribute. (BTW, the night before, he abruptly apologized to his sister and left. The reason he apologized was he was thwarting his sister’s dream of marrying Won by telling San to win Won.)  

The second man she spoke of was Won. Won would become sad, not because of her, but because Rin would have to be dispatched as a non-service hostage to Yuan if Won chose San as his bride. She knew that they had fought because Won was enraged that Rin volunteered himself without telling him. Won would do anything to keep Rin by his side. 

Also by this time, San already guessed what Won meant during their conversation on the bridge. Won had told her at the bridge, “You are my first….Once you find out my secret, and see what I did, and will do, you will probably end up disliking me. You will never understand. You are my first. Never forget that.†The day after the bridge confession, at the Geumgajeong, he again reminded her that she was his first while holding on to her hand. To me, she pulled her hand away from his clasp, and stood up to stand by the window, because she was finally figuring out Won’s true intentions.  You see, the previous night she had been apprised by SongIn of Dan being sent to Yuan as a tribute. And now, she discovered that Rin volunteered to be an indentured servant to Yuan.  In my opinion, San was beginning to realize the implication of Won’s words at the bridge. Yes, she was the first. And yes, she was feeling uncomfortable with Won’s secret plan of action. That's why she pulled away.

For me, bebe1989, the other interesting thing here is that -- from Won’s perspective -- this was the moment he began to be jealous of the two.  

That’s why on that cold evening when the three friends were each contemplating their action at the tea party, San was sitting outside undecided about her course of action. She knew she could win the Crown Prince’s heart if she wanted to -- because Won already said that she was first. But if she did insist on being the bride, then Won would be deprived of his best friend Rin. And she had already been warned by Won at the bridge that he was planning on a course of action that would displease and disgust her (that is, marrying somebody else). 

That is the reason why I doubt that San was actually in love with Rin at this point in time. Her main consideration at this moment wasn’t Rin’s welfare or his removal to Yuan, butWon’s feelings. She was contemplating risking her life, and sacrificing everything including her father and their family wealth just so Won wouldn’t be deprived of his best friend Rin. She knew that Won relied totally on Rin. And although Rin himself was prepared to leave Won (well, he WANTED to leave Won, for his own sake), Won wasn’t ready to give up Rin.

Furthermore, the following morning, when they were at the rooftop, she was again thinking of Won’s wellbeing. To me, when she mentioned out-of-the-blue that Dan loved the Crown Prince, she was comforting herself that even if she wasn’t chosen as the bride, her substitute or her replacement Dan was in love with Won anyway. Remember? She took a note of this, too, in Episode 4 when she observed Dan bringing medicine that she had prepared for the Crown Prince after his fall from the horse at the hunting incident. Also, she refused Rin’s offer of a hand. She almost tripped because she didn’t take Rin’s hand, and Rin ended up grabbing her again. And that’s when she realized that Rin was the man on the roof, and that Won had sent him to look after her. 

4. On San’s lie 

In my opinion, San was lying when she requested the Crown Prince to ignore “her mistress†at the tea party because she loved “another man.†You see, if she had been speaking the truth, then sooner or later, Won would suspect Rin – because Rin was the only one aside from him who was in contact with San. And that's the LAST THING she wanted to do: cause an estrangement between him and Rin and more pain for all of them.    

Do you see it, bebe1989?

On her way to the Geumgajeong, San was having an inner monologue which explained her decision-making process.  Per dramabeans: “I have only one thing to do. I must do all I can to ensure that they can stay close to each other as they always did. It would make me feel lonely, but that is my friendship.† I like that she was even dressed in black as if she was in mourning, because what she was about to do probably felt like death to her. Once she was inside the Geumgajeong speaking to Won -- and pretending that she didn’t know him to be the Crown Prince – she told Won that her mistress was in love with ANOTHER MAN. 

The motive for her confession was to keep the bonds between the two men intact, NOT to make one man jealous of the other. She even sacrificed her Dad, and their family fortune, to protect this male bonding. Remember? In Episode 10, we saw her in discussion with her dad and the butler before the tea party. She wasn't going to seek the CP's marriage proposal so she prepared her father for the eventual fall-out. They arranged to divest him of all his properties and to hide the family wealth. 

San’s excuse that her mistress was in love with another man was meant to deceive Won so he wouldn’t choose her, and, in the process, lose Rin in the Rin/Dan tribute exchange. She was only thinking of Won, and the effect of losing Rin would have on Won. As far as she knew, Rin wasn’t opposed to going to Yuan, and even considered it as a good opportunity. He had said, “I can learn more and make personal connections in a great country.†Meanwhile, Won admitted to her that it was going to be difficult to release Rin from the non-service hostage list but that he would have to “overwork†himself to keep Rin with him. 

Her confession was a lie which would allow Won to choose Dan as his bride, and keep Rin by his side as they had always been together. Her lie was her sacrifice. 

If San had been telling him the truth – that is, she was in fact in love with another man – then, it would eventually dawn on Won that the other man would have to be Rin because of their proximity. Lol. Instead of preserving the peace then, she would have caused both men unhappiness, which she was trying to avoid in the first place. In NO WAY did she intend her confession to sow distrust and jealousy between the two men.  

However, I think Rin assumed that San was speaking of him. He alone understood (or misunderstood) the significance of her words. In my opinion, he thought that San was truly confessing her love with another man, specifically him. To his great credit, however, he didn’t act upon it. 

Rin: I told her to tell you everything. I told her to tell you the truth (hahaha. The irony!) and become the crown princess.
Won: Did you tell her to do that?
Rin: What on earth did you two talk about yesterday morning?
Won: She asked me for a favor. She asked me not to choose her lady as the crown princess.
Rin: Why not?
Won: Because in her lady’s heart…in her heart is someone else.
Rin: (dumbfounded)
Won: I should look for SoHwa. I mean San. (still oblivious as to who the other man was.)

On a sidenote: I thought it was interesting that Rin got angry at Won for failing to understand San’s predicament. “If you’re so smart, how can you not get the situation?†(Correct answer: Because you, my good sir, withheld the truth. default_smile.png.1a17920c0f0ac6da5e6bf8)

Now, bebe1989 you understand better why she cried when Won chose Dan at the tea party. It was a whole gamut of emotions, repressed and bottled up, that led to her tears. She knew she was hurting Won deeply with her lie, but she was also sacrificing so much in silence for Won. I know that the original love triangle was two men fighting over San’s love. But in my view, the other untold and often unseen love triangle here was San and Rin competing for Won’s affections. 

 

***********************************

That’s it for me now. Will edit later. Going back to bed again. "

 

 

 

I CANT WAIT FOR TODAY'S EPISODE!!! ahmagahplz.png ahmagahplz.png ahmagahplz.png

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Ive read this in TKIL thread in Soompi. and honestly I enjoyed lurking there. The insights of people there are really amazing.

Under the spoiler is one of the users POV.

 

FOR WONSAN SHIPPERS ONLY. ahmagahplz.png

Rinsan shippers you have been warned.

 

 

Post by PACKMULE3. This user just translate into words everything that is on my mind. rlytearpls.png and i quote.

"1. On flaws

Last week, I mentioned one obvious flaw of Rin that many shippers tend to downplay. For a supposedly loyal and upright character, Rin lies so easily to his friend Won. While I can understand an adolescent Rin being rattled by his older brother’s false equivalency (i.e., being a bystander to a massacre is as heinous as plotting the massacre and hiring the assassins), I expect more discernment from an adult Rin. If I were San, that kind of family secret, plus the fact that he kept it hidden from me, would indelibly alter how I felt for him and color how I viewed him. It could even be a dealbreaker, depending on the duration of his cover-up. The longer he withheld the truth from me, the more I would doubt his honesty and sincerity.

But I don’t know if the scriptwriter’s being deliberately obtuse or she simply doesn’t care about the irony of Rim (Rim!! who deceived and continues to deceive his friend) advising San to tell Won the truth so he could be armed with all the information he needed to make the right choice. In this week’s Episode 9, there were so many missed opportunities for him to own up to the truth. Let me enumerate a couple:

One, after Won confronted his mother about Dan's inclusion on the tribute list. I thought the scriptwriter was being satirical when the Queen ordered Rin to reiterate what she had told Won as her son would only believe the words coming out of his friend’s mouth. Rin didn’t have to tell Won straight away about the switch, but afterwards, he should have explained. It was a good thing that Won kept on digging for facts and found out about the Rin/Dan trade-off.

Two, after Rin learned that Won went to their house to ask for Dan's hand in marriage. Rin should have insisted that there was no need for Won to marry his sister. Remember, by the time Won visited the Wang household, he already knew that Dan was off the tribute list and that Rin volunteered to become the substitute. Won offered to marry Dan because he felt guilty for messing up their plan to save Dan with Jeon's wedding. But that guilt was groundless, and there was no obligation for Won to fulfill. The fault actually lay with Rin's precipitous intervention. As I said before, he messed up royally when he LIED to Won and withheld information from him because he wanted to prevent San's marriage to his brother.

Three, after their sparring. Instead of running off to get the medicine, he could have waited until San left and told Won the truth. To be honest, I disliked his comment that he had to go find medicine for Won because he would be in big trouble should Won sport a bruise due to him. To me, it sounded self-pitying, and passive-aggressive. Lol. San was fussing all over Won’s split lip. But he too got was hit “well†-- by Won’s admission -- yet he received none of the attention from San.

More importantly, after the King accused Won of attempting to kill him with his arrow in Episode 10. Rin should have spoken up FOR HIS FRIEND by disclosing his brother’s and SongIn’s plot. Even if he didn’t want to implicate his brother, he could link the Snakeman to SongIn. He witnessed the attack, and he was later approached and informed by SongIn of the conspiracy to replace CP. Had he revealed the conspiracy, he would have absolved Won from wrongdoing. But Rin remained silent.

For me, apart from his dishonesty, another problem with Rin is that he retreated whenever he was beleaguered. Contrary to popular paeans to his loyalty and valor, when push came to shove, Rin fled. Lol. I had to laugh when the bodyguard JangEui asked Rin when they were surrounded, “Do we fight to win this or to escape?†and Rin answered, “To escape.†Sure, I know it's a rhetorical question. But to me, the scriptwriter was being superfluous. Of course, Rin’s answer was to flee. He had been running away quite a lot in these past episodes.

For instance, when they were young, and overheard the plot to ambush the Minister's caravan, he wanted to leave the problem to the authorities to sort it out. On the rooftops with San, whenever the conversation became serious, he flew across the tiles. With the problem of the San’s wedding, he left the scene and went missing-in-action for six days. When his sister was placed on the tribute list, he negotiated to leave the country in her place without telling Won -- to another disastrous consequence. In regard to his love for San, he also wanted to flee. “As I thought, His Highness does not have any idea. I wish to leave, not because of him. I wish to leave because of me.†He did the same thing with his sister, Dan. One minute, they were having a heart-to-heart conversation, then the next minute, he apologized and vanished without an explanation or a goodbye.

That’s why I said Rin was pretty good at running away. Given the choice of fight-or-flight to a perceived threat or harm, his instinctive response was flight.

And now, Won asked him to be a flagpole? Pfffttt. I feel like reaching into the laptop and cuff Won upside the back of his head for his naivety. I want to warn him, “Your so-called friend is not to be trusted. It’s not that Rin is a bad man per se, but he isn't steadfast as you believe he is. You don’t know when he’s lying to you or when he’s going to leave and disappear on you -- out of noble idiocy.†default_smile.png.1a17920c0f0ac6da5e6bf8

Mark my words, bebe1989. Between the two of them, Won is the one who sticks and stands by his friends regardless of circumstances. He’s reliable to come through for a friend. And I think some of the knetizens are aware of this. One of the top comments (on Naver? Nate? I don’t know your source, bebe1989) was “San ah, it is not Rin that will come no matter when. It is Won who sent him over….â€

2. On friendship

Like @julie721, I think San slowly but steadily recognizes what Won is capable of doing for his friend Rin. For example, the day when she met Rin outside the Geumgajeong after the canceled wedding, she observed that “It seems like he (Won) does not know who I am yet. He did not know who I was. And yet he came. You must have asked him to do it.†She discovered that Rin had only to ask and Won would do it for him. Then, later on, she saw Won endure the king’s insulting command to pour tea for Jeon and the Minister, and pretend that his drunkenness prompted him to break up her engagement, rather than drag Rin’s name into the fray. Thus, San explicitly began to trust Won when he told her not to worry about Rin’s departure to Yuan. She replied, “If you will not let him go, I am no longer worried.†She was beginning to grasp Won’s temperament, and like what she told Rin at the maypole dance, Won wasn’t the type to hold back when helping out a friend. That was why she had kept him in the dark about her looming marriage to Jeon.

By Episode 9, it’s been well-established how dependent Won was on Rin to act on his behalf. He had utmost confidence that Rin would do things for him that he was otherwise unable to do on his own due to his royal status. Like saving her on rooftops. She discovered that Rin was the one who helped her out that night and grabbed her by the waist and shoulder. She pondered, “Now, I know whose hands held me safe that night. If I ask why, he will say his friend sent him to watch me.†Also, despite being sometimes misguided (i.e., his lies and cover-ups), Rin could be expected to act in Won’s interest. That was why Won tasked him to bring San to the maypole dance. He was asking as a man to another man to bring San to him. Won had complete trust that Rin had his welfare in mind, that Rin had his back. In Rin’s list of priorities, Won might come a close second to his family’s top spot, but at least Won was still uppermost.

To me, then, this whole friendship thing that San desired from Won must be revisited because I don’t think she meant it the way most viewers – and the Queen – understood it. The Queen had asked her how she felt about Won in her heart and she responded, “I would like him to be my friend forever. I envied him and his friendship with Master Rin. I wished to be part of that.†The general view is that she had “friend-zoned†Won.

In my opinion, she’s projecting her own ideas of friendship onto the Won/Rin relationship. She didn’t mean “just†friends, in a platonic sense. Remember in the first episode when the three of them spent the night at the cave, she was also confused about their closeness, and thought their relationship to be gay love. She imagined that they were lovers because their friendship looked deeper than ordinary. Lol. She thought they were strange. Then, when she was spying at Wang’s house and met the two of them, she again commented about their extraordinary relationship because they seemed to come as a pair.

I think she meant a friendship that’s almost akin to love in its trust and inter-dependence, and protection. It’s a friendship that cannot exist without the other person, and will do anything for that person, including laying down one’s life. It’s a friendship that forsake all others. That was the kind of friendship she envied. She saw the close bonds of the two, and she wanted the same for herself. And remember what I wrote here before about the kind of marriage that Won needed? Since he grew up in a hostile environment, with his parents trading barbs at every occasion possible, he needed to learn a love that is rooted in friendship and mutual respect.

That’s why the ring necklace was an important gift. In my opinion, she gave it to Won NOT because she was feeling gratitude, sorrow or pity for him, for suffering humiliation for Rin’s sake, for her broken engagement, and for the grubby bracelet she had given him. To me, she’d intentionally given him the dingy bracelet to rile him, just like she wiped her snotty nose on his sleeves. But she gave the necklace to him as a pledge that she would be there for him in the future. No matter what he would asked of her in the future, she was confident that she’d be able to grant him that favor.

A girl like San wasn’t the type to give such a gift casually or haphazardly. Both the bracelet and the ring necklace were significant because they were handmade and personal. She made them as a set, and she gave them to him one by one. More importantly, she had WORN them; they were against her skin or clothing before she had given them to him. They weren’t new pieces ordered from the merchants. The ring necklace, especially, was a memento of her deceased mom, so it was tenfold more meaningful. Lastly, a gift of a bracelet, ring or necklace sends a subtle and subconscious message of being bound or connected together.

Not only that. She backed up her necklace gift with action. She CHOSE to stay by his side and work at the Geumgajeong where he would be. Now that her secret identity as a servant was blown, she could have stayed in her father’s house or return to the safety of the mountains. But she didn’t leave town; she hung around where he was. Although she admitted after her broken engagement to feeling confused as to which one of the men made her heart ache more, she opted to discombobulate herself a little bit more and stayed by his side in case he needed her. (hahaha. She’s a masochist after all.) That day on the bridge, she asked him if she could stay by his side. Until he could finally reveal his dark secret to her, she asked to stay close to him.

Won: You? Close to me?

San: If you need help, someone to lean on, or someone to vent at. Just tell me and I will (be there)…

3. On the days leading up to the tea party

It’s most unfortunate then that this “secret†that Won had to keep from her was not one of his doing, but Rin’s. The secret which held him back from San was his marriage offer to Rin’s sister. In my opinion, Rin should have come clean and told his friend Won unequivocally that he was NOT to blame for the tribute fiasco, and that he should NOT feel obligated to clear up the mess by marrying Dan. I don’t understand why Rin comforted Dan that she was no longer on the tribute list so marriage to Won wasn’t necessary, BUT he neglected to tell Won that HE too was off the hook.

That night, all three of them, Rin, Won, and San, were outside thinking of the upcoming tea party and the difficult choices they must make. For Won and San, their musings paralleled each other. Won was waiting outside in the cold for Dan. He said, "The winter is extra-long. And the wind is still cold. I have little power and many people to tiptoe around. This is the best I could do. My methods are pitiful, but I hope you understand." He was actually addressing Jin Gwan, his bodyguard with a crush on Dan. As usual, Jin Gwan heard Won’s address to him, and he bowed in gratitude and indebtedness to the favor granted by Won to him by saving Dan from being sent to Yuan.

Meanwhile, San and her maid are talking out in the cold. Her maid scolded her, “The wind is still cold. What are you doing outside?†and she replied, “To see if spring is coming.†The maid told her that she must make the CP like her to save her life. But San wondered out aloud if she should risk her life instead. Both Won and San realized how puny their attempts were at organizing their lives.

The maid asked San if the man would be upset if the CP liked her. San replied cryptically, "One man will be pleased, he will clap and he will even commend me. But the other man will be very sad. Not because of me, but because of the other man. He has to go very far away….Because of me, both are about to become very unhappy. Then they will both hate me."

At first glance, it seemed like she was referring to Won as the man who’d applaud for her, and then to Rin who’d be sad. But in my opinion, the first man she was talking about was Rin. He would be pleased and commend her for marrying the CP. He practically said as much when they met in the morning on the rooftop and he urged her to tell Won the truth about her identity. Rin wanted her to marry Won so she’d be saved from the tribute. (BTW, the night before, he abruptly apologized to his sister and left. The reason he apologized was he was thwarting his sister’s dream of marrying Won by telling San to win Won.)

The second man she spoke of was Won. Won would become sad, not because of her, but because Rin would have to be dispatched as a non-service hostage to Yuan if Won chose San as his bride. She knew that they had fought because Won was enraged that Rin volunteered himself without telling him. Won would do anything to keep Rin by his side.

Also by this time, San already guessed what Won meant during their conversation on the bridge. Won had told her at the bridge, “You are my first….Once you find out my secret, and see what I did, and will do, you will probably end up disliking me. You will never understand. You are my first. Never forget that.†The day after the bridge confession, at the Geumgajeong, he again reminded her that she was his first while holding on to her hand. To me, she pulled her hand away from his clasp, and stood up to stand by the window, because she was finally figuring out Won’s true intentions. You see, the previous night she had been apprised by SongIn of Dan being sent to Yuan as a tribute. And now, she discovered that Rin volunteered to be an indentured servant to Yuan. In my opinion, San was beginning to realize the implication of Won’s words at the bridge. Yes, she was the first. And yes, she was feeling uncomfortable with Won’s secret plan of action. That's why she pulled away.

For me, bebe1989, the other interesting thing here is that -- from Won’s perspective -- this was the moment he began to be jealous of the two.

That’s why on that cold evening when the three friends were each contemplating their action at the tea party, San was sitting outside undecided about her course of action. She knew she could win the Crown Prince’s heart if she wanted to -- because Won already said that she was first. But if she did insist on being the bride, then Won would be deprived of his best friend Rin. And she had already been warned by Won at the bridge that he was planning on a course of action that would displease and disgust her (that is, marrying somebody else).

That is the reason why I doubt that San was actually in love with Rin at this point in time. Her main consideration at this moment wasn’t Rin’s welfare or his removal to Yuan, butWon’s feelings. She was contemplating risking her life, and sacrificing everything including her father and their family wealth just so Won wouldn’t be deprived of his best friend Rin. She knew that Won relied totally on Rin. And although Rin himself was prepared to leave Won (well, he WANTED to leave Won, for his own sake), Won wasn’t ready to give up Rin.

Furthermore, the following morning, when they were at the rooftop, she was again thinking of Won’s wellbeing. To me, when she mentioned out-of-the-blue that Dan loved the Crown Prince, she was comforting herself that even if she wasn’t chosen as the bride, her substitute or her replacement Dan was in love with Won anyway. Remember? She took a note of this, too, in Episode 4 when she observed Dan bringing medicine that she had prepared for the Crown Prince after his fall from the horse at the hunting incident. Also, she refused Rin’s offer of a hand. She almost tripped because she didn’t take Rin’s hand, and Rin ended up grabbing her again. And that’s when she realized that Rin was the man on the roof, and that Won had sent him to look after her.

4. On San’s lie

In my opinion, San was lying when she requested the Crown Prince to ignore “her mistress†at the tea party because she loved “another man.†You see, if she had been speaking the truth, then sooner or later, Won would suspect Rin – because Rin was the only one aside from him who was in contact with San. And that's the LAST THING she wanted to do: cause an estrangement between him and Rin and more pain for all of them.

Do you see it, bebe1989?

On her way to the Geumgajeong, San was having an inner monologue which explained her decision-making process. Per dramabeans: “I have only one thing to do. I must do all I can to ensure that they can stay close to each other as they always did. It would make me feel lonely, but that is my friendship.†I like that she was even dressed in black as if she was in mourning, because what she was about to do probably felt like death to her. Once she was inside the Geumgajeong speaking to Won -- and pretending that she didn’t know him to be the Crown Prince – she told Won that her mistress was in love with ANOTHER MAN.

The motive for her confession was to keep the bonds between the two men intact, NOT to make one man jealous of the other. She even sacrificed her Dad, and their family fortune, to protect this male bonding. Remember? In Episode 10, we saw her in discussion with her dad and the butler before the tea party. She wasn't going to seek the CP's marriage proposal so she prepared her father for the eventual fall-out. They arranged to divest him of all his properties and to hide the family wealth.

San’s excuse that her mistress was in love with another man was meant to deceive Won so he wouldn’t choose her, and, in the process, lose Rin in the Rin/Dan tribute exchange. She was only thinking of Won, and the effect of losing Rin would have on Won. As far as she knew, Rin wasn’t opposed to going to Yuan, and even considered it as a good opportunity. He had said, “I can learn more and make personal connections in a great country.†Meanwhile, Won admitted to her that it was going to be difficult to release Rin from the non-service hostage list but that he would have to “overwork†himself to keep Rin with him.

Her confession was a lie which would allow Won to choose Dan as his bride, and keep Rin by his side as they had always been together. Her lie was her sacrifice.

If San had been telling him the truth – that is, she was in fact in love with another man – then, it would eventually dawn on Won that the other man would have to be Rin because of their proximity. Lol. Instead of preserving the peace then, she would have caused both men unhappiness, which she was trying to avoid in the first place. In NO WAY did she intend her confession to sow distrust and jealousy between the two men.

However, I think Rin assumed that San was speaking of him. He alone understood (or misunderstood) the significance of her words. In my opinion, he thought that San was truly confessing her love with another man, specifically him. To his great credit, however, he didn’t act upon it.

Rin: I told her to tell you everything. I told her to tell you the truth (hahaha. The irony!) and become the crown princess.

Won: Did you tell her to do that?

Rin: What on earth did you two talk about yesterday morning?

Won: She asked me for a favor. She asked me not to choose her lady as the crown princess.

Rin: Why not?

Won: Because in her lady’s heart…in her heart is someone else.

Rin: (dumbfounded)

Won: I should look for SoHwa. I mean San. (still oblivious as to who the other man was.)

On a sidenote: I thought it was interesting that Rin got angry at Won for failing to understand San’s predicament. “If you’re so smart, how can you not get the situation?†(Correct answer: Because you, my good sir, withheld the truth. default_smile.png.1a17920c0f0ac6da5e6bf8)

Now, bebe1989 you understand better why she cried when Won chose Dan at the tea party. It was a whole gamut of emotions, repressed and bottled up, that led to her tears. She knew she was hurting Won deeply with her lie, but she was also sacrificing so much in silence for Won. I know that the original love triangle was two men fighting over San’s love. But in my view, the other untold and often unseen love triangle here was San and Rin competing for Won’s affections.

***********************************

That’s it for me now. Will edit later. Going back to bed again. "

 

 

 

I CANT WAIT FOR TODAY'S EPISODE!!! ahmagahplz.pngahmagahplz.pngahmagahplz.png

Wow that was a really good way of putting it. I never even thought the story could have been that deep.

 

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Has anyone watched the new episodes today? What do you guys think so far of it?

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I havent! Ill watch tomoro once the subs are out. But ive read a lot of tweets earlier and there are lots of wonsan shippers who are mourning. So i guess a lot of rinsan scenes for the current episode.

 

Are you RS or WS? Or undecided?

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I havent! Ill watch tomoro once the subs are out. But ive read a lot of tweets earlier and there are lots of wonsan shippers who are mourning. So i guess a lot of rinsan scenes for the current episode.

 

Are you RS or WS? Or undecided?

I'm for team RinSan however I think both pairs are cute. I don't think WonSan shippers should mourn yet I think there is still hope for either ship although in the drama it may seem they are leaning towards RinSan. They after all could be teasing us.

 

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Ive read this in TKIL thread in Soompi. and honestly I enjoyed lurking there. The insights of people there are really amazing. 

Under the spoiler is one of the users POV. 

 

FOR WONSAN SHIPPERS ONLY. ahmagahplz.png

Rinsan shippers you have been warned.

 

 

Post by PACKMULE3. This user just translate into words everything that is on my mind. rlytearpls.png and i quote.

"1. On flaws

Last week, I mentioned one obvious flaw of Rin that many shippers tend to downplay. For a supposedly loyal and upright character, Rin lies so easily to his friend Won. While I can understand an adolescent Rin being rattled by his older brother’s false equivalency (i.e., being a bystander to a massacre is as heinous as plotting the massacre and hiring the assassins), I expect more discernment from an adult Rin. If I were San, that kind of family secret, plus the fact that he kept it hidden from me, would indelibly alter how I felt for him and color how I viewed him. It could even be a dealbreaker, depending on the duration of his cover-up. The longer he withheld the truth from me, the more I would doubt his honesty and sincerity.

But I don’t know if the scriptwriter’s being deliberately obtuse or she simply doesn’t care about the irony of Rim (Rim!! who deceived and continues to deceive his friend) advising San to tell Won the truth so he could be armed with all the information he needed to make the right choice.  In this week’s Episode 9, there were so many missed opportunities for him to own up to the truth. Let me enumerate a couple: 

One, after Won confronted his mother about Dan's inclusion on the tribute list. I thought the scriptwriter was being satirical when the Queen ordered Rin to reiterate what she had told Won as her son would only believe the words coming out of his friend’s mouth. Rin didn’t have to tell Won straight away about the switch, but afterwards, he should have explained. It was a good thing that Won kept on digging for facts and found out about the Rin/Dan trade-off. 

Two, after Rin learned that Won went to their house to ask for Dan's hand in marriage. Rin should have insisted that there was no need for Won to marry his sister. Remember, by the time Won visited the Wang household, he already knew that Dan was off the tribute list and that Rin volunteered to become the substitute. Won offered to marry Dan because he felt guilty for messing up their plan to save Dan with Jeon's wedding. But that guilt was groundless, and there was no obligation for Won to fulfill. The fault actually lay with Rin's precipitous intervention. As I said before, he messed up royally when he LIED to Won and withheld information from him because he wanted to prevent San's marriage to his brother.  

Three, after their sparring. Instead of running off to get the medicine, he could have waited until San left and told Won the truth. To be honest, I disliked his comment that he had to go find medicine for Won because he would be in big trouble should Won sport a bruise due to him. To me, it sounded self-pitying, and passive-aggressive.  Lol. San was fussing all over Won’s split lip. But he too got was hit “well†-- by Won’s admission -- yet he received none of the attention from San. 

More importantly, after the King accused Won of attempting to kill him with his arrow in Episode 10. Rin should have spoken up FOR HIS FRIEND by disclosing his brother’s and SongIn’s plot. Even if he didn’t want to implicate his brother, he could link the Snakeman to SongIn. He witnessed the attack, and he was later approached and informed by SongIn of the conspiracy to replace CP. Had he revealed the conspiracy, he would have absolved Won from wrongdoing. But Rin remained silent. 

For me, apart from his dishonesty, another problem with Rin is that he retreated whenever he was beleaguered. Contrary to popular paeans to his loyalty and valor, when push came to shove, Rin fled. Lol. I had to laugh when the bodyguard JangEui asked Rin when they were surrounded, “Do we fight to win this or to escape?†and Rin answered, “To escape.†Sure, I know it's a rhetorical question. But to me, the scriptwriter was being superfluous. Of course, Rin’s answer was to flee. He had been running away quite a lot in these past episodes. 

For instance, when they were young, and overheard the plot to ambush the Minister's caravan, he wanted to leave the problem to the authorities to sort it out. On the rooftops with San, whenever the conversation became serious, he flew across the tiles. With the problem of the San’s wedding, he left the scene and went missing-in-action for six days.  When his sister was placed on the tribute list, he negotiated to leave the country in her place without telling Won -- to another disastrous consequence. In regard to his love for San, he also wanted to flee. “As I thought, His Highness does not have any idea. I wish to leave, not because of him. I wish to leave because of me.†He did the same thing with his sister, Dan. One minute, they were having a heart-to-heart conversation, then the next minute, he apologized and vanished without an explanation or a goodbye. 

That’s why I said Rin was pretty good at running away. Given the choice of fight-or-flight to a perceived threat or harm, his instinctive response was flight. 

And now, Won asked him to be a flagpole? Pfffttt. I feel like reaching into the laptop and cuff Won upside the back of his head for his naivety. I want to warn him, “Your so-called friend is not to be trusted. It’s not that Rin is a bad man per se, but he isn't steadfast as you believe he is. You don’t know when he’s lying to you or when he’s going to leave and disappear on you -- out of noble idiocy.†default_smile.png.1a17920c0f0ac6da5e6bf8

Mark my words, bebe1989. Between the two of them, Won is the one who sticks and stands by his friends regardless of circumstances. He’s reliable to come through for a friend. And I think some of the knetizens are aware of this. One of the top comments (on Naver? Nate? I don’t know your source, bebe1989) was “San ah, it is not Rin that will come no matter when. It is Won who sent him over….â€

2. On friendship

Like @julie721, I think San slowly but steadily recognizes what Won is capable of doing for his friend Rin. For example, the day when she met Rin outside the Geumgajeong after the canceled wedding, she observed that “It seems like he (Won) does not know who I am yet. He did not know who I was. And yet he came. You must have asked him to do it.†She discovered that Rin had only to ask and Won would do it for him. Then, later on, she saw Won endure the king’s insulting command to pour tea for Jeon and the Minister, and pretend that his drunkenness prompted him to break up her engagement, rather than drag Rin’s name into the fray.  Thus, San explicitly began to trust Won when he told her not to worry about Rin’s departure to Yuan. She replied, “If you will not let him go, I am no longer worried.†She was beginning to grasp Won’s temperament, and like what she told Rin at the maypole dance, Won wasn’t the type to hold back when helping out a friend. That was why she had kept him in the dark about her looming marriage to Jeon. 

By Episode 9, it’s been well-established how dependent Won was on Rin to act on his behalf.  He had utmost confidence that Rin would do things for him that he was otherwise unable to do on his own due to his royal status. Like saving her on rooftops. She discovered that Rin was the one who helped her out that night and grabbed her by the waist and shoulder. She pondered, “Now, I know whose hands held me safe that night. If I ask why, he will say his friend sent him to watch me.†Also, despite being sometimes misguided (i.e., his lies and cover-ups), Rin could be expected to act in Won’s interest. That was why Won tasked him to bring San to the maypole dance. He was asking as a man to another man to bring San to him. Won had complete trust that Rin had his welfare in mind, that Rin had his back. In Rin’s list of priorities, Won might come a close second to his family’s top spot, but at least Won was still uppermost. 

To me, then, this whole friendship thing that San desired from Won must be revisited because I don’t think she meant it the way most viewers – and the Queen – understood it.  The Queen had asked her how she felt about Won in her heart and she responded, “I would like him to be my friend forever. I envied him and his friendship with Master Rin. I wished to be part of that.†The general view is that she had “friend-zoned†Won. 

In my opinion, she’s projecting her own ideas of friendship onto the Won/Rin relationship. She didn’t mean “just†friends, in a platonic sense. Remember in the first episode when the three of them spent the night at the cave, she was also confused about their closeness, and thought their relationship to be gay love. She imagined that they were lovers because their friendship looked deeper than ordinary. Lol. She thought they were strange. Then, when she was spying at Wang’s house and met the two of them, she again commented about their extraordinary relationship because they seemed to come as a pair.  

I think she meant a friendship that’s almost akin to love in its trust and inter-dependence, and protection. It’s a friendship that cannot exist without the other person, and will do anything for that person, including laying down one’s life. It’s a friendship that forsake all others. That was the kind of friendship she envied. She saw the close bonds of the two, and she wanted the same for herself.  And remember what I wrote here before about the kind of marriage that Won needed?  Since he grew up in a hostile environment, with his parents trading barbs at every occasion possible, he needed to learn a love that is rooted in friendship and mutual respect. 

That’s why the ring necklace was an important gift. In my opinion, she gave it to Won NOT because she was feeling gratitude, sorrow or pity for him, for suffering  humiliation for Rin’s sake, for her broken engagement, and for the grubby bracelet she had given him. To me, she’d intentionally given him the dingy bracelet to rile him, just like she wiped her snotty nose on his sleeves.  But she gave the necklace to him as a pledge that she would be there for him in the future. No matter what he would asked of her in the future, she was confident that she’d be able to grant him that favor. 

A girl like San wasn’t the type to give such a gift casually or haphazardly.  Both the bracelet and the ring necklace were significant because they were handmade and personal. She made them as a set, and she gave them to him one by one. More importantly, she had WORN them; they were against her skin or clothing before she had given them to him. They weren’t new pieces ordered from the merchants. The ring necklace, especially, was a memento of her deceased mom, so it was tenfold more meaningful. Lastly, a gift of a bracelet, ring or necklace sends a subtle and subconscious message of being bound or connected together.  

Not only that. She backed up her necklace gift with action. She CHOSE to stay by his side and work at the Geumgajeong where he would be. Now that her secret identity as a servant was blown, she could have stayed in her father’s house or return to the safety of the mountains. But she didn’t leave town; she hung around where he was. Although she admitted after her broken engagement to feeling confused as to which one of the men made her heart ache more, she opted to discombobulate herself a little bit more and stayed by his side in case he needed her. (hahaha. She’s a masochist after all.) That day on the bridge, she asked him if she could stay by his side. Until he could finally reveal his dark secret to her, she asked to stay close to him. 

Won: You? Close to me?

San: If you need help, someone to lean on, or someone to vent at. Just tell me and I will (be there)… 

3. On the days leading up to the tea party

It’s most unfortunate then that this “secret†that Won had to keep from her was not one of his doing, but Rin’s. The secret which held him back from San was his marriage offer to Rin’s sister. In my opinion, Rin should have come clean and told his friend Won unequivocally that he was NOT to blame for the tribute fiasco, and that he should NOT feel obligated to clear up the mess by marrying Dan. I don’t understand why Rin comforted Dan that she was no longer on the tribute list so marriage to Won wasn’t necessary, BUT he neglected to tell Won that HE too was off the hook. 

That night, all three of them, Rin, Won, and San, were outside thinking of the upcoming tea party and the difficult choices they must make. For Won and San, their musings paralleled each other. Won was waiting outside in the cold for Dan. He said, "The winter is extra-long. And the wind is still cold. I have little power and many people to tiptoe around. This is the best I could do. My methods are pitiful, but I hope you understand."  He was actually addressing Jin Gwan, his bodyguard with a crush on Dan. As usual, Jin Gwan heard Won’s address to him, and he bowed in gratitude and indebtedness to the favor granted by Won to him by saving Dan from being sent to Yuan.

Meanwhile, San and her maid are talking out in the cold. Her maid scolded her, “The wind is still cold. What are you doing outside?†and she replied, “To see if spring is coming.†The maid told her that she must make the CP like her to save her life. But San wondered out aloud if she should risk her life instead. Both Won and San realized how puny their attempts were at organizing their lives. 

The maid asked San if the man would be upset if the CP liked her. San replied cryptically, "One man will be pleased, he will clap and he will even commend me. But the other man will be very sad. Not because of me, but because of the other man. He has to go very far away….Because of me, both are about to become very unhappy.  Then they will both hate me." 

At first glance, it seemed like she was referring to Won as the man who’d applaud for her, and then to Rin who’d be sad. But in my opinion, the first man she was talking about was Rin. He would be pleased and commend her for marrying the CP.  He practically said as much when they met in the morning on the rooftop and he urged her to tell Won the truth about her identity. Rin wanted her to marry Won so she’d be saved from the tribute. (BTW, the night before, he abruptly apologized to his sister and left. The reason he apologized was he was thwarting his sister’s dream of marrying Won by telling San to win Won.)  

The second man she spoke of was Won. Won would become sad, not because of her, but because Rin would have to be dispatched as a non-service hostage to Yuan if Won chose San as his bride. She knew that they had fought because Won was enraged that Rin volunteered himself without telling him. Won would do anything to keep Rin by his side. 

Also by this time, San already guessed what Won meant during their conversation on the bridge. Won had told her at the bridge, “You are my first….Once you find out my secret, and see what I did, and will do, you will probably end up disliking me. You will never understand. You are my first. Never forget that.†The day after the bridge confession, at the Geumgajeong, he again reminded her that she was his first while holding on to her hand. To me, she pulled her hand away from his clasp, and stood up to stand by the window, because she was finally figuring out Won’s true intentions.  You see, the previous night she had been apprised by SongIn of Dan being sent to Yuan as a tribute. And now, she discovered that Rin volunteered to be an indentured servant to Yuan.  In my opinion, San was beginning to realize the implication of Won’s words at the bridge. Yes, she was the first. And yes, she was feeling uncomfortable with Won’s secret plan of action. That's why she pulled away.

For me, bebe1989, the other interesting thing here is that -- from Won’s perspective -- this was the moment he began to be jealous of the two.  

That’s why on that cold evening when the three friends were each contemplating their action at the tea party, San was sitting outside undecided about her course of action. She knew she could win the Crown Prince’s heart if she wanted to -- because Won already said that she was first. But if she did insist on being the bride, then Won would be deprived of his best friend Rin. And she had already been warned by Won at the bridge that he was planning on a course of action that would displease and disgust her (that is, marrying somebody else). 

That is the reason why I doubt that San was actually in love with Rin at this point in time. Her main consideration at this moment wasn’t Rin’s welfare or his removal to Yuan, butWon’s feelings. She was contemplating risking her life, and sacrificing everything including her father and their family wealth just so Won wouldn’t be deprived of his best friend Rin. She knew that Won relied totally on Rin. And although Rin himself was prepared to leave Won (well, he WANTED to leave Won, for his own sake), Won wasn’t ready to give up Rin.

Furthermore, the following morning, when they were at the rooftop, she was again thinking of Won’s wellbeing. To me, when she mentioned out-of-the-blue that Dan loved the Crown Prince, she was comforting herself that even if she wasn’t chosen as the bride, her substitute or her replacement Dan was in love with Won anyway. Remember? She took a note of this, too, in Episode 4 when she observed Dan bringing medicine that she had prepared for the Crown Prince after his fall from the horse at the hunting incident. Also, she refused Rin’s offer of a hand. She almost tripped because she didn’t take Rin’s hand, and Rin ended up grabbing her again. And that’s when she realized that Rin was the man on the roof, and that Won had sent him to look after her. 

4. On San’s lie 

In my opinion, San was lying when she requested the Crown Prince to ignore “her mistress†at the tea party because she loved “another man.†You see, if she had been speaking the truth, then sooner or later, Won would suspect Rin – because Rin was the only one aside from him who was in contact with San. And that's the LAST THING she wanted to do: cause an estrangement between him and Rin and more pain for all of them.    

Do you see it, bebe1989?

On her way to the Geumgajeong, San was having an inner monologue which explained her decision-making process.  Per dramabeans: “I have only one thing to do. I must do all I can to ensure that they can stay close to each other as they always did. It would make me feel lonely, but that is my friendship.† I like that she was even dressed in black as if she was in mourning, because what she was about to do probably felt like death to her. Once she was inside the Geumgajeong speaking to Won -- and pretending that she didn’t know him to be the Crown Prince – she told Won that her mistress was in love with ANOTHER MAN. 

The motive for her confession was to keep the bonds between the two men intact, NOT to make one man jealous of the other. She even sacrificed her Dad, and their family fortune, to protect this male bonding. Remember? In Episode 10, we saw her in discussion with her dad and the butler before the tea party. She wasn't going to seek the CP's marriage proposal so she prepared her father for the eventual fall-out. They arranged to divest him of all his properties and to hide the family wealth. 

San’s excuse that her mistress was in love with another man was meant to deceive Won so he wouldn’t choose her, and, in the process, lose Rin in the Rin/Dan tribute exchange. She was only thinking of Won, and the effect of losing Rin would have on Won. As far as she knew, Rin wasn’t opposed to going to Yuan, and even considered it as a good opportunity. He had said, “I can learn more and make personal connections in a great country.†Meanwhile, Won admitted to her that it was going to be difficult to release Rin from the non-service hostage list but that he would have to “overwork†himself to keep Rin with him. 

Her confession was a lie which would allow Won to choose Dan as his bride, and keep Rin by his side as they had always been together. Her lie was her sacrifice. 

If San had been telling him the truth – that is, she was in fact in love with another man – then, it would eventually dawn on Won that the other man would have to be Rin because of their proximity. Lol. Instead of preserving the peace then, she would have caused both men unhappiness, which she was trying to avoid in the first place. In NO WAY did she intend her confession to sow distrust and jealousy between the two men.  

However, I think Rin assumed that San was speaking of him. He alone understood (or misunderstood) the significance of her words. In my opinion, he thought that San was truly confessing her love with another man, specifically him. To his great credit, however, he didn’t act upon it. 

Rin: I told her to tell you everything. I told her to tell you the truth (hahaha. The irony!) and become the crown princess.

Won: Did you tell her to do that?

Rin: What on earth did you two talk about yesterday morning?

Won: She asked me for a favor. She asked me not to choose her lady as the crown princess.

Rin: Why not?

Won: Because in her lady’s heart…in her heart is someone else.

Rin: (dumbfounded)

Won: I should look for SoHwa. I mean San. (still oblivious as to who the other man was.)

On a sidenote: I thought it was interesting that Rin got angry at Won for failing to understand San’s predicament. “If you’re so smart, how can you not get the situation?†(Correct answer: Because you, my good sir, withheld the truth. default_smile.png.1a17920c0f0ac6da5e6bf8)

Now, bebe1989 you understand better why she cried when Won chose Dan at the tea party. It was a whole gamut of emotions, repressed and bottled up, that led to her tears. She knew she was hurting Won deeply with her lie, but she was also sacrificing so much in silence for Won. I know that the original love triangle was two men fighting over San’s love. But in my view, the other untold and often unseen love triangle here was San and Rin competing for Won’s affections. 

 

***********************************

That’s it for me now. Will edit later. Going back to bed again. "

 

 

 

I CANT WAIT FOR TODAY'S EPISODE!!! ahmagahplz.png ahmagahplz.png ahmagahplz.png

 

I have been lurking there as well. I used to be a member there but as I lost my interest, I forgot the password and couldn't be bothered to do anything about it. Being a lurker is more fun to me. Less stressful.

 

I like reading their insights though sometimes I think they went a bit overboard. Some users can be very hard headed and presented very "in-your-face" kind of arguments so I prefer not to get myself involved in their discussion. I am all for world peace.

 

Has anyone watched the new episodes today? What do you guys think so far of it?

 

Sent from my SM-G935P using OneHallyu mobile app

 

I had! It was a fun episode. smile.png

 

I do not want to spoil it to anyone. But if you want spoilers, go ahead and visit Soompi. They had users who will update them with recaps for every episode. I am not very good with words, sorry.

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Not a moment too soon. Rise bae991832bcaa422c7435805680f3b11.jpg

where are the people that talked shitdave.png Compared to other dramas it's not doing bad.

 

Yesterday's episode though RinSanrlytearpls.png

  I enjoyed nothing more than the king's misery at the end though. I loved every second of it. Go Won!! hurrplz.png

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I have just finished watching the latest episodes. and I therefore conclude, that San's feelings are still yet to be revealed. Yes, RinSan scenes are fluttering. makes you think that WonSan is already game over. But WonSan scenes for me have more depth and impact on the show. Rather than being close or accidentally hugging, WonSan scenes always includes sacrifices and deeper things. 

 

I actually think that San was considering the plans that Won has for the two of them when they were in the Azalea field. Had she not seen Dan lurking over, I think she wouldve have gone to Won. But it instantly reminded her how Won is the Crown Prince and he has the whole Goryeo on his shoulder so even if they want to run away from everything, they cant. Plus she also has to conisder Dan and Rin and Rin's family. 

 

If there is a character in TKIL that is selfless, it is San. She is willing to risk her happiness even her father for her friends and other people. 

 

The plot of the story is still ambiguous. The one San truly loves is still not shown but if we look at it closely, the writer already gave us a lot of hints. Anyways, let us wait for next week. The closer we get, the clearer it will be. :)

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ok so ive finished watching the latest eps and i am definitely team wonsan.

rin and san are cute but.. wonsan just seems more like otp

 

 

my heart broke a little every time won thought that san didnt love him back which happened in more than once over the last 2 episodes, first talking with his mother then speaking with san herself and then even when san returned the hair slide to wonwarstarplz.png 

 

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ok so ive finished watching the latest eps and i am definitely team wonsan.

rin and san are cute but.. wonsan just seems more like otp

 

 

my heart broke a little every time won thought that san didnt love him back which happened in more than once over the last 2 episodes, first talking with his mother then speaking with san herself and then even when san returned the hair slide to wonwarstarplz.png 

 

stay strong your WonSan heart. It's still isnt over. Havent you noticed San's expression before she saw Dan lurking in the garden? Plus he still didnt reject Won directly. Won asked her in the prison if it is because he has another man in her heart and instead of answering, she talked about something else. The bird pin is back to Won but she didnt directly give it to him. 

 

and I think San, dreaming (she thought) about Han Chun is a big giveaway. smile.png

I think what San told Won about her Lady having another man in her heart is true. But most of us will think that the other man is Rin.  From my POV, the other man is Han Cheon. QRLGYBO.png

 

Also, remember when San and one of the funny thieves ask her is Won is really the crown prince? With a straight and sad face she told him, "If she is the crown prince then I am the daughter of Minister of Finance". From my POV, San prefers Han Chun than the CP. She dislikes CP because if Won is CP, then she has to be Lady San. rlytearpls.png

Edited by AllForYoong
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stay strong your WonSan heart. It's still isnt over. Havent you noticed San's expression before she saw Dan lurking in the garden? Plus he still didnt reject Won directly. Won asked her in the prison if it is because he has another man in her heart and instead of answering, she talked about something else. The bird pin is back to Won but she didnt directly give it to him. 

 

and I think San, dreaming (she thought) about Han Chun is a big giveaway. smile.png

I think what San told Won about her Lady having another man in her heart is true. But most of us will think that the other man is Rin.  From my POV, the other man is Han Cheon. QRLGYBO.png

 

Also, remember when San and one of the funny thieves ask her is Won is really the crown prince? With a straight and sad face she told him, "If she is the crown prince then I am the daughter of Minister of Finance". From my POV, San prefers Han Chun than the CP. She dislikes CP because if Won is CP, then she has to be Lady San. rlytearpls.png

omg thats such a cool theory.. it makes so much sense!!

im still praying that san will choose won in the end.. he loves her so muchrlytearpls.png

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WARNING! While this post is spoiler free, I wrote it thinking everyone here has at least read the brief synopsis that was released with the initial press release. If you haven’t, please go to dramabeans and read it first.

 

So after having read the books and stewing over them for a while, here are my thoughts. The book isn’t your traditional romance story, there’s much more to it than just that. While San and Rin are both fictional characters, many of the supporting cast and events that push the story forward are based on historical facts. Won, in particular, is very accurately portrayed so you can expect there will be a fair share of political talk in it as well. I expect the drama to pull back on some of the political aspects of the novel and pursue the romance and friendship aspect between our three main protagonist more, but I still expect it to have a bit more politics than say... "Moon Embracing the Sun" and it's honestly pretty interesting. With Goryeo (Korea) being ruled over by Mongolia (Yuan) at the time, this is a pretty touchy period of history for many Koreans so adhering to historical facts will be imperative to how well this drama is received. I remember "Empress Ki" receiving a huge backlash in Korea for how much it distorted history. Luckily for us, one of the books major selling points is it's historical accuracy so I don't expect that to become an issue here.

 

Our three main protagonist Won, San, and Rin are all very well fleshed out characters. But I think Siwan and Yoona fans in particular will be very happy with the range of emotions their characters will be able to play. It’s honestly a little crazy. On the other hand, Rin’s character is much more of a stoic character so I think even bringing on a more novice actor would be an okay choice there too. I should also mention that Rin is NOT a “third wheel†in this story. He is just as important to the story as Won and San are.

 

All in all, it was a very impressive book to read. From a fanboy standpoint, there were moments I was getting giddy just imagining Yoona acting some of the scenes out. From a literary standpoint, the sheer scope of the writing impressed me. The characters travel all over the Yuan Empire and while I'm not sure how much of it will be translated into the drama, one of the pro's of being a pre-produced drama is that we actually have the time to go overseas and film some of these scenes (I know for a fact that “Empress Kiâ€, another MBC drama, filmed a few scenes in China as well so I know that it’s possible).

 

A few users have been asking me to explain the relationship between Won, Rin and San a bit more so I decided to also post what I shared with them here in spoiler tags. And while I do foreshadow a few events, as a whole, I think it’s pretty spoiler free.

 

 

1. Won and Rin

So Won definitely wears the pants in this relationship. He's constantly nagging on Rin for being so stiff around him and pressures him to speak informally when it's just the two of them, often to no avail. Rin is described almost as an extension of Won himself, always standing by his side and willing to do anything the prince asks of him. Rin and Won share the same dream of making Goryeo a better place to live, for the people, and both help each other towards that goal.

 

2. Won and San

Won instantly falls for San, not romantically I mind you, but because a) her looks and b) her selfless nature. San, unlike Rin, is more than willing to talk down to Won, and Won loves her even more for that. At one point in the novel, he mentions that San was the only person he's ever met that didn't treat him as royalty.

 

3. Rin and San

Initially, Rin is very wary of San because she refuses to tell him her true identity. They constantly butt heads with each other and if it weren’t for Won they’d never get along. Nevertheless, Rin is very protective of San and is often the one to save her when she bites off more than she can chew.

 

 

And last but not least, if you want to be added to the group PM, where I'll be sharing a small summary of each chapter, add your name to the list below.

 

1. eMopRiNc3ss69x

2. mikiangel

3. flowerlover

4. burningsoul

5. Konjo

6. thedownfall

7. black phoenix

8. mayshy

9. shutupihateyou

10. Sweety You

 

add me pleaseeeeeee

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Just updated the PM groups for the book summaries! Please let me know if you want to join or if I left you out by quoting this post~

 

btw i ship biyeon x san x dan. they're so cute! >.<

add me please.......... :) :) 

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