Really surprised by the growing interest of international fans with Cdramas

[Hyooga]

As someone who has been exposed to cdramas since childhood (tho I'm more of a kpop/jpop fan) this new interest of intl fans with Cpop and C-ent is really fascinating for me. 

 

I don't remember this happening until recently. Makes me wonder why there is a rise in interest. I was surprised to meet some real life friends the other day (they're not Chinese) who told me they 'just finished this awesome drama which was better than Game of Thrones called Nirvana in Fire'

 

it made me go 'whaaaat' deep inside lmao

 

what is causing this???

[Ghettoe]

Not better than Game of Thrones but Mei Changsu gave me so much life.

 

NIF is like the best thing to come out of Asian entertainment in a long time. 

 

I just still can't believe how good it was. As in I would definitely rank it among some of my top Western shows. 

 

And I belong to the clan who rarely touched Chinese dramas but that drama took my edges. 

[Jcey]

I usually watch it for the entertainment and pretty cast

[KUMA-MON]

I know everybody seem to love Addicted

...wait that is a webdrama.....wait

[Cat_OTO]

I am getting into Ode to Joy rn...

 

I think they are a cool alternative to K-dramas and easily findable on sites like Viki. Female characters especially come across as smart and feisty in some of the C-dramas I have seen. China also has such a rich history to draw from so that is awesome for some of its historical dramas.

 

(BTW I also love J-dramas. The J-drama sense of humor is closest to mine).

[Kr4M]

Even myself Im surprise how much I enjoy chinese drama now a days! Currently Ive been watching My Amazing Boyfriend which kinda like YWCFS but i find really enjoyable..

[registrationform]

My question is where online can I watch dramas with Li Yi Feng? With English subtitles? I'll give a cookie to anyone who knows.

[xingfenzhen]

As someone who has been exposed to cdramas since childhood (tho I'm more of a kpop/jpop fan) this new interest of intl fans with Cpop and C-ent is really fascinating for me.

 

I don't remember this happening until recently. Makes me wonder why there is a rise in interest. I was surprised to meet some real life friends the other day (they're not Chinese) who told me they 'just finished this awesome drama which was better than Game of Thrones called Nirvana in Fire'

 

it made me go 'whaaaat' deep inside lmao

 

what is causing this???

I think it's because there are actually quality translations for Chinese dramas from places like viki and dramafever. Have you seen the official translations for Chinese drama just from a few years ago? They are god awful! I actually stared to fan-sub Dwelling Narrowness back in 2010, but it was taking so much of my time i stopped at ep. 4 （Which i felt sort of bad, since the Hai Zhao - Song Siming circle of corruption is just starting to spiral). Even now i get request every now and then to continue... So the demand is there, and China has being lots of quality dramas (also start to produce idol dramas, which i usually don'r watch. But lots of people do), just nobody is translating them until very recently.

 

Also ingot a feeling that people are using these dramas to learn mandarin, which i guess is also getting more popular these days.

[hess]

I think because there's been more investment and higher quality dramas coming from mainland now, so there's more dedicated fans to sub to English and then more international fans who come across them.

 

HK movies and Taiwan idol dramas have always held significant clout in Asia but declined/covered over by hallyu craze. I think some people who initially were hooked by kpop/dramas slowly are exploring other Asian productions. Plus drama sites like Viki make it super easy to introduce k fans to c dramas.

 

Also c-stars have been gaining international attention and getting Hollywood opportunities. China movie market is massive now so it has more international presence too.

[5201314]

I would never compare GoT to NIF, they're polar opposites. 

 

That said, higher budgets = more visually appealing. International viewers are more likely to get lured in that way. 

 

God of War is a bad example. I have no idea where they spent that money. The visual effects are piss poor, bunch of poor quality green screens. Even some of the costumes looked sub-par. Yoona's presence is the only redeeming value.

[Cat_OTO]

The fact that there is a sizeable Chinese diaspora scattered around the world also helps, I think. Not only interms of an audience that downloads, but also an audience that WANTS better subs -- and an audience that CAN sub effectively.

 

I live in the UK and there are people at my work who are of HK ascendency. Their families got them into that MEGA c-drama The Empress with Fan Bing Bing. They were streaming it with subs. Like, it was must-see daily TV and they were talking about who got poisoned in the last episode and stuff, lol. They even got me into it for a while lol.

[Xiaoshu]

It increases fastly after the mega hit "NIF". Audiences just start to know which is the real good thing. I think idol-drama became more & more boring. I myself never into this thing.  

 

Many good quality C-dramas wasn't subbed. Actually, if it turns to historical/costume/period drama, Chinese is the best. For modern drama, I didn't usually watch it but "Ode To Joy" won my heart. 

 

I'm sure, with Tribes and Empires, NIF 2, Zhen Huan 2, .... will make everyone crazy (-:

[Ravie]

I think it because it actually get subbed and many people find it very good drama the internet, then add the high streaming of NiF while also being a very good drama, 

 

Kdrama got popular because of BoF or Autumn in my heart so people perception is kinda about the unique story or very sad drama, (there's dae jang geum too).

The rise of NiF in the mid of GoT super popularity make it seems C-drama is full of depth and the can handle the historical setting so beautifully, so it differ from the Kdrama and people who like Kdrama already knew many Cdrama when their fave like Park Hae Jin, lee da hae, yoona, kim jeogn hoon, victoria have mainland drama,

for other demographic,  after they find NiF, there're lot of quality show to go back so people find it's interesting, imo you can watch Empress of China only for the costume, it's beautiful 

 

before, it's really hard to find mainland show but now there's abundant of raw video in the internet and there's a subber like in Viki 

even hunan tv start subbing I am a singer full show on youtube, 

subbing is what important cause that's how Jdrama keep surviving too, 

 

TL:DR

NiF and Empress of China got popular with good story and very beautiful setting, so they differ from the Kdrama (cute girl, romance, sad story) genre and Jdrama (super realist slice of life or super weird) style. 

Then the subs in streaming site is availble

[Caridee]

Thank addicted, the webseries tbh. Thats how i got into c-ent. I only watch bl stuff tho.

[galaxy.xiongmao]

Can't speak for other places, but here where I live C-dramas popularity has been rising due to a growing number of immigrants and exchange students from China, as the cultural relations between the two countries are also strengthening so the number of people interested in Chinese culture and learning Chinese language, be it as a pastime interest or taking it up as the major in college like I did, is also growing every year. So the interest in C-dramas also naturally starts to stem from there. Boss and Me and Zhang Han are extremely popular and loved here.

[choa501]

I've been asking myself the same question. Most people say it's because they're finally producing quality dramas that can compete with K-dramas but to me this is bs because there have been excellent dramas coming out of China for quite a while. I think the main reason is accessibility. There's definitely a larger number of dramas being uploaded in great quality and subbed well and quickly.

[Zenist]

I've been asking myself the same question. Most people say it's because they're finally producing quality dramas that can compete with K-dramas but to me this is bs because there have been excellent dramas coming out of China for quite a while. I think the main reason is accessibility. There's definitely a larger number of dramas being uploaded in great quality and subbed well and quickly.

 

I think that Chinese Entertainment industry just don't give a fuck about gaining international fans for their series.

 

Beside 99.9% of the "international" people that will watch the shows are migrants from Chinese region anyways so they don't even need subs.

 

But only until recently when the K-industry and C-industry became interlaced together that the C-fans slowly started to translate Chinese content. 

[xingfenzhen]

I think that Chinese Entertainment industry just don't give a fuck about gaining international fans for their series.

 

Beside 99.9% of the "international" people that will watch the shows are migrants from Chinese region anyways so they don't even need subs.

 

But only until recently when the K-industry and C-industry became interlaced together that the C-fans slowly started to translate Chinese content.

Indeed, if you go to viki, plenty of good high quality dramas just isn't there. And if they are, they are not subbed or the subs stopped have way and abandoned. While low quality dramas are subbed and licensed, if they have a korean actor in it.

 

For c dramas to go international, the cost and benefit just isn't there. It cost a lot of money to translate the promote the drama, and audience and revenue that effort can generate, doesn't even match a medium sized Chinese city. Money would be better spent (to them, business wise) to promote the drama better in China to gain just an extra 0.1 in TV rating or an extra 50 million or so in online views.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Hyooga]

Indeed, if you go to viki, plenty of good high quality dramas just isn't there. And if they are, they are not subbed or the subs stopped have way and abandoned. While low quality dramas are subbed and licensed, if they have a korean actor in it.

 

For c dramas to go international, the cost and benefit just isn't there. It cost a lot of money to translate the promote the drama, and audience and revenue that effort can generate, doesn't even match a medium sized Chinese city. Money would be better spent (to them, business wise) to promote the drama better in China to gain just an extra 0.1 in TV rating or an extra 50 million or so in online views.

 

 

 

True @ the first point 

 

For your second point, there definitely is a cost and benefit to expanding overseas despite the already huge domestic market. For one, it doesn't cost that much to have a drama subtitled and usually those additional costs are included in licensing packages. But the overseas expansion can help in promoting Chinese places/products/celebrities. A show with international appeal will definitely see heaps of advertiser requests.

Indeed, if you go to viki, plenty of good high quality dramas just isn't there. And if they are, they are not subbed or the subs stopped have way and abandoned. While low quality dramas are subbed and licensed, if they have a korean actor in it.

 

For c dramas to go international, the cost and benefit just isn't there. It cost a lot of money to translate the promote the drama, and audience and revenue that effort can generate, doesn't even match a medium sized Chinese city. Money would be better spent (to them, business wise) to promote the drama better in China to gain just an extra 0.1 in TV rating or an extra 50 million or so in online views.

 

 

 

True @ the first point 

 

For your second point, there definitely is a cost and benefit to expanding overseas despite the already huge domestic market. For one, it doesn't cost that much to have a drama subtitled and usually those additional costs are included in licensing packages. But the overseas expansion can help in promoting Chinese places/products/celebrities. A show known to have potential appeal overseas will definitely see droves of companies wanting a PPL spot somewhere in that program, even just a 5 second flash of their product logo in the credits.

[xingfenzhen]

 

 

 

True @ the first point 

 

For your second point, there definitely is a cost and benefit to expanding overseas despite the already huge domestic market. For one, it doesn't cost that much to have a drama subtitled and usually those additional costs are included in licensing packages. But the overseas expansion can help in promoting Chinese places/products/celebrities. A show known to have potential appeal overseas will definitely see droves of companies wanting a PPL spot somewhere in that program, even just a 5 second flash of their product logo in the credits.

 

Well, given the quality of official English subs we have seem from previous dramas, you'll be surprised to how difficult it is to make it happen. The problems is, people with GOOD English AND Chinese skills in China will seek better positions than mere translators.  Which is why viki's model works so far, because none of those people are professional and probably are either students or has better job than translators. The downside is translation is extremely slow, and easily overwhelmed. 

 

As for distributing via licences, so far most distributors are local Chinese operates, like KTSF26 or KSCI18. Which because the audience speaks Chinese anyway, the series was not subbed. (The only exception is ICN, which did sub and broadcast BBJX a few years ago, but its reach is limited, a whole other story.) While local distributors are either not interested in China media or completely butchers it (see netflix's implementation of ZHZ), even movies like the Mermaid, which make hundreds of millions, got good reviews in the US and distributed by Sony Pictures, only got extremely limited release, zero promotion and mostly seen by the locat Chinese population, except for a few non-chinese person that stumbled into it. So I don't really how this model will work, unless the Chinese production company is ready to sunk translation, promotion and distribution overseas, in the West anyway. That said, the licence model does work in SE asia, and many Chinese drama are shown on Vietnamese and Thai distribution channels, and appears to be a decent following.  

 

In any case, had the Chinese local market isn't lucrative, there is be a lot more effort to get media Chinese medias outside of China, or had there be more interest in China media, there would be more effort too. Now we're in a situation of any random movie or drama is stand to make tens of millions of dollar in China, and overseas market is only valued with a few hundred thousand if they are good, over a million if they are lucky. So guess which market the production companies will focus on, especially now what production cost per drama/movie are now running in the tens of millions as well.

 

 

As for production placement, I don't think overseas reach was ever factored in their contract negotiations. So any success outside of China will not earn them extra brownie points. Als for many brands that's being promoted, it simply is not available outside of China. (The ubiquitous Audi and Iphones notwithstanding) Perhaps, this would come into play if say 10% of their audience is overseas, but right now, I doubt even 0.01% even are.

[Hyooga]

Well, given the quality of official English subs we have seem from previous dramas, you'll be surprised to how difficult it is to make it happen. The problems is, people with GOOD English AND Chinese skills in China will seek better positions than mere translators.  Which is why viki's model works so far, because none of those people are professional and probably are either students or has better job than translators. The downside is translation is extremely slow, and easily overwhelmed. 

 

As for distributing via licences, so far most distributors are local Chinese operates, like KTSF26 or KSCI18. Which because the audience speaks Chinese anyway, the series was not subbed. (The only exception is ICN, which did sub and broadcast BBJX a few years ago, but its reach is limited, a whole other story.) While local distributors are either not interested in China media or completely butchers it (see netflix's implementation of ZHZ), even movies like the Mermaid, which make hundreds of millions, got good reviews in the US and distributed by Sony Pictures, only got extremely limited release, zero promotion and mostly seen by the locat Chinese population, except for a few non-chinese person that stumbled into it. So I don't really how this model will work, unless the Chinese production company is ready to sunk translation, promotion and distribution overseas, in the West anyway. That said, the licence model does work in SE asia, and many Chinese drama are shown on Vietnamese and Thai distribution channels, and appears to be a decent following.  

 

In any case, had the Chinese local market isn't lucrative, there is be a lot more effort to get media Chinese medias outside of China, or had there be more interest in China media, there would be more effort too. Now we're in a situation of any random movie or drama is stand to make tens of millions of dollar in China, and overseas market is only valued with a few hundred thousand if they are good, over a million if they are lucky. So guess which market the production companies will focus on, especially now what production cost per drama/movie are now running in the tens of millions as well.

 

 

As for production placement, I don't think overseas reach was ever factored in their contract negotiations. So any success outside of China will not earn them extra brownie points. Als for many brands that's being promoted, it simply is not available outside of China. (The ubiquitous Audi and Iphones notwithstanding) Perhaps, this would come into play if say 10% of their audience is overseas, but right now, I doubt even 0.01% even are.

 

 

Now that you've mentioned it, it just seems inevitable that Chinese dramas/films/shows are recently progressing at such a rapid rate that it was inevitable to eventually make waves overseas either way. Not to mention all these Chinese conglomerates buying international entertainment corporations. It may not have been a planned effect (with the original plan in simply improving the domestic entertainment industry) but the growth has led to these things happening anyway.

 

Still, it cannot be ignored that China is beginning to have a VERY multicultural entertainment industry. Before, all the I used to see dabbling are the HK and Taiwan celebrities but recently, Korean and Japanese celebrities seem to want their fair share of the pie. The Korean 'wave' in China is too obvious to deny but what surprised me is that even the Japanese entertainment industry wants to cash in. I was going through the profile of Amuse (the Japanese super media agency) and I saw they now have an office in Shanghai.

[xingfenzhen]

 

Still, it cannot be ignored that China is beginning to have a VERY multicultural entertainment industry. Before, all the I used to see dabbling are the HK and Taiwan celebrities but recently, Korean and Japanese celebrities seem to want their fair share of the pie. The Korean 'wave' in China is too obvious to deny but what surprised me is that even the Japanese entertainment industry wants to cash in. I was going through the profile of Amuse (the Japanese super media agency) and I saw they now have an office in Shanghai.

 

Hell, even hollywood wants to cash in, with not only with Chinese stars in hollywood movies, but also hollywood actors and writers in Chinese movies. So I wonder what well that will turn out though, namely the much hyped and very costly Great Wall movie. Somehow I feel that will be a flop, hopefully that will not discourage more cooperation in the future.

 

But, I think China still see overseas as a source for talent and learning rather an actual market. Perhaps, they need to earn some serious money from a project to realization the world outside of China is worth a while advanture.

 

edit: just thought of something thing. Korean actors in Chinese drama is actually not that uncommon, even before Korean wave was a thing. Park Si-yeon for example, even started her acting career in Chinese dramas...  And Choo Ja-hyun was very active in the Chinese dramas as well, that was more than 10 years ago...

[Hyooga]

Hell, even hollywood wants to cash in, with not only with Chinese stars in hollywood movies, but also hollywood actors and writers in Chinese movies. So I wonder what well that will turn out though, namely the much hyped and very costly Great Wall movie. Somehow I feel that will be a flop, hopefully that will not discourage more cooperation in the future.

 

 

I remember reading somewhere (reddit I think) about how these sort of collaborations will NOT work unless the creators from both sides will be able to understand each other. Take for instance: Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon was a huge hit internationally but it doesn't suit the taste of Chinese speakers. Even with East Asian co-prods you see that gaping hole that something is amiss. Someone even mentioned that whoever will come up with the perfect formula on how to make movies that suit both the taste of the East and the West will hit it big time simply because no one has ever done so yet. 

 

Surely if such project does happen and becomes a success, it will be used as a relevant case study of sorts in the years to come from film schools to marketing students.

[xingfenzhen]

 

Surely if such project does happen and becomes a success, it will be used as a relevant case study of sorts in the years to come from film schools to marketing students.

 

Well, western pure hollywood movie does get big box office in China, as does series like Game of Thrones, House of Cards and oddly enough Big Bang Theory. (GoT is pirated, the latter two was actually licensed for a while) To make it successful in reverse, however, would be more difficult. However, as the hollywood may find itself in trouble in the future as the novelty wears off and the quality gap between Chinese and Hollywood production closes, as their storytelling rarely connect emotionally with the audience. (The notable exception being Titanic)

 

Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon is actually not bad as a Wuxia film, the problem with it is there is really no convincing interaction between the characters and the dialogue is quite jarring and unnatural. The former I think is a lack of chemistry between the romantic leads, you just don't get emotionally invested in it (Chinese Odyssey does this very well), and the problem with conversation is a script writing problems, the diction is too literary and the actors spoke with almost no emotions. Both problems disappear if you don't understand the language, which is probably why foreign audience has no probably with it. Similar thing appears in the "Chinese" scenes in the martian as well, the acting and dialogue is so bad, it is almost comical to watch. (And this is not counting the accent present in the Mandarin dialogue.)

 

By the way, have you checked out the youtube channel Every Frame a Painting? I really like it, especially

and it makes me see movies and drama in a different way. It makes me appreciate the visual language used in Chinese dramas like NiF, disguiser or even older productions like The Road We have taken.

[Hyooga]

Well, western pure hollywood movie does get big box office in China, as does series like Game of Thrones, House of Cards and oddly enough Big Bang Theory. (GoT is pirated, the latter two was actually licensed for a while) To make it successful in reverse, however, would be more difficult. However, as the hollywood may find itself in trouble in the future as the novelty wears off and the quality gap between Chinese and Hollywood production closes, as their storytelling rarely connect emotionally with the audience. (The notable exception being Titanic)

 

 

But a lot of hits in China like Pacific Rim and some blockbuster movies didn't fare as well in the US afaik. So I feel there is still a disparity in taste somehow.

 

I do wonder though how Hollywood would be affected once the Chinese domestic movie industry becomes more lucrative, if ever they do get affected at all.