Official Plastic Surgery Thread

[SepiaSkies]

2 minutes ago, peach0827 said:

isn't a jaw shave a really severe procedure tho? there's intense swelling for a little while after surgery, but jaehyun and doyoung are idols so how would they get away with hiding it? it makes more sense for companies to do procedures like this pre debut like they did for aespa. also i'm pretty sure the max break between comebacks that they've gotten is a couple months at most. but maybe i'm overestimating the recovery time for jaw shaves idk.. are there any pics of them looking bloated in the face around the time they supposedly got it done?

 

It was done pre-debut. If Jaehyun did get a jaw shave (I've already said my piece about this) it would've been done when he was around 16-17, maybe. Doyoung's I'm pretty sure was done in 2014, considering he joined SM in late 2013 (lots of pics from around that time with his natural jaw) and was introduced as part of SM Rookies in January 2015. By that time he's already had his jaw shaved. They were both still in their teens. I'm pretty sure the only actual surgery Doyoung got after he was inroduced was a nose job. Same for Jaehyun.

Yes it is is a severe procedure that takes a long time to heal, but if you've ever watched plastic surgery vlogs most people can go outside and for the most part participate in normal everyday activities after around 1 1/2 - 2 weeks. They're still swollen of course and can't do strenuous activities or eat solid food, but most of the "grotesque" swelling will have gone down by that time with the right after care.

[SepiaSkies]

1 hour ago, peach0827 said:

jaw shave at 16? that should be illegal

that makes more sense then, but i've seen people on this thread saying jaehyun's jaw changes era to era. ig they mean with fillers though? i don't see how you could just casually get a new jaw shave whenever you feel like it lol

His jaw used to fluctuate quite a lot, which is why I'm inclined to believe he never had a jaw shave but opted for botox injections instead. That way the muscles would slowly go down in size as they atrophy (this process takes a few weeks and is gradual, masseter botox does not show immediately) and then slowly build back up again as the botox wears off. Rinse and repeat. That's where the fluctuations in jaw size come from. Getting to the state his jaw is currently in, it took him a few years to get there; if I'm not mistaken, people started to notice around 2018-2019 that his jaw was becoming stronger again, and nowadays it almost looks like when he was a young teen. Almost. The process was gradual which is why I don't believe he's had implants, those would be instantaneously obvious, but rather laid off the botox. But of course I have no way of knowing for sure.

Meanwhile Doyoung's jaw has looked pretty much the same since 2015, without any visible fluctuations over time. I'd argue his face overall is a bit wider nowadays as well, but there's no real change to his jaw and men's faces tend to get a bit wider as they age anyway. Which is why I believe Doyoung is the only one who got a full on jaw shave. Of course it's a shame when young people get such invasive procedures done, but there's nothing we can do about it. That's on them and their parents, mostly.

[SepiaSkies]

25 minutes ago, RussianRoulette said:

Can someone help me figure out what been going on with NCT’s Johnny this past comeback? I know he’s definitely had work done for the sticker comeback but I’m still kinda confused just what it was…

The biggest change I’ve noticed is his face shape, I know him and a lot of the members lost weight for the comeback but his face has gotten reeeeeaaaalllyyy thin, would this be Botox maybe? I think he’s done something to his nose as well.
I don’t really know how to best describe it but he use to have a much “wider” face and now his face look a lot thinner for some reason and I swear it’s starting to look kinda like Doyoung’s face shape?…

I wouldn't say Johnny's face shape is starting to look like Doyoung's at all, if anything his bone structure is becoming more pronounced, so the exact opposite is happening imo. I'm not sure if he's had any work done recently, but he has for sure lost a loooot of weight. He's mentioned he's been on a potato diet before the comeback, as the starch sucks water out of your body which makes his abs look more defined. I've even seen some people joking that he's starting to look like a character in a Tim Burton movie. It was meant as a compliment, but I hope he's okay and doesn't feel to pressured to show his abs all the time.

I currently don't have any pictures at hand though, if anyone follows him closely please feel free to post some and help us out lol.

[SepiaSkies]

4 hours ago, meeeplet said:

He has put on weight but there are definitely fillers too. His facial fullness has fluctuated throughout the years even when his weight has been stable.

2017: 

This is what I would say is roughly his "facial baseline" when at a healthy weight but without fillers. He's not as gaunt here as he was before 2016 but he also doesn't have the facial fullness he has today.

2018:

His face starts to look fuller here and looses some definition but it's nothing drastic. I would guess this is around the time he started dabbling in facial fillers but kept it fairly conservative.

2017 vs 2018:

 

From 2019 to the present his facial volume just fluctuates.

2019:

2020:

2021:

2017 vs 2019 vs 2021

Of course, it's his face and entirely his choice what he does with it, but I do feel like Sehun never had the kind of face that was meant to be full. In my opinion, the fillers don't really enhance his features, like cosmetic procedures are meant to, and instead detract from them which is really a shame.

Sehun honestly just looks like he gained weight. The volume in his face is very evenly distributed and looks just like tissue/fat to me, fillers kind of have a different look and It's rare to use fillers evenly all over your face, it's normally just a few selected areas like the cheeks. Either way, he has most definitely gained weight over the past year and got a lot of flack for it from so-called "fans" who were claiming he's been letting himself go and stuff. He's also expressed insecurity about his weight gain more than once because he was never the type to visibly gain weight in the past, but now it happened. It's very common for people to gain weight as they enter the latter half of their twenties, and idols are not exempt from that.

Now onto the topic of why idols get fillers when being skinny is so emphasized in the industry: a lot of idols are most likely underweight or bordering on it, and there's no way they can all retain their youthful full cheeks at that weight. I know this because I am underweight as well, and while my body still looks okay (obviously very skinny but not yet worryingly so), my face is completely boney and sunken in. I always get a shock when I see myself in pictures, it's not very flattering at all. If there was a way to only gain weight in the areas where I need it, I would probably take it immediately. You cannot control where you gain weight though, so most idols resort to fillers I suppose.

[SepiaSkies]

5 hours ago, happysoxdonkey said:

Did Jisung get a lot of filler in his upper lip for the NCT2021 comeback? 

Is this Renjun below?  If so, he looks really different to my eye.  Is his nose different?

 

 

 

Renjun's nose honestly looks the same to me, maybe the tiniest bit less bulbous from the front, but that just might be makeup and lighting. The profile is definitely the same though.

However recently I cannot help but notice how wide his eyes look? I've made a post about Renjun's eyes before where I wondered if he's had his inner corners cut as well, but I couldn't really tell. Then I came across some pics today and I couldn't help but wonder again:

This is probably not even a recent thing but I'm honestly really bad at telling when someone had work on their eyes done. Epicanthoplasties especially seem to be millimeter work and therefore hard to spot unless the change is extremely obvious.

[SepiaSkies]

9 hours ago, peach0827 said:

i'd say fillers because his nose has been constantly changing throughout the years. i think that's the only thing he had done. dreamies have always been pretty natural (renjun breaking that trend now though lol)

does anyone get why some idols choose to keep getting fillers redone instead of just getting rhinoplasty? does it look more natural with fillers? i don't see the appeal when you could just get under the knife once and get it over with

I don't think Dream have been all that natural for quite a while now, people have been talking about Jaemin, Haechan and Renjun in this thread since at least 2018. But I do believe that the work they've had done was minimal and rather conservative, especially compared to other SM groups. It kind of makes sense to only tweak things a little for them, as those things can easily be brushed off as puberty.

3 hours ago, happysoxdonkey said:

I have noticed Jaemin looking different recently, too.  I think maybe a lot of fillers made his face look puffy?  Anyone with a good eye able to tell what’s up?  He’s got as handsome a face as possible so I hope he doesn’t get any work done. 

We've talked about Jaemin recently, he's mentioned that he's been actively putting on weight because he wants to build more muscle, so that might just be it. Of course he could be getting fillers on top of that as well, but his body in general has noticeably filled out over the course of this year, so in my opinion it's mostly just weight.

2 hours ago, peach0827 said:

the general consensus on jaemin is that he had a nose job at some point but i don't think he's had any other major procedure done at least not since debut. he has this crease line on his eyelids that's usually indicates double eyelid surgery but from what i remember he's always had double eyelids so idk. but either way i don't even count that as a significant procedure anymore cause i'm so desensitised to it, almost all monolided idols get it done 

as for fillers, maybe. idk if it was on here or somewhere else but i saw an article talking about how really underweight idols usually get fillers for their face to remain looking youthful. it does make sense when you think about it, because usually underweight people's faces look pretty gaunt but a lot of idols are underweight and their faces still remain looking normal. jaemin has always been very underweight and in my opinion there have been times when his face looked pretty worrying (ridin era to name one). renjun on the other hand has as far as i remember never looked gaunt in the face despite being pretty underweight since debut pretty much

while on the topic of renjun is it just me or does his nose look different? (his recent ig update)

 

Whether you look gaunt or not depends on your natural build, I guess. Jaemin actually has sturdier and fleshier build than the rest of Dream, and it's becoming more apparent now that he's been actively putting on weight and muscle. When he's at a low weight it's not surprising that his face looks a bit sunken in because it's not natural for him to be at such a low weight. Renjun on the other hand has always been naturally very skinny, probably the only SM idol who was never put on a diet and instead encouraged to gain weight. I find that people who are naturally very skinny tend to look less gaunt or hollow in the face even at a low weight, because it's more natural to them. Not sure if this applies to everyone though, it's just something I've observed. Though Renjun has definitely gained weight over the past year for what seems like the first time ever, so that might throw people off as well. (His nose still looks the same to me, but there have been times recently where his face shape was fluctuating a lot. He might be experimenting with botox.)

[SepiaSkies]

Dropping some videos here in case anyone is interested in the recovery process and direct aftermath of plastic surgery, especially major surgeries such as jaw shaves:

I watched this video ages ago and just remembered it now. She got her eyelids, nose and jaw done all at once, and this video was filmed around two months after the surgeries took place. What I find interesting about this video is how quickly she was able to resume touristy activities such as shopping and going for food. I remember being quite surprised by how good she already looked after like one week, despite having had major surgeries such as a jaw shave, which I probably wouldn't have guessed if I had just seen her in the streets. At some points the video does feel a bit like an ad lol, but I'm glad her recovery process was smooth and relatively swift.

Another video. She had her nose and jaw done at the same clinic, I guess they bought the same package or something, but again, she was able to and actually encouraged to move around and go outside to do normal everyday things pretty much immediately after the surgery to help with the recovery. Very little pain, lots of fun. Surpirsingly, it was her nose job that caused her much more discomfort and pain than getting her jaw shaved. Both of these women seem to have gotten fantastic after care treatments to aid and speed up their recovery, I now want a facial as well lol.

Anyway, I feel like we are always under the impression that recovering from a major surgery such as a jaw shave must be terrible, you're miserable and bedridden for weeks on end, bloated beyond recognition, and that it's overall a terrible affair. But if anything, all the videos on this topic I've watched so far had surprisingly swift recovery processes with little to no complications. I'm sure there are also a lot of people who had negative experiences (browsing horror stories on some forums was chilling), but if you get lucky like these ladies and go to a trustworthy clinic, the recovery appears to be much less daunting,

I'm also posting these because people love to say that there's no way idols could ever get jaw shaves in between comebacks because their downtime would be way too long, but these videos showed the exact opposite. Sure, full recovery does take up to a year, if not more, but depending on how fast you recovery process is idols could absolutely make public appearances again in a little under a month. If normal people are already provided this level of after care, imagine idols from big companies who can go to the best clinics. Doesn't diminish the fact that it's a risky surgery, but saying that it's impossible for idols to get such major work done after debut is obviously not true.

 

[SepiaSkies]

8 hours ago, xmisterygamerx said:

I dont know a lot of plastic surgery so I dont know if this question is really dumb.

If someone gets a nose implant to make their nose look higher ( like Winter I guess) can they get the implant removed later? If yes, will their nose look the same as before they got the implant?

They absolutely can get it removed, it's quite common I'd say. However it is very unlikely they'll just be able to leave their nose like that, without any implant at all. When an implant is inserted, the surgeon will often have to get rid of some of the cartilage and bone to accomodate for the implant, so there's no way your nose would look exactly the same as it did before. It's not only about height, but the desired shape also needs to be taken into consideration. You would most likely need to replace the implant with something that's less thick, if you want less height so your nose looks closer to how it originally was.

[SepiaSkies]

9 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

Their make-up artist hates them, from the pink lip tint to the chalk foundation to their eyebrows (side note: I've read in some places that the 2000s revival in fashion may be bringing skinny brows back - as well as the hyper skinny body. Lovely).

Anyways, I wanted to ask about my boy group ults, NCT. This is what I've gathered from the thread or my own observation:

Unquestionable

Taeil: nose job (he has a very obvious implant with the bridge being perfectly straight and the "penis" shape). i think maybe he did his eyes really subtly.

Doyoung: probably the most extreme jaw shave i've ever seen on a male idol from a big company (i'll never forgive whoever/whatever convinced him to do it), nose job (another fallen hooked nose soldier), eyes, and lip fillers.

Johnny: nose job (2x, both predebut, i don't know what the surgeon was thinking), and his chin/jaw??

Ten: nose job. his jaw is probably just naturally very weak.

Jaehyun: whatever he did to his jaw (a shave, implants, buccal fat removal and/or a liter of botox), something was done and he's had so many different iterations of it to try to counter his naturally adorable chubby cheeks and craft his intended shape (whoever convinced him to mess around with his jaw is also on my hit list). nose job and eyes and i think he gets lip fillers too.

Yuta: there's like nothing that isn't blurry predebut but i think he's had a nose job (implant like Taeil), and something to his jaw and chin area (his surgeon should be in jail). it looks like it used to be wider and squarer and is slimmer now and he has an implant in the chin. i also think he's done his eyes too to make them bigger.

Jungwoo: nose job, eyes, a ton of filler in his cheeks and lips to make him the second taemin

Jaemin: nose job (2x - his predebut, debut, and current nose are all different), eyes, and i think he has fillers/implant to make his chin project more. i need them to stop there.

Shotaro: nose job (a really bad one, his natural nose was so cute), i think his eyes are unchanged. something to his jaw as well.

Yangyang: eyes and nose job. i actually think his lips are naturally like that because his smile looks the same as predebut. maybe a little filler in the chin.

Sungchan: eyes and nose job to make the third jaejoong. his jaw is probably naturally very weak?? 

Mystery

Taeyong: ???? this thread's greatest mystery. his eyes, nose, and jaw are sus to me, i think at the very least he made his eyes bigger. i also think he uses fillers more than we think, at the very least in his lips.

Kun: i think he made his nose less round but others say he is natural.

Mark: either SM's only natural male idol, or has very subtle procedures for his eyes and nose bump

Winwin: there was one post on this thread that i can no longer find that said he has alarplasty scars. but everyone also says he's natural.

Haechan: ??? very subtle nose job? he had a bump (leave nose bumps alone!!)

Renjun: double eyelid surgery (unquestionable), but i feel like his nose and jaw look different. maybe it's just the longer hair that is softening his image.

Jeno: maybe some filler/implant in his chin (like with Jaemin) to project out, and filler in lips and corners. that kpoprocedure instagram says he has alarplasty scars but i have never looked up at his nostrils so idk. if anyone touches his godly big nose, i'll cry blood.

Xiaojun: ???? he has so many adorably awkward predebuts and yet i feel blind if there's been a change

Hendery: very subtle tip refinement? another big nose that must not be touched.

Chenle: tbh i don't think he looks like he did during Go era, with his jaw (slightly slimmer) and eyes (slightly bigger), but i can't pinpoint it

Jisung: perhaps the real only natural SM male idol tbh

help??

now why did i think taeyong was an ulzzang? i'm a flop nctzen. he's so charmingly awkward.

irene did her eyes (double eye lid surgery), nose and her chin area i think. she's discussed a lot in this thread in the past.

Wow, you really compiled all of the members, that's a lot of work. I've talked about several NCT members on numerous occasions before, so I will only comment on a few I haven't extensively talked about yet:

Johnny: Most definitely had a nose job before his debut, but I've never noticed a second one? Does anyone happen to have pics? He messed a bit with his chin/jawline predebut, but I don't think it was anything permanent.

Kun: I've had this thought that Kun might've had a nose job for a while now, actually. The alar base looks overall less wide and the tip is less bulbous. Overall it is still quite a bit wider than your average idol's nose though, which is great, it suits his face perfectly like that.

Yangyang: I could agree on the eyes (haven't checked yet but it might be true), but I've never seen anyone mention a possible nose job. His profile stuck out to me the most because his nose tip is a bit flat/droopy, but maybe it changed from the front?

Chenle: Imo very very natural, wide, angular jaw, small eyes, flat nose. It's really obvious when you see him without makeup. Soemtimes his bone structure looks a bit more "snatched" (do we still use that word?) when he's all done up, but that's it.

Mark: I always see people saying he smoothes out his nose bridge with fillers, but nobody ever provides pictures. I've never seen it tbh, whenever I see him his nose always has that characteristic little bump. They do photoshop it sometimes, though.

Taeyong: I agree that Taeyong is a difficult one, he's always looked a bit unreal, like he's just popped out of a manga. I've always felt that he might have gotten some minor work on his eyes and nose to enhance his otherworldly looks, but I can't say for sure. His jawline looks completely natural to me, it's a little bit uneven but a lot of jaws are. Never seen any real fluctuations either, tbh. Every idol makes use of fillers, and Taeyong probably isn't exempt from that.

I don't think either Jeno or Jaemin did anything to their chins, they've both always been prone to developing stronger, slightly protruding chins. One of the few things I legitimately believe were simply due to growing up.

45 minutes ago, elseelseelse2 said:

(The video is so cute) After doing some more investigating, you're right, the hook is still there:

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Hook and the droopy tip still there. This is his predebut hooked nose:

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Now the other thing I saw on this thread was that he'd done something to his jaw/chin, but comparing to Boom era Renjun:

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The jawline and chin shape look the same to me. I can't find a predebut where he's looking to the side (so grain of salt ofc) but he's always had a very thin face and a squarish chin. He does have a very soft looking jaw angle, but unless he shaved his jaw at what, 15 years old, and got a chin implant then, I think it's the same.

So yeah, I think Renjun has only gotten double eyelid surgery!

Yeah, agreed. His nose is still hooked and the tip a little bit bulbous, it's really obvious when he uses the front camera on Vlive/ IG live, imo. He has one of those noses that look pointy and sharp in profile, but a bit bulbous and wider from the front.

[SepiaSkies]

2 hours ago, Zaralei said:

His face looks longer... But not pointy like when he got those chin fillers. It looks more angular like the person above me said -- like his jaw got pulled down. Would there be something on the cheeks as well or is that just the effect of the changes in his jaw?

There's something off about the lips too but I'm not sure. The main thing I noticed is his eyebrows... Did he get them microbladed/tattooed? It's a different and exaggerated shape too which makes it look more unnatural. His brow bone is fully exposed. 

The eyebrows are completely throwing me off, they make him look like a supervillain and not necessarily in a good way. Other than that I agree that his face is particularly long looking today. Might be a combination of his beloved chin fillers and botox to the jaw muscles, that combo is known to elongate the face and make you look gaunt in the process. He's been looking fine for quite a while now, so this sudden change is quite jarring to see.

[SepiaSkies]

2 hours ago, sanchelin said:

Edit: Also, is it possible that Jaehyun has some filler in his chin? I hadn't thought about it before but from some angles the middle of his chin is reminescent of seonghwa's when his filler migrates

Yeah he does get chin fillers, this has been mentioned several times. He naturally has a blunter, square chin.

[SepiaSkies]

10 hours ago, gam3 bo1 said:

more mama content.. the chins 

These just look like normal chins to me? They're all laughing/smiling/talking/otherwise in motion, so they are naturally more pronounced. Especially for people who naturally tend towards stronger chins, like Jeno and Jaemin. My chin also looks like this in photos, and I wouldn't even say I have a particularly strong chin.
I feel like people are a bit paranoid about chins.

8 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

Okay, I did a Jaehyun did deep dive and now I'm even more confused than before. I've put all the photos in spoilers because this is 5+ years of chins and jaws. Let's remember where we started from, here is predebut Jaehyun, before he entered SM. He has very chubby cheeks but notice that he's very skinny as well. He was never a fat kid and was in fact quite athletic:

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Here we have SM Rookies Jaehyun, circa 2014. He was 17 years old.

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The lower half of his face looks narrower (?). Next is debut era Jaehyun, in 2016. He was 19 years old.

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Wider than SM Rookies era (?). Cherry Bomb & Limitless era in 2017, Jaehyun was 20 years old:

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Look at the lower jaw area - does it seem squarer here than 2016? Moving on, in 2018, we have Empathy promotions (Boss), Chain and Regular, where Jaehyun was 21 years old. This is where "ice prince Jaehyun" image really starts and people begin noticing that he's "regrown his jaw":

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2019, 127 promoted Superhuman and went on a world tour.

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Maybe a bit squarer looking. In 2020, when Jaehyun was 23 years old, he promotes Kick It, Punch and Make A Wish. It starts looking even squarer:

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And here we have 2021. Jaehyun is 24 years old, the designated ice prince of 127, and primed for an acting career:

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The final screenshot is from MAMA last night. His jaw is as thick as his neck, squarer, and gaunter. The right side (our right) looks uneven compared to the left, as though he has jaw assymmetry, something he didn't have from 2016-17 where his jaw was rounder. It looks like maybe he had something like this in predebut. Yet I also don't feel like it's the same jaw he had predebut.

The amount of Jaehyun jaw deep dives we've had over the years is incredible, I feel like he deserves an award or something for being so consistently relevant in this thread lol. Anyway, thank you for compiling all these pictures, I think they actually show really well how his jaw has probably always been slightly uneven. I feel like whatever he did to his jaw might've been to even/round out his jawline, next to making  it slimmer. I still very much believe in my botox theory, this does not look like poorly done fillers to me or anything, the asymmetry peaks through throughout 2017 to now imo. Comes with the jaw muscles building back up again. Of course his jaw won't look exactly like it did as when he was a young teen, he's older, slimmer, lost volume in his face (naturally or otherwise idk), so it's definitely going to appear more defined nowadays.

[SepiaSkies]

Hey guys, a couple days ago somebody said that compiling photos from every year to see how much an idol changed over the years instead of comparing their pre-debut looks to their current looks is much more helpful, and I agree.

 

I’ve been meaning to make a post like this regarding Doyoung for a while a now, and I finally got around to it. Pretty much everything in this post has been said before, but I thought it would be nice to have some kind of master post, since the individual posts are pretty spread out over the years. Pics are in the spoilers because this is going to be media heavy!

 

First off, pre-debut, or rather, pre-SM:

 

Spoiler

He’s only around 12/13 in the first pic, but I think it shows his natural face shape quite well. I often say it’s square, but it’s really more of a rectangle. He’s always had a bit of a long face.

Can’t date these pics for sure, but they seem to be taken somewhere around middle to high school:

These are more definitely high school, he should’ve been around 16-17 in these pictures:

His jaw connects properly to his ear! The pic is very bright but it’s obvious his mandible angle is still there.

 

Whatever is going on in these pics:

 

 

 

 

 

This pic shows really well how he used to have a much more prominent mandible angle. He’s not angling his head weirdly or anything so that it looks more pronounced, it’s just naturally that way. The nose is a bit curved with a downward pointing tip.

 

One thing I’ve noticed is that in some pictures his nose bridge looks pretty straight, but in others it appears crooked, almost like he broke it once? He may have fixed his nose once before becoming a trainee. It’s not unheard of that kids who aim to enter the entertainment industry sometimes get work done very young to improve their chances of getting noticed by talent scouts. I cannot tell for sure though.

Next up, SM Rookies! In November 2013, Doyoung joined SM at age 17. This was either in late 2013 or 2014, most likely pre any jaw work. He looks really good here imo. I’d love to see his side profile though.

Spoiler

In January 2015, Doyoung gets introduced as a new member of SM Rookies, just a couple weeks before his 19th birthday. Here is when we get to see some obvious changes regarding his jaw and eyes:

Spoiler

What's with the long face?

 

 

Absolutely no way this was just weight loss, especially since his pre-SM pics show that he’s always been very slim. His face overall looks extremely elongated. Moreover, his mandible angle is considerably weaker and smoothed out. His eyes also appear bigger, but their shape remains uneven. One eye is slightly larger than the other and the shape differs a bit as well. I think it’s nice that they left it that way. His eyes look laterally longer to me and slightly wider, possibly due to getting his outer corners cut. I am notoriously bad at spotting eye work though, so suggestions and corrections are welcome.

His nose is still slightly curved; it’s not a fully hooked nose imo, I’ve seen someone refer to it as a koala nose before and I think that is surprisingly fitting. Most importantly, his nose tip points downward:

Spoiler

Yes I know he’s smiling here which pulls his nose tip down but there aren’t too many non-blurry pics out there.

In any case, it still retains that shape when his face is relaxed. This pic is from very early 2016, I’d say.

 

2016: Right before debut, his nose straightens out. The tip is now lifted and the bridge completely straight. I personally believe he still had his maybe-original nose when they filmed the MVs for T7S and Without you, you can kinda see it in the behind the scenes. No SS though because those videos are rather low quality. The MVs were filmed in early march and he didn’t have any public appearances until their debut stage a month later. Recovering enough from a nose job to perform on stage in barely a month is possible, but I imagine it isn’t too comfortable to practice while still in recovery. I cannot detect any scars either, which might be an indicator for a closed rhinoplasty, which apparently requires less down time. I’m just speculating here though!

Spoiler

 

His face is looking incredibly skinny and long in this era:

Spoiler

Sweetie where is your jaw!

 

2017: Not much of a change tbh.

Spoiler

 

Btw his nose only looks straight in full profile, in semi profile it still looks kinda curved for whatever reason. I also think it’s around this time that his eyes start looking less wide. Whether he got the initial work corrected or just stopped making that deer-in-headlights expression I cannot say.

2018/2019: I’m putting these two years together because I don’t think there are any notable changes other than him getting really skinny towards the end of 2018 and him adopting a slightly more mature image.

Spoiler

In 2020, we actually see some changes again. Throughout the year his face fills out considerably, and starting from November/December he seems to have started dabbling in lip fillers:

Spoiler

He has much more volume in his face now! From the front it almost looks like he didn’t have a jaw shave at all. The profile still gives it away though:

 

 

Regardless, I think it looks much better than before. A bit less like something is obviously missing, despite his jawline still being very soft and connecting almost directly to his ear.

Look at is top lip here, I think that’s when he first got lip fillers (also the illusion of an intact looking jaw lol):

Spoiler

He was feeling himself throughout this IG live! His lip fillers are more obvious in motion, look how pouty he gets when he leans back and talks:

 

 

2021: No real changes I think. I cannot tell if he still gets lip fillers, sometimes it looks like it and sometimes not. I think the last time they were obvious was in march.

Spoiler

Here they look filled in, but he’s also wearing a ton of makeup so yeah.

 

From a couple days ago:

 

The increased width of his face could very well be natural and due to muscles enlarging (men’s faces often get wider as they get older and the jaw muscles become more prominent), some weight gain or with the help of fillers. It’s impossible for me to tell for sure.

 

Profile is still the same though:

 

 

And that’s it! I could post even more pics, or better yet, gifs and videos (some things are more obvious in motion) but I think you get the gist. Please let me know if there’s anything I’ve missed or that you disagree with! I only pointed out the changes I can personally see; I left out fillers and stuff because every idol gets them anyway, and other potential non-surgical procedures. He might have had more done than this, I feel like there are some changes I cannot exactly pinpoint. Some people have mentioned a potential cheekbone reduction before, but I'm not sure if I see it.

Personally, I think he looks really good right now. His initial work (jaw and eyes) was not the best, if I’m being completely honest. I feel like there was very little regard for overall facial harmony so his features appeared almost too big for his tiny face, and his face too tiny compared to his broad shoulders. Whatever touch-ups he’s had though really worked their magic. His face looks much more balanced nowadays, and really only the side profile gives away the weak jaw. I think that whatever he’s been doing lately really works for him and I hope he’s happy with the results!

 

I'm not sure yet if I will do similar posts for other NCT members, this was a lot of work and super time consuming lol.

Edited December 14, 2021 by SepiaSkies
got some ages wrong oops

[SepiaSkies]

13 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

Thank you for this! Doing a little research, you can reverse eye surgeries through reconstructive surgery for epicanthoplasty and canthoplasty (usually done if the surgery was botched or took too much away) but of course you are unlikely to get exactly the same shape back, especially with epicanthoplasty. With Doyoung though, maybe I'm a bit blind but I can't see a huge difference in the eye shape post-2017? His eyes looked big in some photos in 2016 (especially when his teasers dropped) but not when he was making a more neutral expression:

  Reveal hidden contents

Another mystery as for the cheekbones, I think his selfies where he looks really egg-shaped are suspect for editing. But sometimes he does look very smooth in the cheek area and sometimes not? I do think he gets a bit of filler in his cheeks to plump his face up a bit more. Even after 5 years, I'm still not a fan of the  jaw shave and I can never not notice how his features look too big for his face (it really disrupted his facial harmony around his mouth area), and I often wonder how it will look in his fifties. Still my favourite voice in NCT (don't ask how much I've replayed his youtube covers).

His eye shape looks largely the same to me too, but I do think people who commented on his eyes looking less open nowadays do have a point. Genuinely cannot tell if he got them fixed once more or if something else about his face changed which in turn made his eyes look more proportional to the rest of his features. Either way I think his eye shape is gorgeous and super striking.

I think I only saw a potential cheekbone reduction being mentioned like twice in the history of this thread, but I don't really see it either. Then again, cheekbone shaves tend to have rather subtle results and I'm not overly familiar with the procedure so who knows. His selfies are rather misleading in that regard, he knows his angles and almost exclusively takes selfies from an above angle and/ or lowers his chin to make his face appear even smaller and slimmer.

[SepiaSkies]

10 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

There's no way Jaehyun is 170cm like some people on this thread have concluded (also he has a really big head compared to his body so that throws proportions off).

Lol I was just about to say this, it's the big bobble head that throws people off. I guess having a small face/head really does make you look taller, just look at how many people seem to think Doyoung is taller that Jaehyun (he's not, his proportions just work in his favor).

11 hours ago, Lion king said:

She got her surgery right before debut so it could be that her surgery is coming together.  once you get plastic surgery you have to wait for at least 2 years to settle in and that can change how you look. But I have noticed she have fillers all over her face. 

Yeah I think we've discussed this before, Giselle wasn't a trainee for all that long and most likely had surgery very close to her debut. She might have had additional work done, but it's also very likely that her jaw work just finally settled and the swelling has gone down completely. This process easily takes a year or longer, even though you look fully healed on the outside.

[SepiaSkies]

7 hours ago, Zaralei said:

 

I did consider the possibility of the swelling just subsiding, but it honestly doesn't just look like her features just settling down to me? I know I mostly mentioned her jaw slimming down, but her cheekbones in particular seem more prominent and jutted out now (which, along with the swelling settling down, might give the illusion of a slimmer jaw), whereas before her face looked more flat.

I mean I could be wrong and it's just her jaw settling that could make her cheeks stand out, but I'm... not entirely convinced here's a pic comparison and it's also quite noticeable when she's in motion too so I doubt it's just editing. It might just be fillers, idk. 

Edit: Also, not sure if it's part of the settling process of her jaw but her cheeks (not cheekbones) also had a bit more fat in them before so that might be another factor again. I'm honestly confused now lol

 

1 hour ago, Zaralei said:

Glad I'm not the only one seeing it Seeing her on knowing bros genuinely shocked me since the shape of her head looks so different. I thought it might just be from her jaw slimming down but I kept looking at her photos and changed my mind (though I'm definitely open to being corrected). 

Thought she was Sana here at first glance. 

I think you guys have a point, her cheekbones really do look both higher and more defined, and not in the she-just-lost-weight way. I wonder how they achieved that, aside from fillers or cheekbone implants (which I feel are extremely rare in korean plastic surgery). It's not a bad look at all, in my opinion.

I am a bit concerned about her eyes however. I don't think they've changed since debut, but the way her makeup is done these days and those awful colored circle lenses really highlight how much they cut her inner corners, and not necessarily in a good way.

[SepiaSkies]

4 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

https://www.healthline.com/health/cosmetic-surgery/v-line-surgery

https://www.doctorxdentist.com/jaw-reduction-singapore

https://www.asiancosmeticsurgery.com/procedures/jaw-reduction/

Some resources on jaw-shaving. Patients take 2-4 days stay in the hospital, and usually are clear to return to work within 10 days, but the swelling takes about 3-5 weeks to subside fully. So roughly one month of downtime. It's important to remember that v-line surgery is quite a common procedure in Korea (v-line surgery is just jaw shaving + chin shaving, the term v-line surgery originates from Korea because it's so popular there). I don't think it's ridiculous to speculate if jaw shaves have occurred in Kpop given the popularity of the procedure in Korea (of course this does not mean that a surgery has definitely occurred). Also, the anecdote everyone uses for the quick turnaround for surgery is Jessica shaving her jaw at the height of SNSD's popularity (and honestly, some idols have walked onto red carpets with swollen double eyelids and noses...sometimes you need to get your pay check...).

Yup, jaw shaves require surprisingly little downtime. I posted some plastic surgery vlogs the other day where you could see that clinics provide facials and  massages, de-swelling injections, oxygen chambers etc. to help with the recovery. There's no way idols wouldn't make use of these services, especially when they are in a position where they can afford the best doctors and clinics. I feel like some people confuse v-line surgery with corrective jaw surgery where the jaw is cut in two pieces and pieced back together with screws and plates, or the one where the teeth need to be wired shut for a few weeks to keep the jaw in place during the healing process. Those procedures are not the same at all though, as far as I know a v-line surgery does not entail a repositioning of the jaw.

[SepiaSkies]

1 hour ago, Zaralei said:

Sorry if I sound like a dummy, but which idol or actor first comes to mind when you guys hear inner eye corner cut?

I'm watching something with Lee Joon-gi in it and I couldn't help but notice how... sharp his inner eye corners are. I'm pretty sure he still has monolids so I wondered if he just got his inner corners cut, but I kind of suck at determining how the end result of this procedure is supposed to look like. Searching on Google isn't exactly making it clear to me either so I wanted to look at another celebrity for comparison. Is it essentially the same as epicanthoplasty? 

Yes, cutting the inner eye corners is the same as an epicanthoplasty, which is just the medical term. It involves removing parts of the epicanthic fold to make the eye laterally longer and create a more open gaze. It's true milimeter work, which is why the results can be hard to spot, unless the surgeon removed too much. I have trouble with it as well, but looking at how much of the tear ducts is exposed can help.

Rather subtle examples, but if you look closely you can see that the inner eye corners have been reshaped, and especially in the first example the tear duct is much more visible than before. Both patients got double eyelid surgery as well for more natural results, but it's not always necessary:

This person still has monolids, for example. I do think it looks more natural with doube eyelids, but that's just my opinion.

Hope this helped! I feel like unless you have high quality before and after pics it can be very hard to tell if someone had an epicanthoplasty, it's in my opinion one of the hardest surgeries to spot.

[SepiaSkies]

6 hours ago, tomorrowseemssofaraway said:

Did Wonyoung get an epicanthoplasty? 

 

I don't follow Wonyoung at all so I don't really have a frame of reference, but based on these pictures alone I wouldn't say so. She's going for a sexier, heavy-lidded look in the first one so her eyes appear a little bit smaller, but imo her eye corners look the same. I'd say it's just a matter of facial expression here.

[SepiaSkies]

37 minutes ago, Eirene29 said:

It's a fact that recently some surgeons seem to give the same nose instead of studying a shape that would look good for the person specifically.

About that, I actually watched a video once of a girl who regretted getting plastic surgery in korea and she said that the doctor made her choose between a set selection of nose shapes and their respective implants instead of working out something that would suit her face specifically, like a custom implant. I'll link the video when I find it, I'm supposed to be working as I write this lol.

[SepiaSkies]

40 minutes ago, SepiaSkies said:

About that, I actually watched a video once of a girl who regretted getting plastic surgery in korea and she said that the doctor made her choose between a set selection of nose shapes and their respective implants instead of working out something that would suit her face specifically, like a custom implant. I'll link the video when I find it, I'm supposed to be working as I write this lol.

Found it!

She talks about the four different popular nose shapes she got to choose from at around 1:55. Some of those shapes might feel familiar.

At around 13:00, she talks about how the doctor chose a 3,5mm wide implant for her nose instead of the 2 - 2,5mm implant they agreed on, and that she only found out about that after surgery. She also thinks her nose is too high now and not quite the shape she wanted, but doesn't really blame the doctor (I do kind of get it, sometimes you agree on something but as the doctor works on your nose they might realize that something is different and they have to deviate from their initial plans, this can happen and you don't exacly get to wake up your patient mid-surgery to ask them if they're okay with a bigger implant.)

14:25 is also interesting, she got jaw botox as well and the doctor kind of messed up so she couldn't move the right side of her mouth area. It took three months until she could properly smile again, and honestly even in the video (which was filmed 8 months after the surgery) you can still tell that her mouth moves towards the left constantly when speaking.

Another thing I like is how towards the end she talks about not expecting too much from the suregry because you'll most likely look like the same person still. The surgeons cannot craft you a completely new face. (Some food for thought for the plastic surgery deniers - "they look essentially the same!", like yeah, ofc they do, they are the same person. Tucking in your nostrils a little and cutting you eye corners will in most cases not make you look like an entirely new person.)

[SepiaSkies]

8 hours ago, Zaralei said:

How do you guys know if a nose job is closed or open? Also, if someone did alarplasty? 

I normally check the columella of alleged nose jobs to determine whether it was open or closed, but I've seen what looks like a ring/indentation/scar at the base of the columella for some celebrities, only to check their childhood photos and see that it's always been there. Not to mention that I looked through my own pictures and saw a similar ring on my nose as well, even though I've never had surgery. I feel like it's easier to spot a scar mid-columella, but then there's also the fact that most open rhinoplasties apparently heal well in general, to the point of being virtually invisible unless the surgeon did a bad job. My question is that, should scarring really be the least of your concerns when it comes to choosing between a close and open nose job? 

Then there's alarplasty. I often check around the nasal ala and the nostrils themselves. However, again, I looked through my photos and saw a dark line on both of my nostril flaps that looked like scarring/indentation I've read in this thread that we can also check inside the nostril for a shiny line on where the incision is usually created (nasal sill), and AGAIN, I see it on my own nose. I also know a lot of people who always look red along the natural curvature and connections of their nose (alar base/side of alar base, columellar base, nasal sill, etc), myself included, so coloring is a bit tricky too.

Basically what I'm trying to get to is, can the common signs of alarplasty and/or open rhinoplasty technically be void if it has always been there in the first place (and for alarplasty, if there is no actual changes to the space of the nasal sil)? Scarring has always been something I got scared of when thinking of surgeries, but should it really not be a problem if your surgeon is good?

Additional question, if someone got a nose job to change their tip or height of the nose, can this also affect how the nostrils would look without having alarplasty? For example, if someone raised the tip, I would imagine their nostrils would look less flared out as well because of the pull. Or is this an incorrect assumption? 

You are asking all the right questions but I'm not sure if we with our limited medical knowledge can answer lol. Basically, we cannot tell for sure whether someone had an open or closed rhinoplasty. Not everyone is even eligible for closed rhinoplasties, it really depends on the patient and their individual needs and wants. Generally speaking, closed rhinoplasties are for "minor" corrections, such as a bump on the nose bridge. Other than that, I am not qualified to say what counts as a "minor" correction - it really depends on the nose itself and what the patient wants the result to look like, so as an outsider I practically have no way of knowing for sure. I know I said in my Doyoung master post that he might have gotten a closed rhinoplasty, given that he showed zero signs of scarring a mere month after I assume he had his nose done, and the fact that his downtime seems to have been relatively short. A well healed nose will show close to no signs of scarring at all, but it should take a bit more than roughly four weeks for the incision to be nearly invisible. That was mostly just me thinking out loud though, I really have no way of knowing for sure because I'm not his doctor.

Which leads us to the next point, scarring! Scars or rather what we assume to be scars are not a foolproof way to say someone had surgery at all, sadly. People have all kinds of markings and skin flabs on their nose that might look like nose job scars but actually aren't. In fact, doctors often make use of this to "hide" scars in the natural construction of the nose. Moreover, the thinner the skin, the less likely a patient is to develop visible sacrs, which also needs to be taken into account. Now if someone had wide round nostrils and suddenly they are triangular and pinched looking and you can see the characteristic alarplasty scars, then yeah, that's probably what happened. But not every surgery is glaringly obvious so most of the time we are just speculating.

Have some pictures of potential incision techniques and where scarring might be visible to get a better idea:

 

Your last point about an implant possibly affecting the nostril shape...I did some googling and honestly couldn't really find anything about it, but maybe I'm not using the right keywords. Logically, I assume it could happen, but normally an implant isn't just placed on top of an already existing nose bridge, but part of the bone and cartilage is shaved down to accommodate for the implant, so I'd say that unless the change in height is extremely dramatic, the nostrils would remain virtually unchanged. Maybe. I don't actually know lol.

While we're on the topic of nose jobs, I just skimmed over this article on capsular contracture (basically a "capsule" of scar tissue that forms when the body is fighting a foreign object inserted into it, like an implant), a common side effect in asian rhinoplasty when a silicone implant is used, and please have a look at this picture of possible complications and deviations:

It ranges from an almost natural appearance to a phenomenon called short nose deformation. We have seen noses like this in kpop. Quite a few actually. Might answer some questions lol.

Btw, this is the full article, I hope you can all access it. Warning: Figure 2 is graphic! Proceed with caution!

[SepiaSkies]

11 hours ago, Zaralei said:

Oh my gosh, thank you so much for exerting the effort to answer all of that! That actually gives a lot of insight, I'll be keeping them in mind and that nose deformation... I do feel like it's more common within idols from smaller companies. Apink's work (Namjoon most especially) sort of reminds me of that, but I don't know if it's a deformation, botched or just the look that they were going for? 

No problem lol, I actually really enjoy researching these kind of things.

Namjoo's nose seems like a sad mix of both botched work and a subsequent deformation, her nose tip ended up being visibly shorter than her collapsed nostrils:

It's just wonky all around. I haven't seen her in a while actually so I'm not sure if she got a revision or left it like this. She seems to have gotten her confidence back though, those pics when she first appeared with her collapsed nose were quite sad to see.

Another example of a short nose would be Dal Shabet's Serri:

She had a revision for sure a couple years ago, I remember there being posts about it here in this thread.

This just makes me wonder if the cut-off nosetip look we see on a lot of idols was intentional or just an unlucky side effect.

[SepiaSkies]

6 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

Now, for his jaw. Jellyfish Ent definitely photoshops the hell out of their pictures because what is this? Where did his jaw go?

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If you look at his pre-debuts, he has the same mandible angle as he does now (I saw some people in the Pann comments toss around that he shaved his jaw - which would be a useless procedure for him to do, since his "issue" was fat and not the bone structure). Did he get buccal fat removal done? I really can't say because of how much weight he lost, whether the really long and narrowness of the face is just diet + editing or a combo of procedures.

His lips look the same to me.// edit: he might have gotten his lip corners done as well! They are more upturned now.

I don't know this guy at all but judging by these pictures I think he's a very good example of how weight loss affects the shape of your face versus how a jaw shave does. He's quite obviously always had a rather oval and soft jaw, even when his bone structure was covered by fat and tissue. I'd actually argue that his face shape is essentially the same, and that the only real difference in his before and after pics is in the volume (of tissue and fat, not bone, just to be clear) of his face. This is probably redundant at this point, but you simply do not go from an angular face to a perfectly oval one just by losing weight, especially not when you were slim to begin with and coinicdentally just joined an entertainment agency , because since when is fat angualr? Bones and muscles are. I don't think anybody here needs to told this but it drives me insane how everywhere else people have no idea how faces develop and that weight loss, in fact, makes your bone structure stand out more, not hide it - an angular jaw would probably appear even more angular at a lower weight, not softer, and certainly not oval. Your overall face may appear a bit smaller due to loss of volume, but weight loss does at least in my experience not entail spontaneous bone loss.

(his lip corners are definitely more upturned. In fact, it was the first thing I noticed lol)

[SepiaSkies]

14 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

Same bone structure as pre-debut. Tbh I do wonder if he did buccal fat removal later on (or lost even more weight?), because he still has that chubby lower face. In 2021, he looked much thinner in the lower face (but definitely did not shave his jaw). It was a sexy concept and I feel like that always translates into "thinner, thinner, thinner!" for idols:

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When someone loses such a huge amount of weight it's honestly kind of impossible to tell whether they had buccal fat removal as well (it's hard enough when they didn't lose a substantial amount to begin with). Of course a doctor might have taken advantage of this to "hide" such a procedure but it's impossible for me to tell.

Looking at those pictures, he seems to have gotten chin fillers as well.

14 hours ago, elseelseelse2 said:

He actually looks like Doyoung, but Doyoung if you'd only seen him once and tried to rebuild him

This made me snort lol