blackberry2000

WOW!! This choreo looks SUPER hard! I was expecting it very much to be very hard-hitting and edgy, but not quite to this degree. It's such a small snippet, but still - the feeling 17 gives off is completely different then anything I've seen them do in the past. Even their more "hardcore" tracks like ROCK and JAM JAM, feel different to this - it's playful but not childish, youthful but not naive, and very charismatic overall ----- and this is just from some ten second clip! Now I really can't wait to see the whole thing. Definitely liking the sound already. And can I say once again HOW glad I am that they included these guitar riffs? Because I am - very much. (Hoshi is absolutely killing his part)

Pretty cool. I was hoping that the guitars placed throughout the "dark" photoshoot were an indicator for a more "rock-esque vibe", though with k-pop, you can never count on these things to happen anymore. So, beyond all, I am pleasantly surprised to find that we've finally gotten some teasers that were relevant to the actual title track. That said, I really like what I'm hearing so far. The four tracks we've heard so far neatly fall into place with the rest of the album, when played in chronological order. I really like this overall "WHOLENESS" so far. But with the exception of three or four songs, the overall feeling this time seems to be rougher around the edges - it definitely feels a lot more mature too. And yet, at the same time, I notice that there is more of the "old" 17 present. Especially for the title track, one can hear traces of "Boom Boom" and the likes. And I like it ----- "Don't wanna cry" was my favourite title track so far, but I have a feeling that "CLAP" just might change that. I honestly can't wait to see what the choreo will be like for it as well!! Can't wait for monday.

There is no denying that 17 are are going through a definite "changing and adjusting" period - which, especially given their age and active years, I must applaud a great deal. More than anything, I am glad and reassured, that they did not stop to raise the bar with Al1, but actually take it to a whole new level with this come back. ________________________________________________________ As for the come-back ------I must say, that I am very pleased with how thins are going so far. In my book, there is not a lot I can really hold against them - actually, there is nothing at all. The decisions to release, not one, but four MV's in such a short period of time is golden, if you ask me. Not only does it allow each member to shine individually, but it also increases the chance of non-fans and casual listeners to stumble upon one of the numerous releases, in their Youtube session, or be lead to it through the recommendation mode. I think so too, but then again, I am also not overly surprised by this development, since 17 are clearly aiming for a newer, and in essence, more western style - which largely explains the international success. But it's truly not the only reason for their newfound popularity In Europe and the US. They have done a complete 180, both, musically and visually. They look and sound fresher - and more mature. By now, all of them have grown up. They have become very distinctive and far more interesting. Their MV's are much flashier and way more expensive, as well as their clothes and overall style. In addition to that, they are also using media platforms in a very clever way, especially with the amount of video content, that makes it easy to actually get to know them, like the "Going 17" documentary. PLEDIS is doing a very good job in promoting them, even though I believe that the majority of this hard work will take until next year to fully pay off. There are plenty of silent "followers" and casuals who appear to have taken an interest in them, and I believe, it is only a matter of time, before a lot of them are going to fully "commit" sometime in the near future. As for their domestic fans - one has to take into account the very different points int heir career during that gain. It is much easier to gain such large numbers earlier in their career, and more logical. The jump from some 60.000 to 400.000 fans may seem more impressive at first sight, but it generally gets a lot harder after that point to gain more fans - not only for 17, but any other idol band out there. It's a great number to begin with, and the fact that 17 managed to get there, with such "ease" in comparison, and in such a relatively short amount of time, speaks is impressive, to say the least.

If you'd told me a year ago, that I would be here right now, complimenting Beast/Highlight of all bands, I would have laughed in your face. I stumbled upon "Calling you", by accident, and when I finally realized just who it was I was listening to so contently, I couldn't believe my own eyes.. Of course knew about BEAST - I was around when they just debuted, but this has been a long while, and I found, that the initial expectations I had in them, were not met - much to my dissappointment - which is the reason I stopped listening to any material from them altogether. But, dang it ------------- did things change! They have now indeed become the band I was hoping for - and much more. The jump in quality is truly amazing. I wouldn't have believed it was even possible for a band, who was formed some seven years ago, to finally "get" to their sound, this late in their career. Both "Calling you" and now "Celebrate" are absolutely brilliant pieces of pop music, in every sense, way and aspect. I know that BB are still hard to reach by any kpop act really, but, by this point, I must say, that I find HIGHLIGHT to be the first ever "idol" band to truly break away from that label, in every sense possible. I hope they keep releasing these albums at this rate, as one turns out better than the last.

Hehehehehe - well, to tell you the truth, there was indeed a JH paragraph as well, but I decided to take it out the very last second. Though I might just go back and edit my post later on.(edit - or down below) I think anyone who even knows me a little bit from this forum, will know, that I am the type of person to give critique, where I feel critique is due. You also know that some people on this forum are very quick to throw terms like "hater" and "troll", whenever others (and it seems, me in particular) comment on some of the members weaknesses and flaws. They are very quick to label any critique as negative, and assume an immediate attack on the person as a whole, rather than separate between the two. So, this is the first I ask of anyone reading overt these words, bear in mind --- critique does not equal hate/negativity. As for Jeonghan's part specifically - well - there is really nothing much to say. I wish there was something positive I could point out, but there simply isn't. He is the weak part of the track, without a doubt. He seems a little better during the later parts when the song requires him to use a lower tone of voice, but even then, it is hardly an improvement. He has a veeeeery deep voice naturally, which you can actually hear in some of the behind scene - interviews, and yet, for whatever reason, he still uses a pitch that is too high for him to ever reach in a natural way. If you listen to the released tracks of the vocal unit for this year, you can hear that he tends to "whisper" his parts, rather than sing them. PINWHEEL is a very good example of this, as JH starts the song that way, with Seungkwan coming right after him, and using the same high pitch and soft tone of voice - only with a very different result. Do you notice the difference? I think it is very obvious. In contrast to JH, Seungkwan is truly singing it. Of course, Sk is a power-horse, who has reached a vocal maturity far beyond his years, and putting JH against him may be a bit unfair, but even Woozi, who is closer to Jeonghan's skill level manages this better in his high parts. Jeonghan has great potential - but it can only be reached if he/the vocal coaches finally start to treat him as a "deep" voice he is, rather than force him into an unnatural high register, he clearly struggles with, and has been for some time. (In that department, he reminds me of bts's V, who struggled with the same issue for a long while, having to force a much higher pitch than natural for him) It is very hard to focus on actually improving your technique, when you are constantly forcing your voice to do things it's not supposed to. Just listen to vocal units acoustic version of "Adore U" to get an idea what he is capable to do with his voice when the confidence is there - it is the most natural I have found Jeonghan to sound in all of these years, and his voice sounds really good in it. He has a very distinctive raspy, even buzzing quality to his tone, almost like there is some sort of electricity running through his throat - and that's what I like. He seemed so relaxed and confident during that whole segment, and I really wished he would have taken it from there. I'll be the first to compliment him when these improvements come, and hopefully, it won't be much longer, until he is finally confident enough to use his natural deep voice (and it can only be a matter of confidence, rather than technique, as one can clearly see with Mingyu, Hoshi or Dino, who have all come through as very capable vocalists in their own right. I really don't know what Jh is afraid of, the potential is clearly there) - it would definitely be a good contrast to 17's usual style. ____________________________________________________ EDIT 2: I truly appreciate the kind reaction, and I can honestly say that I take every single one of the 6 UPVOTES (so far) to heart. ________________________________________________________________ Jeonghan's part starts right at the 2:00 mark.

Just listened to PINWHEEL ---- and, just like a lot of you, I too am not a fan of ballads, however, I find this track not to be overly "ballady" despite the clear direction in that genre. The piano adds a nice touch of tempo, and coupled with the steady beat, PINWEEL comes across as much faster paced than it first leads on. That being said, I must say that DK absolutely steals the spotlight here! This song is a match made in heaven or him, and, if you ask me, I would have preferred it to be sung by DK alone! It was always a very tight match between him and Seungkwan, for me - but over the course of this past year, I believe he found the perfect balance between power and restrain. And in PINWHEEL, I find his restrain to be even more noteworthy. I prefer his slight rawness and edge when needed - but the difference between and him and Seungkwan is really a minimal one, and truly comes down to preference. Woozi - though not on their level - really won me over here as well. I think, what I like about him, is that he really tries to do a lot, with what he has. Obviously, he still has a long way to go when it comes to sheer vocal technique and ability, but he has great potential. He still seems be searching for a "voice" of his own, imo, but it wouldn't surprise me, if the biggest jump in skill level from this album to their next wouldn't come from Woozi himself. Seungkwan is always good. He really is. The boy knows his stuff, and it shows. He can do his high notes just as well as the super lows - and he does all of it with perfect emotion. Technique-wise he beats DK by 2%, but, like I said, with the two of them, it simply comes down to preference. I really like his short pre-chorus part. Joshua is good, but I would have liked to hear even more from him. He has a somewhat "cold" voice, and I am still waiting for that one song that will finally allow him to really show what he is capable of ---- because there is A LOT to be shown! Josh is in a hard position, not only because 17 is a group that consists of so many members, and two of them happen to be SK and DK (which would make it hard for any singer to compete against but also, because now more and more of the previous rappers have begun to make the switch to vocalist as well - which will make it even harder for him to come through. I've heard Joshua's cover songs, that you can find all over youtube, and I've also heard his many rearranged acappella versions - and, in case you didn't know, he is a truly skilled singer. Not merely mediocre, but skilled, and with a veeeeery distinctive note. Hopefully, the new album will have many more features for him. MV-wise, I must say that I enjoyed Woozis shots the most. I don't really know what it is about him, but when you see him appear on the screen for this long, you can't help but root for the small man. Sure, he is generally reduced to this "cute" guy with a young face, but personally, I have never perceieved Woozi that way. His seriousness comes through at all times, and he earned my respect with his down to earth and authentic way. I never get the feeling that the Woozi we see on camera is any different than the one we would meet in private. The cinematography was good - nothing too special, though it definitely had some well executed shots. However, I found the second half of the MV to really shine. The end contained some truly gripping and melancholic shots, that went perfectly with the melody and chorus. Overall, it was a solid MV - more importantly, a mature MV. The most mature one for 17 so far, I believe - and it definitely only further goes to demonstrate their willingness to be seen as a serious act, not to be overlooked.

Do you people know if he is going to drop an album medley, like he did for his last album? Also - I forgot to mention this last time ----- really nice to see Koharu being involved in this one! Taemin and her seem like a match made in heaven. But for this comeback, I really hope for a more "powerful", hard hitting choreo, like the ones I have watched from her on Urban Youtube, since I am really not a fan of the slow, contemporary dance type of choreo that Taemin used for his japanese MV. From the snippets released so far, I think the chances of it happening are veeery high though. I'd really like to see Taemin go all out, and shred this choreo!

WOW - Wow, wow, wow, wooooo -(let me make use of the size option for once!) I really don't know where to start, so I will just blurt out whatever thought comes to my mind first, without much regard to a particular order. Taemin has always been a favourite of mine. He is one of those quite, under the radar sort of persons, and very little about him actually screams celebrity. There is nothing too flashy about him. He appears to be a very nice and humble human being, and he also seems to be much more comfortable off cam than infront of it. I like how he has never much cared for being this big "popular" TV personality. When you watch him on TV, he comse across, more like a shy kid with no idea what to do with himself rather than this big pop-idol, who has been in this for some ten years. You can really tell he doesn't much care for being famous for who he is but rather, for what he does - and I like that. However ------- all of that changes once he hits the stage. Because stage Taemin is a beast - he is a whole different person. I think, even the most critical person will admit, that in terms of sheer dancing ability and technique, there are very few who reach his level. However, it is the work he has put in in the other fields that really shows his hunger to be more than just another idol. Over the years he improved both, his stage presence and his voice, by leaps and bounds. --- and it shows. When you watch him perform live, there is not a moment to catch him slacking off. He treats every concert as if it were the most important one - be it the first or the 100 stage, Taemin's focus is always on point. "ACE" was a good start for him, but he truly won me over with "Press it" - so it was a bit disappointing to see that it was, imo, overlooked by the public - but then again, that's show business for you, and managing it is just as much a part of the job, whether you want to admit it or not. However, I am confident that this time around Taemin will get that recognition. SM did their homework - hes appeared on many programs, and hopefully, this will give him the needed push necessary to get his name out there. Not only because he deserves it (which is easy to say) but because he actually CREATES good quality music, worthy of recognition. I want to listen to this right now, rather than Monday, because - dang - the wait is gonna be a hard one. But absolutely worth it. It really was about time! Peace ;T

The sort of simple style/clothes, I would have preferred for performance units "Lilili". I think I must have listened to it seventeen times this past hour - it's really a grower, and a great song to pump you up in the morning. @lighterxx __________________________________________________________________ Also - I wonder if Woozi (and Bumzu) is the producer for the released tracks so far.

Naaaa - I'm not bothered. I'm not the type of person to blow up over something on the internet, but the inability of some to be grow-up enough and respect others startles me from time to time. It would be different if they simply pm'd me privately, instead of going around and making me out to be this "troll" for all the world to see, and trying to convert people to stay away from me. But thanks for the nice words. Thing is - I really can't wait for Monday to come. "New Seventeen" has me all worked up, I have to give them that. I've said it before, but their previous success with Al1 boosted their confidence (it seems) tenfold --- so far all of the three released tracks blew my mind, both, musically and visually. What I'm interested in would be what genre they are going for with the title track this time around. I remember reading somewhere how Woozi said it wouldn't be EDM, because so far almost all three of the new tracks fall in that category. On top of the monday release, I also just learned that Tae-min is having his cb on the same day. And, I gotta tell you....I like where this boy is heading musically. IMO, his last album did not get half the attention it deserved.

I am the person who apparently "started" this small ruckus. And it's as silly now, as it was months before. Aha ------ "not innocent" ----------------- since when did this become a matter of me being some sort of offender? The nerve you have. You want to talk about all the previous times, you and your little circle jumped at me, again and again, with multiple insults, disrespecting and discrediting me? And also trying to ruin my reputation? Or your post yesterday, where you tell me to "shove it someplace not so nice"? Is this the innocent you are talking about? Because I say things you don't like, I am a troll? That is some nice logic you have there. What about the others here, who have posted the same thing? Do you tell them the same? The funny thing is, for all the negativity you guys accuse me of, it was always me who was open to further elaborate. I have always discussed matters, but all you ever did, was to jump right at me - and it has been like that in the past too, when there were other users ( and many of them) coming to my "defense". The aggressor in every scenario so far is you guys. And what exactly is insulting when I say that Hoshi and Dino sing better than JH? That I want to hear. Is it also insulting then when I say that Seungkwan is a better singer than DK? Hoshi, Dino, and Minguy all started out being rappers, now all three sing as well - this is why I mentioned them specifically. Yes, I do/did post in the Jeongcheol thread, and I have written lenghty theories, - but none of them are homophobic in any way whatsoever. Again, you don't have to like what I have to say, btu tel me agaon, how this is being homophobic? You do know what that word means, right? That these people STILL seem to hold so much anger against me, is honestly, just as buflling to me, as to you all - and to think, that this "little" comment I made provoked them the way it did ----- it tells you all you need to know about these people, not what they want you to believe about me. Because, apparently, they are waiting for every little sentence I post, search for "the negativity" in it, and jump at me. According to them, I write to provoke or to troll - what nerve these people have. How idiotic can you get? Very original. And yet you call me a troll and hater? (take your bible and pick a passage, then read it. Contemplate, and re-read it once more. It definitely made me a better person.) Are you honestly just sitting around all week, waiting for any comment I make, so you can pick some part you consider right and insult me? So, because you say so it has to be true? And the other posters who have been at concerts too and describe him as weak are wrong? Your word is worth more than theirs? I don't know what majority you , and others are talking about, because every account I read, people always mention that JH is a weak singer. When I do the same, I am automatically called a hater? But of course, somehow your "facts" are more true than anybody else's, correct? You know - you can say this as many times as you want, but it does not make it any more true. I am not pretending anything here. I DO NOT have a bias. I like certain members more, or find them more funny, but it's not like I stalk them all the time. The member who got me into 17 and who I found the most interesting was indeed Jeonghan.(interesting, not lovable - do you notice the difference?) Is there some law that forbids me to post even the slithest thing I don't like about him? No. Just because it irritates you, does not not make it ok for you to vent your anger, and hide it under the pretense of "justice". And the bashing thread is called so for a reason. If it angers you so much don't look. Just because there are some traits about the members I don't exactly like, does not mean that I hate them, you know? Disliking one trait does not mean that I dislike the whole person. ____________________________________________________________________ As the saying goes, actions speak louder than words.(well, okay, this is not as earth shattering as anything Trump says, but still - even I value my internet dignity) You've heard their version, but don't expect me to sit back and do nothing, and to tolerate this assault at my reputation without at least getting my butt in the seat and trying to defend myself just a little. Everybody else - now that I've added my two cents, by all means - make up your own mind (if you have absolutely nothing more exciting to do). The history in my profile is there for all to see. I have nothing to hide. I am a nice person, this much I can attest. ___________________________________________________________________ Last edit - Some of you split things here into "negative and positive". You are automatically being negative when you dare to mention "x" not being the best singer/dancer/performer, ect. And saying anything "negative" is automatically perceived as bashing, when to me, it is just as much up for discussion as everything else. Nobody is perfect, and singers do have flaws or fields they are not as skilled in as others (or still need to work on), but just because people bring those points up as well, does not mean we want to take away from their other accomplishments. Why is it that some people automatically assume I hate a singer or want to humliate them, just because I mention their lack of skill in a certain field? One has nothing to do with the other. Also, where do some here get the notion that just because you do not exactly like every single trait/thing/choice about a person you automatically dislike everything else about them?

For me it would be as followed - CHANGE UP -------------->>>>>>>> LILILI > TRAUMA "Change UP" is jsut such a superb track. I find, it hits the perfect spot of being funky and yet not too outdated, even though the style falls somewhere in between late 80's and 90's, music-wise. Among the three releases so far, I find it to be the most "seventeen-esque" like, and it also feels like a natural extension of "Change UP" (which, if you know me at all, is my ultimate song of 2016). Even thought there is little diversity in the melody, and the chorus only consists of two words (Change up), I find myself ot getting bored in the slightest. "Change Up" really hits all the right spots for me, and serves as my morning mood-maker song. Just listening to it manages to get me from zero to 100 real quick! I can say, without overexagerrating, that this song and me are a match made in heaven.(And I'm hoping for many more just like it in the future!) "Trauma" came as somewhat of a surprise to me. It's not a sound I expected 17 could ever pull of, to tell you the truth - not at this early stage in their careers (and with their age either). It sounds like something you would expect from more well-known, more public-oriented older singers - maybe even something you would expect from Crush or John Park. Mingyus part is the highlight of this track, and literally swept me off my feet. I simply never expected him to sound the way he did here. The sheer raw emotion he manged to convey with his singing gave me chills from beginning to end. The song has potential, but lacks that extra something to make it really stand out to me. IMO, only Scoups part matched the mood of song. I found Vernon and the others oddly mis-matched. "Lilili" is another odd choice, and again, a surprise I did not really expect 17 to pull of just yet. They are clearly in some sort of testing phase right now, and this track just further proves it. Sound--wise, it is the most "daring" out of the three releases so far, and I am glad they decided to give it a go. It's certainly a risky move, and, coming from a lesser known group probably wouldn't have been the "right" release. I love the beat to this, with the experimental dark "noise" coming through every once in a while. The vocals are clearly second rank in the song, but that's ok, this one really feels like it was made up with the intention of being performed. It has the overall strong feel of a song you would use for choreo in the studio. Interesting progression too, which is, why I can also see how this one would probably be the most "hit or miss" for fans. As for the release of vocal team....hmm, at this point, I honestly don't have even the slightest of ideas. I would prefer something fast-paced, since that's what I'm in the mood for right now. The other thing I'd really wish for is for Jeonghan to use his natural low pitch while singing. The way he keeps going at it until now cannot be good for his throat, and it's definitely not good for his vocals either. At this point, he has seriously become the weakest in terms in singing, with Mingyu, Hoshi and even Dino overtaking him easily. He really needs to work on his technique from the very basics on. Honestly though - so far, I am REALLY enjoying what we're getting. I'm glad 17 are not afraid to take a risk, and the excitement for the next monday to come just keeps on building up.

After this "look" I am convinced you would make it three times better. Let me pay your check - it's time to use all that hard earned money for something good in this world. (bleaching their faces in photos is bad enough, and now with this --- nahh, thanks, but no thanks. The decision to paint all over their faces liek this really does not sit well with me.)

Yup, yup - I'm a fan of simple MV's. Th camerawork was really well executed and added the extra depth. I just wonder if they were nervous shooting in front of so many people watching them. But who knows, they probably managed to get it all done in three shots, given korean work ethic ( I know they do not like to waste any time when the first shot already has teh job done.)

Watched it again ---- and I must say, simple clothing (pair of jeans and a white shirt) would have worked so much better. Also, the white faces look absolutely terrible. They irritate me more the more often I watch it. I also noticed something - the song kinda reminds me of Teamins "Drip Drop". It has the same vibe and all.

I have to say, they went a little overboard with the styling, and the super white powdered faces were a particularly bad choice. IMO, it distracted too much throughout the video. I definitely would have preferred a simpler approach, but none the less, I'm reeeeally loving this new sound. The use of the guitar bits surprised me, but they made perfect use of it. Of course the choreo is super - I don't think there is any need for me to point this out. The setting was a nice surprise as well, as I was expecting 17 to follow up with the "box MV" style the other two units used as well. I wonder how hard it was for them to get the spot free of bystanders - good choice though. It's also really nice to see that Minghao and Jun are given more time to shine this time around. Watching again!

By all means, they seem to be doing just fine. They achieved a lot during their three + years, not only musically but in terms of popularity as well. So far, each come back has managed to to bring in even greater numbers than the one before. Considering that they are still at the very beginning of their career, they are honestly doing very well. Sure, it's would be nice if they became bigger and more successful, but you can simply never be sure what the future holds, especially when it comes to something as fickle as showbusiness. Personally, I am in this, because I enjoy the music, and not to to treat every come back as some sort of political party effort, I have to participate in. Just because I not commit myself to them in every sort of way, does not make me like them any less either. Not everyone is in this as this "ultimate superfan", and that is nothing to feel bad about--- and to be honest, I have much better things to do with my time, than putting their songs and Mv's on a loop for days on various devices, or spending 300 Euros on four versions of the same album. You seem to take this way too seriously, which no one can forbid you --- but do not expect everybody else to feel the same way, or try to talk them into feeling bad for not being as "invested" as you are. For most of us, kpop is fun, and relaxing, and bringing the stats and numbers in all the time, especially this close before a comeback is really not the best way to create excitement.

Yes, I agree, she is definitely genuine when it comes to her reactions. Since I am literally the only person in my circle of friends who listens to kpop, there's really no one to talk about it all that much. It doesn't stop me from doing so either way ;T and bombarding them with songs, whenever the chance arises, but alas, it's not the same as actually having someone be somewhat "passionate" about it. I guess this is also the reason I enjoy some of these reactions from time to time. With kpop becoming more known and a good way for ANY youtuber out there to gain lots of views in a short amount of time, it was only a matter of time before the fake reactors started to jump this bandwagon too. IMO, you can tell right away if someone is faking it or not. These are some I enjoy the most, and they also happen to be very funny, and will definitely manage to cheer you up, no matter what. Five them a try if you want - Very loud and enthusiastic fanboys. They are not afraid to show their love either! These lovely girls are among the BIGGEST 17 fans you'll meet, and once the MV starts, they go absolutely bonkers. (Ps@stanSEVENTEEN --- what I am listening to this very moment. I thought I should share it too, since this is the type of sound I REALLY enjoy these days.)

I have to admit, these days it's really easy to be a 17 fan. Al1 already had me pretty excited, but this new one is taking things to the next level. The overall vibe is so much more mature, and experimental, and truly reeks of confidence, also, giving each of the boys their time to shine might just be the best decision PLedis has ever made. Not to mention that everything just seems to get bigger and more sophisticated. You can definitely how much money is being invested these past few months, with such stylish MV's to show off. Can't wait. Here's a reaction for "Trauma", which I really enjoy. She is a super 17 fan and one of the most genuine around.

I can definitely understand where you are coming from. Al1 already managed to alianate a lot of fans with how different it sounded, and, so far, it seems that this new album is going to be even more of a shocker stylistically. Especially if you take into consideration how particular 17's initial sound was to begin with. The funk and playfulness was definitely a BIG factor in what made them so appealing, and it was unlike anything heard in kpop before. People were stanning them for exactly THAT sound. In comparison their newer albums come across as much more "modern" and lean towards EDM/urban hip-hop, which just so happens to piss a lot of people off too. Personally, I consider it the right step to take, despite the risk of losing some fans in the process. The boys have shown a great interest in the so called "trend" music, and their newest releases show this once again. They seem much more relaxed, and content than I have ever seen them before, and you can actually tell how much they enjoy being able to to pursue the type of music they really want to. Just think about how few artists are given this chance to begin with? It definitely paid off for them, and, as it seems, the success that has come from Al1 only made them even more confident in their willingness to take more risks. Don't feel bad if you don't enjoy this as much as their other albums, there really is no use in forcing yourself to enjoy something. There's 13 of them, and they seem to be in an exceptional creative mood, so I would expect the output these coming months to be huge. I bet you'll still end up enjoying one of those coming tracks (units? or even solos?)

Definitely the 17 I was hoping for - only they seem to be coming much quicker than expected. The jump in both, music and concept is HUGE - and this despite Al1 already being a definite "breakthrough" on it's own. I'm really loving how unabashed the boys are tackling this. They've definitely grown up, and it shows - "OLD" 17 is now 100 percent a thing of the past. Now I truly can't wait for next sunday to come!

WHAAAAAAA---------AAAAT is this? Hold up, hold up, hold up! I had to stop the MV to come over here and de-stress, before I continue. This is absolutely not what I expected 17 to do - ever. And since when did Mingyu sound like that? Because, damn, he got some serious skill going on vocally. I honestly never expected him to sound this soulful and raw,but it seems like a perfect fit for his voice. Tell you the truth, I've always preferred his rapping to anybody elses in the group, because of how unusual and natural his flow is, but who knew what was hiding beneath? And whoever directed this Mv ---- A++++ Simple, efficient, clever and fresh, moody and stylish - just the way I like it. This is taking the "box" formula to another level. This is a box MV done right. Let me get back now - Ok ------ just paused it again at the 2 minute mark, but I just had to. Seriously, Mingyus voice is giving me actual chills right now. At the risk of coming off as overly enthusiastic right now, but he sounds so gooood singing in this way. 17 truly is full of skills. I mean, sure, Seungkwana and DK are the powervocals, no denying that; they sound good and have technique, and the emotion to go along with --- but damn --- Mingyu's definitely got the soul! The other thing I need to mention here before I forget it - I really like this whole split unit-MV concept. Just the fact that there are only a handful of them in the MV does wonders to add more depth to each member. There's enough opportunity to shine without taking any of that spotlight from somebody else. I honestly feel as though I am seeing them for the first time. Really ell done. The song itself is veeeery mature, and it excites me more than anything else, that 17 seem to be taking HUGE steps forward with this one. I mean, Al1 already calmed my worries when it came to them widening their horizon - but with this comeback they seem very intent to blow up completely.

Also, I topped the thread about two times this week or so, and yet, when I came back hours later, I found my post to be pushed down somewhere to the middle - is there a reason for that? On another note, this thread seems to be moving reeeeeally slowly these past weeks. With the announcement of the come back, I was expecting it to explode with traffic, but so far - nothing. I mean, sure, this is just a thread, and I myself am not the greatest internet person, but it did surprise me. Tell you the truth, I actually prefer this to the constant chatter and one liners.

I know this wasn't technically the hip-hop units track, but you have to admit, "Change Up" easily falls in line with previous Hip-hop oriented releases like "Check In", so it only makes sense to consider it from that point of view. 17's Hip-hop line is highly developed and already shows a distinctive colour of it's own, totally independent from 17 usual sound. I'm glad they've decided to stick to it with the necessary dedication, instead of treating it like just another side project. You can tell how serious they are about it. If done right, the hip-hop unit can grow into a fixed unity on it's own. "Change Up" is definitely aimed at the "casuals", as there is a very public-friendly vibe to it, and even the MV seems to be somewhat calculated in that direction. It's the right step for 17 to take, and I am beyond glad, they continue to broaden their horizon, instead of playing it safe, and throwing out the same song, only in a different package year after year. Al1 was a big jump, both in quality and maturity, and so far it appears that this new alum will shape up to be even better. Because I topped -

Really liking the strategy for this come back so far. If 17 truly end up releasing three more videos, that will make five altogether, once the actual title track is out. Which is quite an impressive number for any comeback - and I think it's the right approach this time around. Not only are 17 keeping things fresh and being creative by being a little different, but, imo, it's also a really good way to promote such a large group and helps to make it easier for new fans or casual listeners to grow a bit more familiar with all 13 of them. Plus, it's really the best way to let each of the members shine individually, and get some of that screen-time all for themselves. "Change Up" is just such an addictive and chill song, and even though I must have listened to it 100x times by now, for some reason - it just keeps getting better and better. It's such a simple, yet highly effective composition, and really assured me that Woozi/17 are heading in the right direction.