joonsoulie

I wish I could react to this more than once and give you a thousand hearts, because this is exactly it. There's this really toxic perception that women and especially wlw who stan boy groups or even just male artists must only be doing so because they actually want to bang them (like, I've seen arguments that x person CAN'T be a lesbian because they stan BTS, what???) - this is not only lesbophobic but misogynistic as it perpetuates the idea that women are shallow and don't have the ability to enjoy something without desiring ~romance~ or male validation. I'm so sick of it

I truly can't speak to your personal experience but... is the degree of fanservice really that bad? I mean if you look at jpop or jrock stars they're fully making out on stage with a wife and kids at home - that's gross to me and I can definitely see how that would be difficult to explain. But kpop groups (at least BTS, and boy groups in general) don't seem to go that far, the most "homoerotic" thing they've done on stage I could name would be Jimin sitting on JK's lap for about five seconds or any of the boys slapping each other on the ass, which straight guys do all the time. I don't particularly like fanservice either but I think a lot what's interpreted as ship-baiting is due to fans making mountains out of molehills. Like the lap-sitting and lustful gazes are surely to titillate the fans, but shippers take that as proof they're actually dating which is ridiculous. This may seem hypocritical since I called out the ear nibble a couple posts ago, but my problem there is moreso with Big Hit using it to sell their dvds. The boys don't have control over individual marketing but they do have control over their own actions, so I think if any of these ships didn't want to do fanservice they wouldn't.

I have no dog in the "who's the closest" fight but this is what I remember off the top of my head from 2020 (in 2018 there was a Dispatch shoot subunit as well) Season's Greetings 2020 https://youtu.be/tf6_v0iJ600 Unit shoot at the Connect BTS exhibit in NYC https://youtu.be/lMmd4Fc6HFA Unit shoot for MOTS 7 I agree that it wasn't fair for them to have to make filmed content on vacation but you kind of just sound like a hater

This is as explicit as they've been and I'm guessing as explicit as they're allowed to be. There was briefly a time when KISS FM was raffling off tickets to a video call and many fans were hoping someone would be able to tell them how much they mean to LGBT fans. One of the winners said that she would but then said she forgot

The only thing I'll say abt the karaoke vid (since that was my last post) is that the puffing noises were Namjoon making sound effects into the mic. This is interesting to me because Jihopekook are clearly presented as a unit in a lot of official content. While I definitely agree they're some of the closest in the group, there's speculation that when the older members start enlisting those three will be promoted as a unit, which makes sense considering you have the three best dancers, the main and lead vocalist, and a rapper. Jimin and Taehyung seem just as close as ever, and I think people misinterpret Tae becoming more introverted as him pulling away from the members. It seems more like he's just sick of the idol life in the spotlight. And have you heard him talk about Jimin in his recent vlives? "How could I ever have fought with this angel"? Yeah I'd say they're still close, same thing with Jimin towards him. About Jin and Jimin under spoiler bc Hot Takes incoming:

Omg wait because this.... didn't actually occur to me I guess I did have my shipper goggles on a bit too tight because that makes a lot more sense... still not sure why the video would be cropped but maybe it looked like something it wasn't? Or maybe I'm overthinking it and JK was making a goofy face in the bg or something. ----------------------------- Also I do want to clarify that I DO NOT THINK THEY ARE DATING it was just a cute moment I hadn't seen discussed before!

Namjoon has been making sus comments about Jimin almost since debut, but then again the members (and all kpop boys I guess) are quick to compliment each other and since everyone is convinced he's straight because he's expressed attraction to women it gets overlooked. I could wax rhapsodical about their bond and the unique relationship they have with each other (not romantic) but that's a subject for another thread. Anyway, the moment to which I was referring was this from the 2020 Festa karaoke video where Namjin + Jimin are singing Euphoria (and it could easily be platonic): But maybe I am simply delulu and making a big deal out of nothing, as is always possible Edit: I realized I never posted a link to the actual video, around 20:45

OOF okay nevermind then As your resident Minjooner I have to address this lol - it seems like Namjoon tends to give Jimin rings for his birthday (which makes sense considering how many he wears). There's this also: https://twitter.com/uminimoni/status/1347663939073679360?s=19 The first and last pics are from a tweet Joon made a day before Jimin's bday a couple years ago.

I admittedly know nothing about Bogum or his relationship with Tae beyond what I've read in this thread but... if he truly is in a CULT I guess I don't think it's impossible for him to be gay and very very deep in the closet while still being a member. I mean the whole thing with cults is indoctrinating people so that they feel they can't leave, or maybe they even have some incriminating information on him and he's being manipulated into staying a member. Or maybe he is just bonkers and he's a true believer I'm just glad Tae is no longer involved with him if that's the case

Which is interesting since they're the cuddliest members towards the others, haha. Unless you mean no one coddles them? Yeah, people always refer to Jimin like he's one of the babies but he's definitely one of the most emotionally mature members. Namjoon at least has said as much and how he relates to him moreso as a same-age friend or even a hyung than someone younger, and I believe the others have made similar statements as well. And Hoseok is more like a second leader and is always referred to as the most professional. I had forgotten, thanks!

Where did we find out Taekook were together when Tae/the two of them got that message from Yoongi? I agree that Yoongi seems especially soft for the youngest two, in whatever capacity you interpret that. I've seen many a Taekooker use that text to argue that Yoongi was sending them a message of support for their relationship which... could be true? But since it was the beginning of 2018, when they were seriously contemplating disbanding, I assumed it was a message to the effect of "this isn't your fault/i will support you no matter what/i love you" etc. since it seems like the talks of the group breaking up hurt them the most.

.

I think intent is important and your intentions seem to be good. You're not like, trying to out them or anything, just sharing your observations. If you were to start arguing with people about whether they are real or not then yes that would be too far, but harmless speculation is what this whole thread is about

Omfg the "supporter" thing gets on my nerves!! The way shippers (esp straight women) are like "I'm a REAL fan because I know my boys are in a relationship and I love them enough to see it and I'll support their love, you all aren't as good of fans as I am because you're blind to their romance " and think it's peak activism...... Larries reincarnated I mean I sort of have a 'ship' too but it's more like "they would make a cute couple" than "they are actually for real dating and i know this for a fact"

@OptimusPremier no please share! Who cares if other Tae shippers don't like it? Delulus are annoying but they only really bother me when they attack other people for not believing their ship, which is not what you're doing. I'm very curious especially since those are the two members with the most receipts of being mlm

See I'm more willing to believe in Taehyung x Yoongi or another "rarepair" (although I don't know if they're all that rare?) than the big ships like Jikook or Taekook because they're just..... so obvious. Like I've seen arguments that they're 'hiding in plain sight' and are safe to always be assumed brothers (which I guess I'm proving right now...) but would companies REALLY take that risk by letting the couple be all over each other? Idk Case in point: I've seen the exact same argument for Jimin and JK since they always ride in the same car lol

Nah I was referring to when someone said Jimin never made any statements about or defied gender roles and when I linked receipts I got negged. I'm not targeting you specifically just making a general statement, that's why I didn't want to quote you

.

I don't agree with those standards either, what I am trying to say is that those who are not as foreward thinking as us perceive him that way. It goes beyond just his physical appearance; it's his demeanor, performance, way of speaking, etc. We do agree on what constitues his androgyny.

What I don't understand whenever this conversation regarding androgyny/what features are considered feminine comes up is why we pretend like gender roles and stereotypes of presentation don't exist... I know everyone in this thread is Woke AF but the rest of the world just has not caught up. If we are to abolish these stereotypes and preconceived notions of gender we need to acknowledge what they are, rather than disregard them. I'm not saying all or most straight men like Jimin because they're attracted to him or think he's a girl, but if you've ever watched those "Jimin Effect" compilations many many men DO comment on how pretty he is, some saying moreso than any other man they've seen. Not just youtube reactors looking for clicks but security guards and people who have interacted with them as well. While it may not be politically correct, this is a common thread of straight men being taken aback by how pretty Jimin is in a non-traditionally masculine way. Also, if there's nothing wrong with stating men can have androgynous/'feminine' features and still be secure in their man-ness, why is there always such a pushback to identifying those features?

Isn't there an interview where two members of the group (idk which) were asked which member a fangirl wouldn't want to date and they said Sehun, not because of a problem with his personality but that it was the 'opposite gender'? If they really were outing him that's horrible but like... how do you misinterpret that

Am I the only one who doesn't believe rumors like - at all? Especially about BTS? I've seen some of these "rumors" and "sasaeng" and "~insider~" accounts that are all equally steadfast in asserting their info is correct and they often blatantly contradict each other. Truth is, we won't know unless something is exposed or someone comes forth with credible evidence. Beyond that, all we have to rely on is vibes and behavior that we can see

Yeah when it comes to Yoongi idk whether his lyrics should be ignored but I always interpreted it as a piece of gay bravado and not a confession of bisexuality. You know that meme that's like "ooh you wanna kiss me so bad"? That's how I see his innuendos (at least as part of his Agust D persona) I'm undecided on him but he IS the member who responded that "everyone is equal" to a question of whether they supported the lgbt community and wore those gay little shoes to the pop-up shop a while ago... I also do remember seeing a video from a 2018 fansign where he seems really shy around a fanboy getting autographs but that could have been an isolated incident idk

So basically every piece of analysis done in this thread is moot then, because idols are all playing a character and we can't rely on anything they say or do? Addtly: For those who say BTS especially has no room for independence I'd like to direct you to a bit of this morning's vlive, where Tae laughs in the face of the staff behind the camera as he spoils his mixtape after saying the company didn't want him to