seashells

Just to add like XiaoJun's Dad performs as a female entertainer. Much like a drag queen so he could also just he really comfortable since his Dad frequently dresses as a female.

I think what's missing here is that as someone who has lived in places where it's illegal or deeply frowned upon or the concept of gay doesn't 'exist', in some ways it's easy to fly under the radar of heterosexuals because you don't exist. Like you can hold hands with members of the same sex because everyone does. You can kiss them on the cheek. You can sit with your arm around them but no one would assume you are gay. I lived in places where gender segregation was also a BIG thing so it was really expected that you would always be with your same sex friends unless you were getting married. So therefore if you were actually gay, you were often overlooked or blended in. And while gay didn't exist, they figured if you were "gay" that meant you wanted to be a woman. Which ironically kind of made Trans rights more progressive because the government would pay for it and that it must be true because what man would genuinely want to give up his status as a man to be a woman unless he really is a woman.

I would like to know too because I don't see him queerbaiting at all really? I think his friendships with Taemin, D.O., and lately Mark seem really genuine. Him crying when one of them wins an award doesn't feel like acting. He has always been touchy with the first two especially and it didn't seem like baiting? Like just genuine this is my best friend whom I love dearly and we've been through a lot. He just seems to really keep the people he loves close. I'm not sure what you mean that he does that's "acting gay". Unless you mean how he dresses but I'm pretty sure like stylist mostly put him in crop tops but I'm happy to see crop tops come back for men. They were big in the 90s.

Didn't Doyoung insinuate in some radio show that Taeil and him even had a chat about Taeil's love of Win Win and it didn't sound like on a brotherly since but that Taeil was genuinely confused

Yeah. To me their managers thinking they were dating is pretty intense. And their whole like having to call each other every single say. The thing is though is that I'm not actually confident that Taemin is gay. I think it's a very codependent and intense relationship for sure, but not sure like to what extent.

What about him? He's hard to read. Clearly has some very intense friendships with D.O. and Taemin. I don't think his fling with Jennie was fake though either. Krystal maybe. His public domain persona seems to be like really opposite of his personality though which seems to be very sensitive, reflective, and really shy according to pretty much all accounts.

Plus, Doyoung's brother has played a gay character before. Not only that, Doyoung very much so said with his whole chest that Jaehyun flirts with and has a crush on his brother. And it didn't seem like he was talking about it in a homophobic way but more so in a eww why do you have to like MY BROTHER way. Find some other dude to crush on.

SM is confusing because they also clearly have some of the most out as you can be in a homophobic country idols. And let some of those most likely to be gay idols do a lot of gay things.

They brought in the concept. Ten and WinWin choreographed the whole thing. It was a project that they did on their own.

Are you discounting the post about his interest? I think an interest on queer artist, especially several of them, is valid. Not sure why there's just blatant dismissal based on 'feelings'. I usually feel out of someone is gay by dropping references to gay pop culture or gay interest to see if they pick up on it and 9/10 times it works. I just feel like people are being down right dismissive over OP just because they have a 'feeling'.

To be fair he answered a similar question before and said he hoped they wore boyish clothes so they could share a wardrobe

I thought Yang Yang was talking about Ten on his bed. In other Vlives they constantly bicker bc Ten doesn't like Yang Yang on his bed in his street clothes. This time Ten is now on his bed. I think that was it initially and then it turns to omg when Ten stretches his leg across.

This has already been discussed. Lucas and Jung woo were impersonating each other. You can literally hear Jungwoo. He's also doing a lot of flexing while impersonating Lucas. Joe is it offensive if that's how someone is. The second clip I'm pretty sure he's laughing at something that's happened or was said and happens to be looking down. I'm so tired of shit being taken out of context. Especially these two monents. If Lucas was as homophobic as people paint him to be, I doubt Jungwoo would have called him his best friend and Ten wouldn't be the hyung that he always went to for guidance pre debut. He's heteronormative, but I don't think he's Homophobic.

He did. It's in the behind the scenes video for his Nicki Minaj choreography.

Also let's not forget Ten as a CHILD. He pings even at age like 7. And that was before any type of dance classes.

I think people assume we base someone bring of the LGBT community based on maaerisms and for the people I ping, that's not what I'm most likely to notice. It's their interest. With Ten, it's his standing of Frank Ocean and Troy Sivan. It's him saying that people call him a 'confident guy' when we all know that's not the actual phrase. Like he knows what he's called and acknowledges it. It's him saying stuff like he likes soft and sticky things in his mouth and making suggestive faces towards the camera. It's also the fact that he actively rejects hetero camera fan service and tries to shut it down when Lucas does it. Is him wearing this shirt that had all the queer identities on it at the end of the year stage in 2018. It's him naming the entire WayV project Rainbow V. İt's even the cryptic stuff he said about how the time away from the spotlight really helped him solidify his identity. Everyone knows he constantly lurks Twitter and he's fluent in English so I take that to mean a lot of what he does is on purpose. Not to mention him recommending Call Me By Your name to a fan and recommending songs on the soundtrack. It's the choreographer saying 'let's take it from the top' and Ten pointing to himself and calling himself a top. And yes, soñé of it is his mannerisms. I think it's telling that him and Jung woo both prefer pretty and cute over handsome. I know I'm even missing so much just in this.

I also forgot he said something about if he got a cashier that looked like Taeil, it would totally make his day.

I know Taeil was asked to describe Taeyong he used dainty, must be treated like a princess. Yuta and Doyoung also said something similar but I can't remember what. All of them seemed to have applied pretty so-called or 'traditional' feminine labels to him though.

He also said him and Ten have the same ideal type. I mean, Jungwoo and Jaehyun seriously make him flustered. But he's honestly hard to read and like another poster said, sometimes it could just be like super submissive straight. He seems to have a fetish for being dominated and has repeatedly said he would like the other person to take control.

This is why I try to stay pretty silent. I feel like people keep forgetting how much Heechul has been through this year and the effects that grief can have on a person. Sometimes it can make you latch on even harder to the people you do have left. I know that was what happened for me. I would constantly check in on people to make sure they hadn't died in their sleep. I would have panic attacks if someone didn't tell me they had made it home when they said they would and start picturing their horrible death. I even agreed to relationships that I might would not have if it wasn't out of fear of their imminent death. Long story short, given the circumstances it wouldn't surprise me if it was real--but there are different definitions as to what real means.

This Chen news makes me think that times really are kind of changing. A member of an active boy group, a top idol, is in fact getting married. Although, the backlash is pretty high. But it makes me think that if a top idol was to come out, it would be random and sudden. Like such and such idol has decided to have a commitment ceremony with longterm boyfriend so and so.

I think it's closer to 1 in 10 too. But that's the statistic for the general population. With that said, I do think the arts tend to attract more LGBT people in general. That stereotype exist for a reason. Keiynan Lonsdale (Love, Simon; TheFlash), an out actor in the U.S. originally from Austrailia, talked about how he went to a dance high school and a large majority of the male population WAS gay/bi and yet it was still hard for him to come out despite being in such an open artistic environment

I think I'll watch though. It's just...sad

I want to watch this and I was until I realized one of the actors playing one of the gay characters in this died--most likely by suicide.

Also, ten years ago there was only in drama that had a gay couple/character and that was Life is Beautiful. All the others were boys thinking they might be gay because they fell in love with a girl dressed as a boy. Then we got Reply 1997, which had a gay character even if it was one sided in 2012. There were also quite a few movies that year (Night Flight). That movie is pretty tame in the PDA sense but the violence was intense. I also think K.Will's video came out the same year. Fast forward to 2016, we get the critically acclaimed The Handmaiden. It was through Amazon Studios so it was definitely a studio that also pretty much can do what it wants but still. Now thanks to Web dramas we had several dramas just this year with gay characters as well as some on prime time TV. Netflix being Netflix can basically do whatever it wants and so Korean shows like Love Alarm showed how the app would out gay characters. I think pop culture can do a lot, but I think one of the biggest driving forces in South Korea, like in the United States, is the military. And until some protections are established there, it will be hard to have open male idols due to the mandatory service that all men must serve. I therefore think it would be more likely for a female idol to come out.