Nefertari

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Yeah and it's very fucking ugly when people say homophobic and misogynist shit about the appearance of butches.The association of butches=ugliness is a old homophobic and misogynist propaganda agaisnt this women for not appeal to the male gaze with femininity(beauty stardards, makeup, wearing heels, restricted clothing...) so It would be nice to see a little bit of critical thinking when writing sentences like 'I have always associated butches with ugliness'. (PS: The tomboys that bzz was pointing out is a sub category of the lesbian community in Thailand)

As someone who grew up in a homophobic country similar to Korea I can say that isn't the case most of the time. If you live in a very homophobic, heteronormative country you know for certain that no one would ever suspect anything ever. Maybe gay men have a harder time and tend to repress themselves more, but lesbians and bi girls are pretty much invisible to the world. Once you've come out to yourself, there's a need to find like minded people and what I've noticed is wlw girls leaving hints which are extremely obvious to other wlw girls and unnoticeable to everyone else. I also grew up in a very homophobic country and internet is a mess who changes from country to country and most people (here) don't know english and more than 70 million people do not even have access to internet Also i did pointed out that f/f relationships in a romantic way are pretty much dismissed so i do know that they can go invisible but lesbians who are butch or gnc in general will never go invisible and here they suffer physical and verbal violence and they're not a tiny group. Thinking that a gay person in Korea will necessarily repress/deny their sexuality at all costs is simply wrong. We live in 2017 and even in those homophobic countries, gay people have access to the internet and they experience gay culture as much as everyone else in the world. They may not be out but they won't pretend to be boy crazy so they can hide their sexuality that nobody suspects in the first place. So what I see is the opposite: a gay girl avoiding talking about guys, freely saying how this and that girl/celebrity is pretty, speaking up about gay rights, etc. which is not hiding, really. 1. Not repress or deny or to be boy crazy(i never even see a lesbian being boy crazy for obvious reasons), i say to be more reserved (physical contact mainly i mean). The thing about experience gay culture via internet it depends a lot on which country you are because as I pointed out here, many people do not have access to the internet or if they do not know english so they can talk with other people around the world in forums or other places about same-sex relationships or even in their own language they would not risk looking (Me for example I used to use the browse in the anon mode, and even this way I was afraid that everything was being registering and that my mother would see) Also the thing of talking about gay rights depends on the level of comfort of each individual, how safe they think they are to talk about it, taking into account the abuse (physical, verbal or reputation- aka why we don't see many open celibrities on Korea, the reputation) that can be suffered here is more common to be avoided(The place that i'm from religion is very very strong). Ultimately, you can identify different types of "gay idols" and none of them fit a set criteria, i.e. you can't make a one-size-fits-all list of rules to determine who is gay and who isn't (a thing this thread does a lot). There are a lot of factors to consider: personality, age, company, image, marketing, etc. plus the fact that you will never know the real personality of an idol ever. You're right and i totally agree with this, the last part (the cents one lol) was more to encourage people to demonstrate in a more real sense than ship way of why they think that these women are lesbian without let the part of 'i ship it' speak too loud (In a more realistic way of why they think that girl is a lesbian) 'is this bitch gay or just japanese: Momo' She has such a passional gaze on her team mates lol. - the i fool everyone into thinking im the straightest bitch on the planet by doing extreme fanservice but guess what: Sana Lmao Anyway thank you for your opnion.

This 1/10/25 percent of the world is gay is bullshit, we'll never know how many lgb people exists in the world duo to how our society is build around the world. Many of us will never even come out for those around us, alot of lgb people don't even understand that their feelings towards the same sex is attraction and not admiration or something that they should keep locked away and never talk about it, many of us will never even have the capability to be in a forum or anything like this that talks about sexuality and that might help them, imagine places out the internet , that's just unthinkable, many women grow up even thinking that their lack of attraction for the opposite sex, for their husbands and boyfriends is something common and that they should endure and live with it and have a family and always look happy with all this situation and that's why we end up with stories like "Woman leaves a husband for another woman" 'cause they only find out later that their feelings of affection for other women were more than friendship, or just later they are able to come out of this situation of self-repression that they put themselves to try to convince themselves that they're het and never have to deal with the horrors that our society can offer for those who feel nothing for the opposite sex. So these surveys are always very biased and limited in many aspects and they will never be accurate. They are not capable of representing the statics of a country correctly, much less of the entire world that we live in, where it has a history of systematic repression and oppression with those who have same-sex attraction. In a world that reinforces heterosexuality from childhood and through media (musics, films, series, advertisements and etc) and customs through cultures and even violence and punishment if necessary, there will never be a search even close to being precise about how many people are gay (Especially for lesbians in a world where misogyny is part of the culture and good customs around the world, where women are forced or expected to marriege a male and carry his children, where any romantic feelings a woman might feel for the other is considered as a phase, a game or part of the friendship between girls, where everything that a woman might feel for other woman in a romantic way is always dismissed.) in this world, not even how many are bi. We would need decades and decades of healing about what this society has done and does with people who feel attraction for the same sex; Where people did not expect their newborn to one day fell in love with the opposite sex. Where people did not treat us if microaggressions, physical and verbal violence or restrictive laws around the world. Where people did not treat us as less. Where we could just be without repercussions. lol sorry I went too deep. Also just to put my to cents here i think with someone is a lesbian in a homophobic and conservative society. 1. Would be the girl that we all less suspect We grew up in a homophobic society so many of us when we realize that we feel romantic attraction for the same sex there is a tendency of our part to be more reserved. 2.The one who would be more obvious She would interpret all kinds of affection and feelings that she can feel towards some girl as admiration for that girl. Any interest in either real or fictional women characters that she had she would interpret as "I want to be like her" instead of "I have a crush on her" and this is a horrible case to be because it's very complicated to get out of this mentality and maybe only by having a conversation with another girl who likes girls, she would finally understand that what she feels is not just admiration. Both case are so hard to grow up with. A kind of horrendous repression to grow up with. -Who would be the case 1 and who do you think could be the case 2? -Why? and Examples of why you think so.

https://twitter.com/namopics/status/935461036127383552 Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using OneHallyu mobile app

Yes, I'm more of an observer myself. I don't even think I'm good at expressing what I'm thinking but i do try to be informed about things and look for other points of views, idk. But when i see that people(without intention or malice) don't consider the angles according how in our society things changes from region to region/ country to country or how something regardless of where you are affects worldwide -Like for example homophobia for example still affecting all of us in some way independent of the country that we are from, all countries without exception have shit homophobia and affect us in some way or another but with you're from a country like Canada the way that affects the individual is different than someone who grew up for example in Korea(That might grew up without never understanding that they aren't hetero and with family expectations to one day marry the opposite sex that we know very well), Egypt(Strong influence of religion and laws agaisnt homosexuality, physical violence), Latin America(Strong influence of religion,physical and verbal violence), India(Religion, violence, opposite sex marry is already a fact) Russia(Violence, laws) and yet still affecting you, still might have violent consequences for you, different and in certain way less cruel but YET still being there and still dangerous. Less cruel is not even the right word for what i'm trying to say, homophobia itself exist is itself already an cruelty. (Homophobia affects all of us and is shit but has some differences in the way that the repression is executed from region to region or there is aspects that are even identical or very similar in all or almost all regions[all repression is shit but we need to consider the differences of each region to understand how this system works in each country to learn the best way to combat it and even disassemble it])- and nobody pointing it out yet I feel like I should say something with the info that i have so people can see it and maybe understand a little more about the specific subject that is being say it at the moment? I guess, idk. I don't own the truth of course, there's ALOT of things that i myself don't know, I just try to be informed and even in the process of being informed I can end up learning misinformation i think. I don't know, I think that what i write sounds silly and messy. PS:This is not the comment that i say that i want to say and this probably sounds kind of like, doesn't make sense without the context, sorry. Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using OneHallyu mobile app

Good eye buddy i really didn't see it.Thank you for the warning. Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using OneHallyu mobile app

"lol stay pressed bud" Such an ugly thing to say. What's wrong with some people to think that the suggestion that someone is on the closet and repressing oneself to be a hilarious thing? I would panic and block someone who suggest that i'm not het when it would have consequences in my life(like family, work, friends), when i'm not ready, when everything would abruptly change around me with great possibility of negative consequences.

I love your comments, thank you for put them here . That Thai music that you post I didn't knew yet and the lyrics and the sound of that song are great. Also i couldn't comment because my account was not valid yet so i was glad that you comment on the tomboy culture. Tomboy/dee culture is indeed a sub of lesbian category. Toms do not claim to be men(and don't really want to be one), in fact some well known toms have already said that it is not because of their mannerism, their way of dressing, acting or whether they binding or do top surgery (which we know that some butchs do that too, the binding or the top surgery) that they stop of being a woman. I'm sorry but I really noticed that you really focus on lesbians and you try to be informed about how things are for lesbians in other places I wanted to make a comment with you if it's ok, of course, and that's why I wanted to share a thought that this thread made me have it for a while but i couldn't comment yet with that's ok with you. It's about comments I've seen here that I think that have some misconceptions(misconceptions without bad intentions of course). Can i comment with you with that's okay? PS: Btw, lesbians(where might have bi women interested in a place with only women too) only space are lacking in our world can people not act like a space only for f looking for other f are evil :/.