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Posts posted by Shaandenigma
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I was going to stay out of this, but there are some pretty bad misconceptions about sexual harassment and consent being thrown around that need to be challenged.
The first one that no one else has really addressed specifically is the idea that people can't be harassed by someone they like or get along with i.e. "Winwin says Taeil is one of his best friends so he can't really mind unwanted contact too much." Do you know how many people stay in abusive situations because they legitimately love their abuser and see positive sides to them? It's not like abusers start slapping you around on the first date and then you're trapped. People can be together for years before abuse really ramps up (though there are red flags from the beginning like not respecting personal boundaries or comfort levels when someone says they don't like something). That's part of why it is hard to even admit to the abuse or say something in the first place when it is someone you know and love and otherwise have a fulfilling relationship. Doesn't change that they are violating your boundaries and being harmful towards you.That leads to intent not overriding impact and the fact that you don't need to be aiming to sleep with someone to sexually harass them. If I, gay man, made lewd comments about co-worker's boobs as a joke all the time and they were uncomfortable, they could report me for sexual harassment despite me having 0 intent to sleep or flirt with them. Just making dirty jokes and innuendo, or comments about one's dating life can get you written up for sexual harassment even if you are just playing around. Intent matters in regards to the extent of consequences and how people would feel about the offender as a person.
The last point, is that consent is not a one time thing and where you may be fine with something certain times, doesn't mean you are fine with it all the time. And that doesn't make you a tease or that you are sending mixed signals either.I don't think anyone has to condemn Taeil or project all sorts of stuff onto Winwin, but we can disagree about interpretations of things without redefining and explaining away blatant examples of a person having their explicitly stated boundaries being knowingly crossed. It just really reinforces all the ideas that make it hard for people who have been harassed or assaulted by people they know to recognize it when it happens and to even say or do something about it.
Absolutely right most of what's posted is flimsy evidence at best, and 99% of the time these fans have no idea the people's relationships etc behind closed doors or what actions etc those people involved wish to take, as i said before this guy doesn't need you blowing up his situation or doing it for him. And to the person who said SM wouldn't do anything if he went to HR is an idiot do you know how screwed they'd be if they were sued for such? And if it was revealed the HR willingly ignore its own employees that would end SM ent not just because of regular staff leaving or protests but Also massive class action lawsuits and the image tanking investors would pull out plus this would have a darker impact on the company, it wasn't a full year ago that agency had employees commit suicide, now let that sink in if they ignored that, losing an idol costs more money than dealing with whatever problem so yeah HR would listen to them.
SM has been involved in several high profile lawsuits over the last decade involving mistreatment of idols and contract disputes, some of which are still ongoing and they are still the top company. People are not just pulling this idea out of thin air.
ave you actually worked in a corporate enviornment? Because this stuff happens regularly and doesn't always go in the victim's favor. Hell this even happens in schools. Idols and recording artists in general are not even employees, more like contractors, of their companies and labels, because the companies and labels are providing the artist a service (promoting them and facilitating them the resources to produce their craft) in exchange for exclusivity and rights to work and a cut of the proceeds. They don't get a salary or employee benefits. They are not covered by HR. Any problems they have with the company would be handled through the legal department. That's why idols who are in dispute with their companies always have legal representation and they end up going to court or some form of legal mediation.
Even still, HR department are only as good as the company they are in and really work towards what is in the best interest of the company and not really the employee if those interests are opposed to each other. Look at all those MeToo cases in the entertainment industry like the Kevin Spacey case. All the people in charge of House of Cards knew about him harassing that PA, other people even reported his behavior on the PAs behalf, from the first season and he was the star of that show until he became a liability. Otherwise they brushed it under the rug and just moved the PA around so Spacey couldn't get near him. Why didn't they reprimand or issue any real consequences to Spacey even though he was a well documented creep? Because he brought the star power and money and that PA didn't. This dynamic is not unique to the entertainment industry.
Now I know that is beside the point to be speculating about HR and what SM would or wouldn't do in this situation, but I only bring it up counter the idea that what Taeil did wouldn't count as sexual harassment because if it was Winwin would have reported it. What people have been saying are not speculations about this specific case but are offering counter explanations that debunk that idea.
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Most of you guys don't stan nugus and therefore are not familiar with VAV, however they have a member called ZIU that has been suspicious and this video with Edgard Avila confirmed that he just can't be straight :
I like VAV, I only really got vibes from Ace and Baron though when I went digging through their content and just chalked up Ziu's antics to being the maknae. The video with Ghostface Skeezila is somewhat illuminating though unfortunate that they have to hang around him to gain some relevance.
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My "receipts" comment was facetious and more towards the part of the post about how these idols feel about their sexualities and not the orientations. And who asked for a thesis? Literally all you have to say is what about them pinged your gaydar, you know those subtle clues you read? Using your keen observation skills? If you are so right and accurate all the time if somebody asks a simple why do you think that, you can just answer the question or not instead of getting sanctimonious about it.
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Um, this thread has always had the standard of backing up claims with some sort of examples, not just hunches or vibes. It's fine to say you think some one is non-het on a hunch, but say "I don't really have anything to go on." I've done it and no one has ever said anything. There are also certain idols, like Taeyong, have popular opinions formed about them based on actual behaviors and things they said. I was one of the early people who thought Taeyong was gay when the popular opinion was that he was a straight fuckboi. But after a series of instances like the interviews cited earlier, clips of him demonstrating attraction to men, etc., more people changed their minds. Then you have other people who have full on dedicated analyses and compilations of things they said and did that support the idea of them not being straight that have been repeated ad nauseum. So when someone decides to offer up a contrary opinion for one of those people that there is a strong case for them to indeed be non-het, and all they are basing it on is a feeling, people are understandbly going to be skeptical and want to know what the idol in question has done that would go against the mountain of instances that says otherwise.
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LOL you're not alone. It's his opinion tho, so let him be.
I personally have different thought about some people on his list- I forgot to mention about Sehun too.
Imo Sehun is totally gay, hahaha. But if someone thinks Sehun is Bi and lovin it, that's ok too.
Maybe they think they see something that makes Sehun seems more like a bi?
I mean, I did it with Taeyong, and some people say he's totally gay. So what. Live and let live.
We never know unless they come out anyway.
It's not unreasonable to ask how someone came to a conclusion and part of having a discussion is having an exchange of ideas which also includes disagreement. Just because I disagree and want to know how they came to form an opinion is not stopping them from having it or expressing it or that it's not okay.
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Defs gay, it’s so obvious: Jo Kwon, Eric Nam, Kevin (U-Kiss), Heechul, Daehwi, Ren, Taemin, Key, Jaejoong, Gongchan, Sungjong
Gay, but not as obvious: BamBam, Yunho (TVXQ), Changmin (TVXQ), Minho (Shinee), Jin, Cha Eunwoo, Jinyoung (B1A4), Suho, D.O., Lee Hongki, Jinu (Winner), Hoya, Ryeowook
Gay, and struggling to accept themselves: V, Baro, Jota (Madtown), Baekho, L, Wooyoung, JB, Wonpil, Song (iKon), Leeteuk, Jihoon (WannaOne)
Bisexual, and loving it: Lee Joon, Sehun, Baekhyun, Sungjae, Jae (Day6), Yesung, Jisung (WannaOne)
Bisexual, and they hate it: RM, Daesung, Sanha
Just living life, if I like you, then I like you: Suga, Jungkook, JR (Nu’est), G-Dragon, Xuimin, Moos, Jinyoung (Got7), Eunhyuk
Straight, but would be down to try things: Jimin (BTS), Taecyeon, Doojoon, Jay Park, Jackson, Donghae, Kang Daniel, J-Hope
Hella straight, but low key would go in on a guy: Siwon, Bae Jinyoung, Taeyang
Hella straight, and would not do anything with the same sex: Everyone else.
What?
As a gay man, as someone who has many gay friends, and as someone who has many gay friends who have hooked up with people in South Korea, I have pretty credible sources.
Assuming that idols are just like any other human being, how I came to list them as is, is based off of my experiences with people in my community.
Bisexual and they hate it - the fact that they even think the same sex is attracted literally eats up there soul. They don’t necessarily understand the culture and significance of this “abnormality†and so they beat themselves up for being a part of the community.
Gay but struggling - This is something called internalized homophobia. This is when someone is gay but in total denial because they are so extremely ashamed of being gay. They beat themselves up for being gay and work towards proving themselves as straight men. Usually, all gays who come from conservative homes and families start out in this category. Then we adventure out into the world and either find love OR even more more hate.
Hella straight but low key would go in on a guy - Y’all don’t understand how interesting this category is. There are a number of men out there who have weird ass fetishes. One of these fetishes is having sexual interaction with boys. I’ve had many friends hook up with guys who are hella straight, they’d have a wife and kids, yet would still hook up with them. It’s so crazy. This is what this category is.
The LGBT+ culture is so broad and if you’re not a part of it, you have no right to say what is and isn’t right or wrong. Being LGBT+ is not just having skinship with another guy, I laugh so hard at these type of comments.
WHAT???
How is any of this any sort of basis to jump to the conlusion that Sehun of all people is "bi and LOVING it." What are these sources, where are the receipts?
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In regards to SF9 they are a hard group to get a read on but I would say Rowoon, Taeyang, and Hwiyoung are most likely to me. I thought the comments around HwiTae sharing a room in their dorm (a room so small their beds are pushed together) on this episode of Guesthouse daughters was super sus (8:56):
Rowoon is someone who really pings when you watch closely. He has a legion of fanboys he gets flustered by, has some hmmm mannerisms, and stays on top of Chani in a way that seems more than a hyung just doting on the maknae of the group. If you search for their interactions, you will find A LOT of pics and stuff that are basically this (spoilering because the image is super big):

I'm sharing this video for the first 10 seconds of like 5 different shots of Rowoon sniffing/kissing the back of Chani's head which is the type of stuff I'm talking about that isn't just fanservice skinship:
Overall though, there isn't anything particularly damning about SF9 out there as of yet, but those 3 really ping to me and then Youngbin somewhat.-
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https://instagram.com/p/3K1-OXIJS4/
The caption:

'Tis all.
EDIT: For those who don't know, glorypath is Ren's instagram account to which he posted a picture of he and JR and this caption from his icon, Lady Gaga's You and I.-
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The Gayz.
Gays: Younghoon, Q, New, Kevin, Jacob, Eric
Younghoon and Q seemed to have a fling and both of them are pretty gay, especially Younghoon. He's living his gay life surrounded by flower boys. New is pretty gay too and there's some sort of cute gay love triangle going on between him, Q and Younghoon. Kevin has openly admitted to watching gay Youtubers, said Pharrell is the love of his life and is generally a huge Beyonce fanboy. Jacob pings pretty hard too. Eric has a not so subtle crush on Juyeon and has gay mannerisms, speech, etc. He has a rainbow sticker on his laptop and likes to talk about how he used to dress up as a princess for Halloween and how pink is his favorite color, etc. He's definitely not het. Haknyeon is a bit sus too.
You're welcome. For disclosure I was requested to post this video on yggdrasil's behalf. I'm not submitting this as a hard receipt:
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I think its hilarious that Baekho has never
Unless I bring him up,popped up in this thread. I get gay and bisexual vibes from him, although not as often as I did when they were younger.He's popped up before, but I think he's atleast bi too. His "friendship" with Bumzu is very suspect, especially after that interview they did together about how they work and spend their time together. I'll have to find it again.
EDIT: Found it
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I don't know, I feel by the same token has Donghun done anything remotely hetero? I've never heard him say anything about a woman in real nor theoretical terms.
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do you think he actually likes jun (or they have a thing) then, or is he just teasing or something? like when he flirts and how he acts in the things you added to the edit
I think he does have an actual attraction to Jun that could likely be mutual but I don't know if it's ever been acted upon. Donghun likes to tease and playfully drag everyone especially Jun but he's also very affectionate usually right after and initiates a lot of skinship with him and they lace fingers a lot subconsciously. ACE overall is a very affectionate and close group that really likes each other, but Wowkwan and DongJun interactions in particular come off as being not strictly platonic. Wowkwan is more blatant than DongJun, but there are plenty of suspicious receipts for DongJun.
The other thing about ACE is that they had been trainees at other companies together before the CEO of Beat assembled them when she left the company she worked for (probably CJ E&M) and started her own, so they had known each other for a few years prior to forming the group, at least Donghun and Jun did. So they've had time in a non-group situation to develop something if there is anything.
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What do people think of donghun and chan though? Initially I thought they were both straight but reading this thread has made me question that a lot
I definitely think Donghun is gay, he pinged me right away when I first got into them, it's his demeanor, the way he flirts a lot with Jun masked as some Tom and Jerry dynamic, his personality and interests remind me a lot of Key. He also really encourages Wowkwan's antics and when that one fan commented that he a Jun should get married he started singing "marry me" and was very into the idea. He's more subdued so gets overshadowed personality wise by everyone else, but I think if you put aside the actual couple Wowkwan, he's like the most obviously gay one to me.
Chan is the least suspect one to me, I feel like he has more sus moments in UNB, but he could be anything and I wouldn't be surprised. He's very energetic and has a bright personality and really only shows that side of himself so I can never really read his interactions beyond that.
Editing to add these:


And this:
https://twitter.com/kimchaewon_48/status/1018505702761828353
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Jun is the leader of the group and this is like all their last shot at success since they aren't that young and have each all been at other companies previous to Beat of which they are the only group, and it is BROKE. They got a lot of crap for their hot pants and like Wowkwan has a very real possibility of being an actual couple the way they act, so I understand when he tries to make things less gay, but it is not all the time, and is usually like a half-hearted attempt so to me he's never seemed uncomfortable. This may be a shippy vid but it does highlight some interactions involving Jun being pretty affectionate with Donghun especially from 3:48 on and his response to the suggestion from a fan comment saying he and Donghun should get married:
Also this is a s/n: but if people were on the Discord and are curious about what happened to it you can PM me because I don't want to get into on here. But yeah, it was deleted so we didn't purge anyone off.-
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wasnt it jun who ¿¿kinda?? outed one of the unit members? or am i getting them confused ? he seemed pretty grossed out about that too
He did an interview thing where he mentioned that Rayoon from MVP had kissed him when they were going to bed in the dorms and he was flurstered, but he also said after the show Rayoon is one of his closest friends so I don't know the idea that he's grossed out by male on male interactions comes from when he is always affectioinate with guys all the time.

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Backreading about ACE but Jun is pretty gay too (seriously there is a case for that whole group being gay) so he isn't actually grossed out. But lately they've been trying to downplay Wowkwan because those two are very obvious and the group is getting more attention now so they either up the skinship with everyone to normalize how they behave and throw in some no homo moments. But it's usually only Jun as a leader and it is usually half-hearted.
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I don't have access to the Discord server any more. Anyone else with the same problem?
It was deleted
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Just passing by to say if there are any gays who were still interested in the Discord server, you can PM me for the link. I will be more diligent in checking my PMs since I'm on here less frequently than I used to.
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Hi everyone. I mostly post on the gay thread, but I'm one of the mods on the LGBT Discord server we setup and if anyone is interested in joining, here is the link:
https://discord.gg/YywbEnrJust follow the directions on the Introductions channel.
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Hi everyone. I'm one of the mods on the LGBT Discord server we setup and here is the link:
https://discord.gg/YywbEnrJust follow the instructions on the Introductions channel.
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no one in this thread can disprove Surene and Suzy + RM they just wanna believe their delusional gay ships, tragic
Speaking of delusional...
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Cuz he is a fuckboi lol open ur eyes
Why are you still on this? That "evidence" was weak.
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That thread is " which male idols is gay" so it's mostly about gay things done by idols.
Yes it is...things are really getting lost in translation because that's not what I'm arguing.
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Those are different situation, but Im sure that if it was Jungwoo and Ten doing valse/tango, nobody would neg.
and everyone would be like "Oh gay legend together!!!" Let's be honest.
I also don't think standing next to other is a better proof than doing tango. Both aren't better than other
The difference is that no one would post Ten and Jungwoo doing a tango as proof of either being gay because they have evidence and are widely believed to be gay on their own. The tango video was negged because of the history of those posts being posted to prove a ship. Not everything in here is "evidence" or trying to prove anything. It is a catchall gay thread.
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Which male idols do you think are gay?
in Celebrity News & Gossip
Posted
I think the fact that this is pushed as their ship dynamic is why calling it out as harassment is so controversial and people don't know what to really make of it. It is truly bizarre that these interactions are pushed by the company (since this stuff happens in official content) and is spun as being cute like Taeil is entitled to do whatever he wants because he "loves" Winwin and finds him adorable and Winwin is denying him or is now homophobic for not wanting someone up in his personal space 24/7. It's really gross and reinforces so many toxic ideas about relationships.