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Shaandenigma

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  1. But the story is moving along in the direction of more conflict which ups the stakes and makes for better TV. Changmin, the most desirable man, chose to call Jeonghyeon who has not gotten a single other call up to this point. This gives Jeonghyeon a boost of confidence. Then after this, Changmin gets a call from Hyeokjun, the first guy he called who has called him twice. So now he conflicted because he has two guys he feels a connection to, and another guy he probably has no interest in (Seonyul) that his friend likes that he has to figure out how to turn down. And now they are gonna compete for the chance to rearrange the rooms and no one has any reason to keep them as they are. Also, people weren't confined to their rooms for this round of calls and are finding out who called who. But when it comes out that Hyeokjun called Changmin again, that's going to cause a lot of friction with like half the house. I also have a strong hunch Changyu and Jeongho will get closer based on the one promo photo of them together and what happened last ep. So I'm excited to see what goes down this week! I do find this only being a week odd especially when they aren't like totally secluded away. They probably didn't have the budget to film longer than that though especially for what would be a controversial show. But I don't necessarily want the guys to be manipulated into relationships that make for good TV. I just wish they were given more things to do that prompted more conversation or doing things together. Or if they casted more outgoing and proactive personalities, lol.
  2. Now having seen the full episode, I have a lot more thoughts about the show and its players. The Hyeokjun fixation makes sense because he's been on the most dates with different guys. All the calls he's gotten have been from guys who went on dates with him. He and Changmin had that date before they got to the house which is why they called each other the first night. Eunchan had eyes on him from the beginning and then asked him on a date that went well from his vantage point so he's continuing to pursue the guy he likes who hasn't shot him down. Hyeon also went on the most spectacular date in terms of activity with Hyeokjun that went well and hasn't been given any indication that Hyeokjun doesn't like him. So those two consistently calling him is reasonable. And Hyeokjun deciding to call Changmin after evaluating his other connections is also reasonable. Considering how clean-cut and vanilla Hyeokjun is in his presentation and how he carries himself, I think aesthetic and personality-wise, Changmin would be the most compatible total package for what he's probably looking for. Now when I look at who called Changmin, only one sticks out as being frustrating and that's Seonyul. Jeongho gets a pass because he just got there, spent the entire day with Eunchan which was awkward and has nothing else to go off of for the others except appearances. Hyeokjun did have meaningful interaction with him and did get a call from him. Jeonghyeon and him have the deepest connection so far built from being the pair that spends the most time together talking to each other. But what has happened between Seonyul and Changmin for the former to even think he has a shot at this stage? Changmin has never called him. They haven't been on a date. The one interaction he thinks they had was him trying to flirt with Changmin while they were in the kitchen, and Changmin brushing it off to focus on Jeonghyeon. He's thinking that if he has the chance to properly shoot his shot something can happen there. And what makes it more aggravating is that he's trying to ward off Changyu so that he looks available to Changmin, but is also still stringing him along to have as a fallback. He just really irks me now to the point that I want Changyu to just drop it and move on. I hope he and Jeongho bond over not getting calls and become a thing. I also don't like the BL-fan segment of the audience trying to turn Changmin into a fuqboi now just because like 4 different guys are interested in and he doesn't know what to do about it. For one, it's literally only been 3 days in the show, no one is in love yet. Infatuated, yes, but not in love. Second, he can't help that other people find him attractive for being handsome, nice, and polite. He's not responsible for other people's choices. I also don't think he's conflicted as much as he feels super awkward having people really into him when he's into someone else. The way people think he could be questioning his connection to Jeonghyeon when he threw himself onto Jeonghyeon's spot on Jeonghyeon's bed for each call he answered while making the most confident call to Jeonghyeon is just mind-boggling. I can't settle on what the producers' intentions were beyond just documenting how gay men date in reality because sometimes they are very hands-off where it feels like the guys are aimless and wasting time doing nothing. But then they do things to like the room swap next episode to stir things up like they really want couples to come out of the show. On the one hand as someone who watches a lot of other reality dating shows, it's refreshing to watch something that doesn't feel orchestrated to create the most drama and "storylines." But I also feel like at times no one is actually dating or trying to build a romantic connection with how they are able to retreat away and not interact with the people they like despite that they are all living under the same roof with a bunch of free time.
  3. As annoying as the Changmin obsession is, it's incredibly realistic that when left to their own devices, people would gravitate towards him since he's the most conventionally masculine and any gay man trying to date knows how prized masculine-presenting and straight-passing men are. I think the producers could have done a better job in structuring the show in such a way to force them to have to intermingle more with each other at least the first few days then let them gravitate towards who they have a connection with. Like I feel people keep trying it with Changmin even though he's clearly only interested in Jeonghyeon at this point because they haven't had the opportunity to have a date with him. It would also help the guys the others look over have an opportunity to challenge first impressions. I also think it would just help them have more interactions overall rather than just sitting in a room together scrolling their phones and getting in their own heads.
  4. It's also worth pointing out that the Jongro area he mentions his friends were has a concentration of gay bars and gay-friendly businesses catering to and mostly frequented by Korean nationals. So odds are the idol in question probably felt more relaxed to be more "obviously" gay. Also obvious doesn't have to mean "loud and flamboyant." You can have a reserved and quiet personality and still be very much not straight and carry yourself in an obviously gay manner in other ways. I find the way Kyungsoo interacts with his actor hyungs and basks in the attention he gets from older men very telling. But some people ignore that because he doesn't act like he wants to smash his band mates and loves R&B.
  5. When y'all said Irene I (as most others) was thinking Red Velvet Irene and was just like, chile please
  6. I wasn't implying that he was talking about a boy and just being careful to switch the gender. The whole scenario just sounds made up like it was embellished to be more interesting than it was in reality. I don't have much of an opinion on him I was just saying that if I were to dig into anything it would be the careful delivery of the story where he wouldn’t be so blasé to just say he was open to meeting both men and women romantically. I think it's pretty obvious the platonically was implied at least for men just by the way everyone just rolled with the clarification.
  7. The Eunwoo video, lol. Threads surprisingly hard to follow when no one is fighting
  8. I honestly find the long pauses and the way he told the story about the crush more suspect than the use of slang. He was choosing his words a little too carefully to explain some elementary school crush.
  9. They've been around like 3 years and this is their 4th queer concept. 'libid0' and Instinct Pt. 1 was the first that was explicitly about mlm desire, then their last comeback 'skinz' and Instinct Pt. 2 was a continuation. In those projects the members were coupled off (well there was a throuple but a member left the group after Libid0) and KB and Yoojung (the blonde) are one of the couples. They are releasing solo projects where Yoojung's started the storyline in 'begin' about the beginning of their relationship and this is the continuation. Jaden Jeong who was the creative director/producer for Loona and created the Loonaverse is behind this group and it's speculated he's gay. Like Loona videos and content, the video descriptions detail the concepts and they are explicit that they have queer plot lines. So it's not queerbaiting. And while KyuJung are sus behind the scenes, they are a canonical couple for the project storyline and really didn't get hardcore shipped until after libid0 so the fanservice line is blurry. Anyway, stan them because they have good music and feed the gays everytime.
  10. I recently moved to a new city and started going to gay bars and be active on apps again to meet people, and the Woongis are truly in the minority. It's predominantly very masculine, straight-passing men who may get a little butch queen after a couple of drinks. But would go unnoticed walking down the street or in most casual interactions. Part of it is due to femmephobia and the idolization of masculinity, part of it is that it's easier to be out with your partner when you can both pass as two straight buds hanging out to the general onlooker. There's a reason everyone was calling Changmin and Jeonghyeon and Changyu got zero.
  11. I haven't seen Merry Queer yet, but I thought one half of one of the couples was trans?
  12. Eunchan trained to be an idol for 7 years and almost debuted in a nugu group, Aweek (he was going by Ilkwon), too. I was surprised he said it directly in the show and they showed clips from the lives and stuff he was in. Jeonghyeon was also a dancer until he got injured and is now a hairdresser/stylist. At any rate, it just confirms what we already know about LGBT people being in the industry. I have a pretty good gaydar and I wouldn’t have clocked Changmin. He doesn’t even get gayer when in a group of only gay men. But after watching this clip the producers posted on their YT it makes a lot of sense. He only went on the dating show to appease his family who couldn't figure out why he didn't have a girlfriend and didn't seem interested in having one. Now, if this regular person went to the lengths of appearing on a Mnet dating show to stay closeted, what lengths would a celebrity whose coming out would be an international headline go to? We need to remember that being queer is also a sociopolitical identity that goes beyond who you are attracted to. There are major costs socially, politically, and economically that need to be weighed for anyone when choosing to come out or not. Like it's no coincidence that everyone appearing on that show has a job where they are essentially self-employed or in Eunchan's case, working in a professional field (branding and fashion retail) where a lot of prominent gay people are present. Because otherwise they could lose their job and a whole lot of other avenues to making a living. It's why it's so aggravating when people, like she who must not be named, act like there isn't a host of good reasons for someone to claim to be straight when their behavior and other statements suggest otherwise. It's just so obtuse lol.
  13. To expand more on the gaydar piece, the flipside is also being very attuned to how straight people act and think not just to be able to differentiate but also to emulate and pass as straight when needed. Part of it is just natural because queer men are socialized from the womb to be cishet according to the norms of the dominant culture. Some people could just never conform to that and become the "obvious" gays, but the bar is so low for people to think you are straight, most can easily evade suspicion by just tweaking their behavior a little or just giving the "right" answers to questions. Sometimes people here act like gay people are incapable of lying or cultivating a straight-passing image to protect themselves. They also don't give idols the credit of being savvy enough to know how their own culture and fans operate and to leverage that to remain closeted if they aren't straight.
  14. I'm watching His Man and it struck me how if some of these guys got posted on this thread without the knowledge that they were gay, a lot of people would have been out here declaring half of them were just "soooooo obviously straight" lol. That's what I like about the show, there is a wide variety in personality type with Hyeon and Jeonghyeon being the most effeminate ones and even Jeonghyeon isn't that flamboyant, he's more cool and chic. There are a lot of idols that people here can not remotely imagine them not being interested in women, who act and carry themselves exactly like the guys on that show . There's even a former idol trainee on the show which hasn't been brought up here. It's funny how sometimes people get on their performative wokeness high horse about not judging people based on stereotypes, yet when a non-stereotypical idol gets brought up, there's no way in hell they aren't attracted to women. It's so hypocritical and clocks the people who really just don't know or engage in the queer community and don't see the breadth of the different types of queer man when it comes to personality. Finally someone else who feels me on Jacob not being straight.
  15. I've been watching some Cravity stuff lately and I just want to know what is the hetero explanation for this:
  16. I have a lot of thoughts on Bosungjun so get ready, lol. That's my rambling Bosungjun rant for the day, lol.
  17. Quoting this for the record and for you to come back to and repeat as a mantra everytime you feel the urge to write a 10k word diatribe on this man.
  18. @mEeEeE I've already explained how many different ways what my problem with your posts are. So please spare the thread and do not continue. And do not tag me in another one of your tirades. If you must continue this go around, just message me and I'll get to it if I feel like it. Thanks. ----- Going back to other recent posts I have thoughts on. RE the reality shows and PANN comments: internet discourse is not always a reflection of the sentiments of a community, especially comment sections where generally only those with the strongest feelings will leave them and it's often negative comments that will take up more space than positive ones. I think the fact that they are making the shows and people are willing to appear on them is a good sign. Like the West has barely done gay dating shows (and a lot of them have been flops, looking at you Prince Charming) despite so many Western countries having same-sex marriage. So the fact that Korean production companies are investing to turn out not only so many BL adaptations but reality based programming like this is encouraging. Personally wish Mango Couple was on the one showing couples, but Pack ended up on some travel show plus they have less followers than Bosungjun. In CIX, Hyunsuk, Seunghun, and Yonghee ping to me. I don't know what to make of Jinyoung. Sometimes I can see it, but other times I feel like he just finds male attention flattering and there is nothing else to it. Also seeing @shineestan's Jacob reminded me that I said here once that as a church gay, he gave me repressed church gay vibes. I'll strike off the repressed part but I don't get a straight vibe from him.
  19. @mEeEeE I was ignoring this at first but then you tagged me so here we are. Can't disagree with this part, though your journey here was... something, lol. Look, I know I come off as a bitch in most of my posts lately. But what I said is the truth: you do not know this man (he is NOT babie) and will never fully understand who he is, so there is no need to put yourself through all this anguish trying to figure him out. And I only "have a go" at your posts not because they draw conclusions I may disagree with (I actually don't disagree with most of them except Taeyong being remotely interested in women), but because your reasoning is rooted in ignorance which leads to you making some very problematic if not outright offensive statements, and I can't just scroll over them like they're harmless. It's really uncomfortable, on multiple levels, how often you cast whoever you're analyzing as a sex fiend deviant then gauge the likelihood they could be gay on which gender they would sexually harass or not. First, Taeyong was perving on every man he interacted with when you thought he was gay. Then, he was perving on the women he was judging on a TV show when you doubted he was gay. Let's not forget the "he's not gay, he's autistic" moment. Now, you're infantilizing a 27 year old in order to make him fit the Sexuality of the Week. I can't even write you off entirely as a delusional troll because anything non-NCT related, you speak with common sense and like you are of sound mind. But there's something about Taeyong and NCT that makes all good sense go out the window and it's seriously unhealthy. You should seriuosly consider taking a detox of all things Taeyong and Taeyong-adjacent. If you have to purge all those thoughts by getting them out, consider journaling instead of posting here and save everyone but most importantly yourself the aggravation. You can also fill your time educating yourself on the experiences of queer people (or read up on human sexuality in general from peer-reviewed sources). Just watching gay Korean Youtube channels like Mango Couple would go a long way in helping you have some real knowledge of queer people and cultural context to ground your analysis if you must continue on that quest.
  20. People say different idols are bi here all the time with zero pushback, so that is not the problem. The issue is the evidence in these cases are not indicative of anything. And hello, people dragged you for the same reaches when you posted the same type of content arguing that Taeyong was GAY. There isn't a double standard here and trying to hide behind bi-erasure as why people aren't hearing you out is weak. You see, the thread is not about figuring out an idol's actual sexuality because you cannot definitively know someone's sexuality UNLESS THEY TELL YOU. You can look at every shred of evidence you want, but until they say something from their own mouths, whether they are straight, gay, bi, whatever will never be confirmed as a fact. And even if the threads purpose was to build a case, like Optimus said, opposite-sex attraction is the default until proven otherwise. All you need to "prove" is that there is a same-sex attraction, a process that queer people are WELL acquainted with because we have to do this shit all the time. We don't need to be reminded to consider that opposite-sex attraction exists and to be "open to it." Like it takes a lot more consideration and evaluation to firmly believe someone has a same-sex attraction versus the opposite. Oh girl, no you do not. You have literally have never met him. All you know of him are the sides you are allowed to see. And that is perfectly fine because he does not owe you or me or any of us full access and knowledge of his life. You do not need to understand this man and his sex life. Follow Big Freedia's advice and release the fixation. Find a new foundation. Even in the year of Lord 2022, closeted gay men around the world are marrying women, naturally conceiving children with them, raising those children, then coming out. Or they never come out and lead a double life. So if they can do all that to maintain a hetero facade, then yes they can fake a reaction for a televised stage performance. Or it could have been a real reaction because anyone is capable of recognizing that something is sexy while it also not being something they are personally attracted to. He also could have just been paying attention and reacting to the guy. Been there and done that.
  21. Just wanted to say I appreciate how kind and generous you are in your interactions here. Glad someone can do it because it couldn't be me, lol. @Taebear @mEeEeE Go outside, touch some grass, breathe some fresh air, listen to the birds, and reflect on why you are letting these dudes live rent free in your mind. Don't let anyone have you out here in these streets looking crazy.
  22. @Taebear Girl, this is not a courtroom. Bias is irrelevant because this thread is not determining for the record anyone's sexuality. This is a thread where people share their speculations (which literally means theories or conjectures formed without firm evidence) about the male idols they think are attracted to men. It is not biased to only focus on that question because that is the topic and purpose of the thread. Second, no one is ignoring anyone's interactions with women. It's just that most often these "interactions" don't indicate anything about anyone's sexuality so they don't need to be considered. Most of the videos are fan edits where the creator is selectively cutting and zooming in to get the viewer to come to a pre-drawn conclusion they have set them up to believe. I've also called out gay shipping vids posted here for the same reason so I'm not biased. Just ask Meeeee, lol. I'm also generally frustrated by the trend of the thread becoming the place folks both straight and not, come to defend their faves access to hetero privilege while trying to narrowly define queerness as fitting into some twink femme queen aesthetic. It's very telling too that the idols people want to go hard on defending their straightness happen to be the visuals with a lot of gf stans. Kevin, for example, has never demonstrated or hinted at finding a man attractive. His only sus interactions are with Jacob, the other half of his lone ship, and for many here that doesn't count as a legitimate receipt. Despite that, no one ever tries to claim Kevin is anything but gay, and base that conclusion solely on the media content he consumes and recommends. He also happens to be one of the less popular members and not considered one of the group's visuals. Meanwhile, Taehyung--one of the most popular idols and considered a visual with appeal to a straight female audience--also consumes a lot of queer content on top of having significantly more suspect interactions with a range of men outside of his group. And yet, any assertion he's gay never goes unchallenged with the same argument playing out on a daily basis. A lot of these adamant arguments for his bisexuality are reaches that boil down to "no way is this desirable man not available to women." Disclaimer: I do not care about Taehyung's sexuality and have zero interest in debating the matter because again. I. Do. Not. Care. I am just citing him as a prominent, but not the only, example of this phenomenon. It also should be noted that this rationale does not apply to all arguments people make. But a good majority are serving "I can't have a crush on a gay man so he must be into women in some way" teas.
  23. Yes, it is. They could have stayed lurking with that mess. ----------------- Really, anyone who is going to post clips of an idol just sitting and watching a performance at an award show/competition they are judging/music show as some sort of "proof" of their "attraction" to any gender, save your time and my bandwidth and keep it moving. People readily dimiss posts here with way more substance if the implication is that the person in question isn't straight, but then turn around and act like a man will only ever look at a woman because he wants to smash her. Apparently male idols can't have the basic respect for their female peers to pay attention when they perform and appreciate their skills unless there is some purient motive behind it. It's actually a drag of your faves to argue "he can't be a icky homosexual because he perves over the women he works with in professional settings!" and the fact some of y'all really can't see that is... something. The thread really needs to go back to the days when people just brought up the people they thought were gay like the title says with the understanding that ones you don't talk about you either have no opinion on or think are straight, with zero analysis of how you came to that conclusion. Also don't see the point in updating people on who you now think is straight because you spent more time over--rethinking the same receipts you thought made them gay yesterday. Just go make another thread for "Idols commonly speculated as gay on the gay thread but you think are straight" and throw the dissertations and highly-edited-to-push-a-specific-narrative shipping videos over there.
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